No one backing Ukraine wants this war. However, the vast majority of both sides, NATO haters, anti US etc support Russian actions by default. Other countries have every right to provide materials so Ukraine can defend itself. The war could stop this second if Russia decides it wants to stop the raper, murder, theft, etc. They can just go back home across the border. Those who think the conflict could/should persist until Russia goes home are realists because they know of Russia gets to keep an inch of Ukraine it will come back for more. It also should be noted that Russia don’t want to talk peacefully so how do negotiations work if the instigator wants to confuse their actions?
Problem with calling for "peace" is that it would mean Russia getting to keep the territories it illegally occupied this year. It says that Kherson and Mariupol are now formally part of Russia and that the country of Ukraine no longer even exists in that region.
With respect,
Ukraine are demonstrating that the quickest solution is to push the Russians out.
How can anyone negotiate with the Russians? - it isn't even possible to ascertain whether they actually believe the nonsense they come out with.
Ending it now, by force, is the least bad option.
Putin had a choice, Putin has a choice, Putin's choices will reduce.
If ever there was a time for facing down an agressor, now is that time.
The old mammy's ethos of "ah sure there's two of them in it" doesn't apply to every situation.
Complete and utter rubbish. There's only one cause of all this murder and mayhem, and that's Putin. And no one else, He could stop it today if he wished. So why are you and other likeminded peace seeking posters not calling on him to stop the war? Start up a signature list..." Dear Vlada, Please STOP THE WAR IN UKRAINE."
My only guess is that they involve themselves so as to be able to document cases ???
I heard on a podcast earlier this week that the Russian Red Cross is not affiliated, in any way, with the International Red Cross.
I read about the origins of the "cotton" euphemism a few months ago. It first started when HIMARs arrived in Ukraine and was being used to target ammunition dumps all over Russian held territory. The Russian media didn't want to admit that the Ukrainians had blown them up so instead they used some phrase like "accident" or something similar. Anyway this russian word sounded very like the Ukrainian word "бавовна" (bavovna), which means "cotton".
If someone breaks into your house, you kick them out or call police/garda/ other law enforcement agencies. Would you start negotiations? Heres 10 grand, my wife, ipad, but you let me keep my ps5, xbox. As a good gesture ill give you a washing machine as a bonus. Now please leave my house.
Yeah, I don't think so.
The international Red Cross was providing support to the "facilitation centres" in eastern Ukraine I believe? Though I'm happy to be corrected on that.
Potentially. Its a morally questionable area.
Western support for Ukraine is, if anything, increasing. Ukraine's hand is also strengthening.
Putin, not two days ago, was prattling on about how Ukraine only exists due to the benevolence of Russia and how it is not really a proper sovereign country. You can't negotiate with that.
Russia seems very keen to link the Sevastopol drone attack to Grain convoys. Might be worth keeping an eye on comments from Russia over the next few days as they do seem to be looking for a way out of that deal.
In other news, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has expressed doubt over Russia's declaration that its partial mobilisation was over. Unofficial mobilisation seems to be ongoing. In the closet, one could say!
I don't agree. Peace is always preferable to ongoing death, destruction, war crimes and misery. As a nation, we have learned that. Because Ukraine have the upper hand, the opening gambit on a peace negotiation is "Get the **** out of our land immediately or we will drive you out and in doing so will topple your asshole dictator". I am not saying the negotiations will be successful but you have to try.
You sound like Mick or Clare, neither of whom is particularly well regarded in this thread. You're on a hiding to nothing.
There is nothing to negotiate and the G7 just committed to an agreement to keep supporting Ukraine to the hilt. That's not waning support. Australia just announced the supply of another 30 Bushmasters and to send 70 ADF personnel to the UK to help train Ukrainian warriors. Even as of over a month ago, the number of warriors trained in the UK was 10,000.
A winning side isn't usually the one that has to capitulate and take terms dictated to them by the inferior opponent. The situation is that it's Russia that needs to sue for peace and cop the conditions offered. The Horde started this and can end it in 60 seconds if they want and lose nothing that legitimately belongs to them. The same can not be said of Ukraine.
There is no NATO culpability. Ukraine didn't start or invite this so how about you direct your qualms about WW3 to the ones who started this mess and are the only ones threatening to use nuclear weapons. Your lack of comprehension of the most trivial basics is telling.
Yeah, negotiating with the lads raping and murdering you, and let them keep part of the garden.
F*ck that.
Nope, not true, globally via ICRC Geneva they actually re-unite families. The Irish Red Cross has good form and history in this regard. I remember reading about a family they reunited recently, even after several years. You will only hear about it the odd time, mainly because of its confidential nature, but its ongoing in the background all the time.
If you are actually Irish, you would have a completely different opinion as to what sacrifices Ireland should make in order to have 'peace' if the UK had invaded and done even a tenth to Ireland of what the Horde have done to Ukraine. How many counties being added to the north would you be willing to sacrifice? Peace at any cost is morally cute when it's not your arse being carved up as spoils.
The International Committe of the Red Cross (ICRC) has its world HQ in Genva. All other Red Cross Delegations worldwide, inc Irish and Russian etc, are subjected to the GVA HQ. There is only one Red Cross.
In the end everyone has to make peace with the enemy. This is almost always someone they hate and who has committed vile acts against them. If the enemy were noble you probably wouldn’t be at war with them in the first place. I can’t understand why everyone is so insistent on fighting “until the last Ukrainian”. I’m not sure how much we can believe about the preparedness of the next wave of Russian troops, but whatever way you cut it up 200’000+ is a big number. Throw with that Putin’s relatively successful recent attacks on Ukraine’s energy supply. Now is the time to negotiate. Where are the cool heads ?
Potentially massive IF true.
Russia has warned the west against directly attacking it's interests and here they are claiming just that. How will the botox dwarf respond?
There has been at least a weeks worth of news about Russia trying to scupper the grain deal.
As you can see this is over a week old and of course the events triggering it, even older.
It just highlights how farcical the calls for peace negotiations are. The Horde are liars, innately dishonest and devious, and never stick to negotiated agreements. They remind me of very nasty and unpleasant children.
Do you actually read this before posting ,
Cool heads is Russia withdrawing all forces to previous 2014 borders and Ukraine is rebuilt using Russian Money, ukraine joins the eu and Nato.
All sorted
Why have a Russian flag ?
Come on. There’s no need to be deliberately stupid about what Putin says. Everyone knows that’s a negotiating position. You might as well say there is no point in negotiating with Zelensky because he has stated the war won’t end until they’ve taken back Crimea. It’s just dick waving.
Completely missed the point - whether you like it or not, we had peace negotiations in London during the war of independence and for the Good Friday agreement. Who said peace at any cost?
I find this thread fascinating. I'm not Irish now?
Out of curiousity, hypothetical...let's say this war is still raging over and back in 2 years time - you would still say no peace negotiations?
Walks like a duck, talks like a duck.
Definitely a duck 🦆
In what way is it questionable Podge? One reason prisoner exchanges and safe passage is guaranteed is because of the presence of the Red Cross. They are trusted neutral intermediaries. Much more than the UN or others. And of course, they take details of everyone who passes through their hands, and rightly so. Often, it's a guarantee of their very existence, because it has been recorded, and cannot be easily denied, or the prisoner easily "Vanished" which happens far too often.
Oh Gatling, you really need to address your anger. You are ruining this thread with your macho intolerance.
This is Boards in Ireland, not the front line. Attack the post.
They are not being held captive in Ukraine, they already have an option of leaving.
Perhaps they don't want to appear rude by leaving unannounced, they're a very conscientious bunch.
People need to get real with these childish analogies. As if all people need to do in life is ring their local authorities and all their difficulties will end.
In answer to your question it depends on what part of the world or what neighbourhood you live in. In some parts of the world people gave to pay protection money - and it’s not because they love doing it or don’t know the Garda phone number. I don’t know if you’ve ever lived in a rough part of town. You learn fast to keep your head down and that some lines can’t be crossed. Either that or you get out. Ukraine can’t change the fact that they live beside Russia. They need to deal with that reality —> negotiate.
Ideally they leave asap with less loss of life.
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