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Munster v Ulster URC round 7 Match thread

Akrasia

The clash of the ~~Titans~~ whoever's available to play and medical jokers

Teams will be announced at 12pm

Kickoff in Limerick, Saturday at 17:15 (Limerick time)

Stakes are high for Munster with qualification for Europe in 2023/24 on the balance (proper Europe, not Connacht Europe)

A severely depleted Munster side will take on a severely dehydrated Ulster team on a severely overhydrated Thomond park

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CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814864#Comment_119814864

It's been a long time since I looked at the detail of Munster tickets. I'm fairly sure it used to be Leinster, Ulster and Heineken Cup Group stage games in a more expensive bracket than the rest of the league. That was a long long time ago though.

I think Munster should be aiming to sell out with Leinster if both teams have a decent squad and aiming for 20k+ for Ulster.

As I said with the teams out the interpro wasn't anything special so poorer attendance is to be expected.

It's imo disappointing that the second most attractive game of the season got such a poor slot. That said its understandable as both teams were similarly effected by international call ups.

Regarding your point about % of city population that's true but Munster needs to be more of a province rather than Limerick city rfc. Not sure how to do that though.

For the record I'm willing to condemn Leinster management too. They need to take steps to draw in casual fans for "lesser" games. A stadium that has drawn most season ticket holders and is practically empty otherwise shouldn't be acceptable.

antietam1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119814864#Comment_119814864

One thing I would add that watching teams shorn of up to 16 internationals is not great. no matter how much young talent is on display.

Aloof why mention the cities population? the support is multi province for Munster.

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815229#Comment_119815229

Leinster is in the same category as the HC games. Ulster had always been a normally priced game. Munster have never really sold 20k plus tickets for anything other than Leinster and the HC. 15-16k is about normal for Ulster or Connacht.

I do find it amazing that Munster attendences are always questioned. Ulster failed to sell their 18k stadium out for either Connacht or Leinster this season or either of the two games against Munster last season, yet nobody ever mentions it.

CatFromHue

A sell out in Thomond is a big ask.

Before the redevelopment its capacity was around 12-13K and other than European games it nearly always didn't sell out (some of the interpros back then were held in Cork). There were a couple of big seasons after Munster won the Heineken Cup twice where they got huge numbers into the new Thomond but it still didn't really sell out. 20K against Glasgow or Cardiff is exceptional but not really sustainable as has been shown since.

In relation to other provinces getting 15K for a home game against Ulster is what you'd expect. It's not terrible by any means.

The stadium is very big for what Munster usually need and that can skew people's thinking.

antietam1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815564#Comment_119815564

I didn't realise that about Munster, always looked jammers in the past.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815229#Comment_119815229

I think Munster should be aiming to sell out with Leinster if both teams have a decent squad and aiming for 20k+ for Ulster.

With the Leinster game back at it's Christmas time slot, I'm expecting that to sell out, so we're halfway there at least.

It's imo disappointing that the second most attractive game of the season got such a poor slot.

Realistically, both the European games are more attractive also. I'd expect that to be reflected in the attendances also. (To be fair, I suspect you meant for the domestic competition).

Regarding your point about % of city population that's true but Munster needs to be more of a province rather than Limerick city rfc. Not sure how to do that though.

No disagreement at all there. But that goes for all the Provinces. And ultimately, the attendance at a game is a function of the population of the city that it's hosted in.

The point is, if Munster are underachieving (and I don't necessarily think they are), then Leinster are massively underachieving. But you hear the former far more than the latter. Typically from Leinster fans, weirdly enough.

For the record I'm willing to condemn Leinster management too. They need to take steps to draw in casual fans for "lesser" games. A stadium that has drawn most season ticket holders and is practically empty otherwise shouldn't be acceptable.

That's fair, but I'd reiterate my point above there. I am interested tho, if stadium capacity wasn't an issue, what attendances do you think Leinster should typically be doing during the season?

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815498#Comment_119815498

Aloof why mention the cities population? the support is multi province for Munster.

As I said above, because the attendance at a game is a function of the population of the city that it's hosted in. I presume you meant "multi-county"? That should be the aim for every Province.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119815564#Comment_119815564

I do find it amazing that Munster attendences are always questioned.

If that poster thinks it was a "shocking attendance" wait until he hears about the crowd in the RDS for the semi-final last last year...

[Deleted User]

Best fans in the world™

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119816985#Comment_119816985

Correct.

Dave_The_Sheep

That would probably be somewhere like La Rochelle or Clermont.

I hesitate to wade into this particular discussion, but the reason people bring up Munster attendances more than the other provinces is that Munster has this image/reputation of being one of the most passionate and all-in supporter bases in Europe, which is embraced by their supporters. But if we're honest, the attendance figures are more or less in line with the other Irish provinces for a long while now (and statistically behind one of the Scottish teams, for what that's worth). There's more to a fanbase than attendance figures, obviously, and I don't agree fully with the argument, but that's why it's brought up time and again. The other provines don't have that inherent claim to be more into it than the anyone else.

I think we all know that though at some level or other, and denying it is a little disingenuous. Maybe that's just me though.

(My personal opinion as a Leinster fan, Ulster wins the fan award in the last decade for me. Ravenhill/Kingspan is always a very passionate/hostile crowd to see your team play in front of and they are often top of the pile in terms of % attendance etc, so they get the gold star in the senior infants playground from me)

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119817776#Comment_119817776

But if we're honest, the attendance figures are more or less in line with the other Irish provinces for a long while now

There’s one very obvious counter-argument to the above; the population bases in proximity to the stadia.

There’s a pretty reasonable argument that even if Munster are in line with other Irish provinces, they’re still outperforming them.

(and statistically behind one of the Scottish teams, for what that's worth).

Is that actually true? I don’t think it is tbh.

I think we all know that though at some level or other, and denying it is a little disingenuous.

I think you’re generally a reasonable poster, Dave, so I’m a little surprised at this because…

Ulster … and they are often top of the pile in terms of % attendance

% attendance? Is that not a little disingenuous itself? Again, there’s a very obvious counter-argument to this.

Dave_The_Sheep

Well there has to be some metric, I suppose so no I don't see it as disingenuous. Not sure what else to use. I'd see the percentage of how full the stadium is (assuming the stadium is of the appropriate size - see also the Scottish thing which is why I said 'for what that's worth', as in in that case it's not worth much) as a reasonable enough measure. I get what you're saying but bums on seats is all that matters really at the end of the day. The location of the stadium is what it is. Better measures welcome.

In any case, specifically Munster's attendances don't really bother me much, the point of the post was more the "why does this come up so often" side of things. I think the attendances across all four provinces are generally pretty decent most of the time. There's always exceptions mind.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119818760#Comment_119818760

I get what you're saying but bums on seats is all that matters really at the end of the day.

You’re conflating things here tho; % attendance is not the same as bums on seats.

By your reasoning, if Munster had played the game in Cork and gotten 8k (which they would have) that would be better than getting 15k in Thomond.

Dave_The_Sheep

Not quite what I meant, I'm aware they're two different things. Anyways, going to leave this here as it's a hole I've no intention of too far down.

aloooof

Ah look fair enough, but if you're aware of the difference, you'll note that the comparison to being "statistically behind one of the Scottish teams" is, at best, "a little disingenuous", to borrow a phrase. (Even if not intentionally).

I maintain my point in any case; if Munster are under-performing with regards attendance, then Leinster are massively under-performing.

stephen_n

Surely a lot of is optics more than anything else. People comment because of what they see. Leinster getting 15k into the RDS looks quite full. Munster getting 15k into Thomond looks half empty. Prompting comment, which may not accurately reflect the reality.

aloooof

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119819754#Comment_119819754

This is it entirely, tbh.

Tho iirc, the OP in this case was posting screenshots of empty sections of the Aviva for the QF last year, so I should've known better than to get into it tbh....