nav[aria-label="Primary Navigation"] { padding: 0; & ul { list-style: none; width: 100%; display: flex; flex-direction: row; justify-content: start; align-items: start; gap: 30px; padding: 0; & li { margin: 0; } & ul li { list-style: none; } } }

Child Item

EX FG voters, why have you stopped supporting them?

Idbatterim

AS an ex FG voter, who possibly wont even bother voting next election, as there is no option politically here, that I feel represents my views. Why wont you vote for FG again? Here are a few key reasons why I wont... Their initial appetite for change platform they ran on in 2011 or whenever that election was, was a lie and a farce. Look after the taxpayer ? Laugh out loud, you thieve FIFTY percent income tax over a pittance, that even hits the working poor's income. Infrastructure is a disgrace. Planning reform desperately needed for housing and infrastructure, still not bothered with it... I read an article yesterday, FG internal one that, that a party member leaked a bit of. Saying they should probably do something about housing if they dont want to lose more seats, this is being said in 2022 ! with a diabolical housing situation, 11 years after being in power... Beyond pathetic. The 2011 election, nearly all my friends and family voted FG, 2017 that halved roughly. The next election, it will be possibly 1 or 2. 1 or 2 from 30+ in 2011! The young here are expected to live at home forever, pay a fortune in rent or emigrate. Meanwhile a large part of the population live a far standard higher or living than they would in other european countries, paid for by these hard working, low paid, workhorses...

Why is JSA or JSB being increased, when every bloody shop has a "staff wanted" sign in the window? Total overhaul of welfare system needed, pay out, based on pay in. A proper system like other eu countries. Welfare bonus for christmas etc only if you are long term unemployed, in a country with businesses closing, because they cant get staff...

Find more posts tagged with

Quick Links

Comments

[Deleted User]

"And where are these voters supposedly seeking a fiscally conservative alternative to FG going? Do they think they are going to get it from SF?"

I most certainly do not - but maybe a term for SF in government would result in a right left divide emerging? Maybe not

But for me its put up or shut up. The only way a sensible (IMO of course, as in my definition of sensible. Might not align with others) party emerges is if people demand it, thats what I'll do. I might be pissing in the wind. Maybe there's not enough people willing to put up or shut up. maybe there's not enough people who want some sensible fiscal policies. Who knows? I can only control where my own vote goes. I want change - that won't be achieved by voting for parties that refuse to change anything.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754105#Comment_119754105

which is the lowest percentage in modern times I can find, even lower than what is often called the "disastrous" 2002 General Election (22.5% according to Wikipedia)

So to say FG voters are sticking with the party is simply not true. Some (a lot?) are but others are not. And as another poster (correctly IMO) said a lot of it is people settling for "the least left" option rather than support FG

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754487#Comment_119754487

no question workers have been getting screwed over, but this has been occurring for decades now, long before this current government, living on welfare isnt all what its cracked up to be, ask anyone on it, or better again, try it!

again, our taxes are actually pretty much on par with other oecd nations, but we urgently need to increase taxation on the accumulation of wealth, particular in relation to the value of assets such as property, as this is starting to cause a wealth divide amongst current asset owners, primarily older generations, and non asset owners, primarily younger generations...

again, on law and order, we re also doing fairly average here to, but with the rising wealth gap, i.e. wealth inequality, expect this to rise, as this is generally a common outcome of so....

'cowardice'! the government actually done very well during covid, certainly when you compare us to our nearest neighbors, i.e. the us and the uk!

our housing issues were noted by respected commentators for well over a decade now, reasoning, the outsourcing of construction to the private sectors such as the fire sectors, which of course lead to the major crash of 08, and the continual polices to do so, i.e. no immigration hasnt caused this problem, but it is exasperating it!

Ham_Sandwich

finna gael were supposed to look after us after finna fail wrecked the place but they let us down as well we need to give sinn fein a go they'll sort us out with housing health education if we get them in

Fred Astaire

An open door policy on asylum seekers and immigration - adding massively to the huge cohort of people demanding handouts. Not to mention the massive future social problems that await.
Repeated improvements to social welfare acting as a disincentive for many to re-enter the workplace.
Allowing the housing market to deteriorate without intervention - not intervention in the form of social housing, but ensuring that people who are trying to better themselves have places to live. People going to university should be able to find accomodation. People working hard in their jobs should be able to afford housing. On that point, allowing the conversation around housing to be derailed into a social housing controversy.
Allowing the media to dictate policy in the cases of Mandatory Hotel Quarantine which was an absolutely absurd waste of time.
Allowing bottom of the barrel idiots like McEntee free reign to implement stupid policies for her social media likes.
Widening schemes such as the medical card to encompass more people, clogging up facilities with chancers who coughed once 4 days ago so decide they need a check up (because they have nothing better to do anyway), while people working hard don't bother going to the doctor now because of the colossal wait times.
Making travellers a distinct ethnic group within the state, thereby encouraging their disgusting behaviours to continue with no repercussions.
Allowing the Green Party to dictate policy with completely nonsensical sh*te, which will have disastrous consequences, purely to keep hold of power.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119755505#Comment_119755505

looked at this - FG election percentages for the last while

1992: 24.5%
1997: 27.9%
2002: 22.5%
2007: 27.3%
2011: 36.1%
2016: 25.5%

Average over this period: 27.3%. Lowest Vote share over this period: 22.5%. FG share in 2020: 20.9%

So it looks like FG is losing vote share after all. If the party had adopted a more fiscally conservative stance would it have lost more/less voters? We'll never know, but it is a complete fabrication when certain posters (many of whom are staunch government defenders coincidentally) claim "FG voters are sticking with their party"

Interestingly if you go back further (I started in 1992) FGs % share was far higher (mid to late 30s) until a certain party (the PDs) emerged..........

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119756732#Comment_119756732

We sorely need a PD like party now. Would do very well.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119755871#Comment_119755871

...again sf supporters would want to get a bit real, our issues of housing, health care, energy needs etc etc, are in fact extremely complex, in order to resolve these issues, an enormous amount of external factors must come together in order to do so, and this may not occur under sf. sf are in next, but supporters really need to accept this reality, they wont find it easy in government, and these issues wont be resolved quickly....

Silentcorner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759744#Comment_119759744

That's not going to happen.

Micheal Martin pushed thru legislation in 2011 (1st thing he did in opposition) regarding the funding of parties, it was presented as a move to "clean up" politics after the corrupt leadership of FF Ahern etc, it also meant that the likelihood of a new political movement being able to get off the ground was next to impossible...which of course, was the real purpose of the legislation.

It is no coincidence that the now largest party in the State is the only party with the financial means to maintain and sustain a political presence across the countries constituencies.

Rosahane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119751063#Comment_119751063

I just spotted this thread and decided to read it before I commented.

Now I've decided that my commenting is pointless as you have said pretty much everything I would have!

I'm also an ex member, my late father was in Cumann na nGaedheal and FG all his life. I grew up in a party that was unique insofar as people joined it, in the main, so that they could make the country better for everybody - FF people joined their party to benefit themselves. With a very few exceptions FG have become just another version of FF!

Cluedo Monopoly

Some recent FG TD legends.........

Dara Murphy (please pay back the fraudulent expenses)

Alan Farrell (insurance fraud - somehow still a TD!?)

Maria Bailey

Josepha Madigan (see above)

Michelle Mulherrins (had constituents in Kenya)

Crony Coveney

Leaky Leo

Tayto McEntee

and there is a list of dodgy councillors a mile long.

Top of the list - Hugh McElvaney - show me the money!

New Politics.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119760257#Comment_119760257

Doubt the likes of OP and CarProblem are too bothered about this stuff. If FG was broadly pursuing what they regard as the right economic policy they'd be brushing off these 'inidividual peccadilloes'...

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119760667#Comment_119760667

Can't speak for others but absolutely incorrect wrt me

I come from a staunch FF family, one of the many reasons I've never voted FF in my life (never given a FF candidate so much as a preference) is the cohort of chancers and charlatans that has inhabited the party. I would apply this kind of logic to any party

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119759744#Comment_119759744

I agree (speaking relatively about "success" and "doing well"). Such a party (IMO) would definitely be the 4th largest in the country (tho that would not imply a huge % vote) and if it was reasonably successful (credible candidates gaining a double figure %) might even sneak into 3rd place if it was mostly FG that lost votes to it

Thinkingaboutit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754487#Comment_119754487

At the last GE I I voted for an autistic or eccentric man who ran as an independent (he was a monarchist or whatever, and I might even note if Ireland wanted a gay civil partnered head of state, the Jacobite pretender, the Duke of Bavaria fits the bill😁 and his partner won't spout Russian propaganda points), and had usually voted FG, with ever growing reluctance. The main parties are confidence tricksters of one sort or another and those who are true believers like the Greens have done such damage (thank them for the excess of small diesels thanks to an unwise tax change while palling with FF. FF should be proscribed for the damage it has done over the decades. PBP and co. draw their politics from the English and somewhat anti-Irish Socialist Workers Party and don't even deserve the sobriquet or tag of populist, which they are. I would say that if someone voted for a certain party of property from the north and they implemented their policies as promised, there wouldn't be just mass emigration but a veritable refugee crisis, but seriously the levels of mass immigration are just utterly insane and is a major factor driving absurd rents. An anti-immigration accelerationist could vote for that crew from the north whose policies are a reverse of their name and founder. The overall direction of the country not remotely sustainable and all the parties offer nothing, but slight variations on what doesn't work.

Basically FG are now another pro bureaucrat centre left party like FF, differing only really in its traditions.

The HSE (made up of already bad Health Boards no bank account Bertie stuck together) is a disaster of waste and bad service, quangos waste billions and won't shut up, and this country has a not particularly large workforce working for a population largely or wholly dependent on taxpayer transfers. Here endeth my rant. 😎

Brussels Sprout

Reading through this thread is seems like there is a large PDs-shaped hole in the political spectrum.

In retrospect it's interesting that they completely evaporated at the very peak of the Celtic Tiger era. I remember driving through South Tipperary during that 2007 campaign and noticing that they were running 2 candidates there, despite the fact that they didn't even have a sitting TD in the constituency. The two of them ended up with 1.4% of the vote combined. That pretty much summed up their election campaign for me.

They ended up with only 2 TDs and wound up the party the following year.

In contrast, the Greens lost all of their seats in 2011 but kept going. If the PDs had persevered I wonder where they'd be today?

[Deleted User]

"Reading through this thread is seems like there is a large PDs-shaped hole in the political spectrum."

My opinion (be it representative of a PD-shaped hole or not) is that many people feel that if you work and pay tax in this country there is not a single party that represents one's interest. Play by the rules and all you get in return is a bill to pay for those who don't play by the rules. Dole increases by more than the tax cut a worker on 30k gets, housing debate is often centered on social housing, forgetting the plight of those that pay their own way etc. etc. etc.

There's obviously a bit of selection bias on show in this thread as well as it specifically asked why ex FG voters had deserted the party.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119760837#Comment_119760837

Correct. It is a culture in both parties.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761739#Comment_119761739

Is this 'sleaze' massively relevant to this thread though, i.e. a major factor in FG's loss of support?

I would argue right-leaning voters, if they were broadly happy with FG's policy platform, would be willing to hold their nose about that stuff as they have no other credible option.

As for left-leaning ones, well a lot of them climbed on the FG bandwagon in 2011 but were they ever going to stick with them over the long haul, irrespective of how they were performing in government?

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762569#Comment_119762569

It was my reason. I thought FG were better than FF.

[Deleted User]

I am a farmer, I used to vote FG in all elections, mostly from family tradition/ignorance. Got involved in farming politics and a CAP reform last decade. I didn't like how my sector was being treated in terms of how the CAP regulations were being "interpreted" here in Ireland nor how the CAP funding was being divided. Then it was a case of 20% of farmers got 80% of the funding and me and the rest of the 80% had to make do on 20%. Enda Kenny and Simon Coveney and a few more with them were all about big business farming, not farm families or their communities. I had extremely good relationships with FG before this point, but they quickly and obviously became strained. It was obvious that loyalty did not work both ways.

The straw which broke the camels back was when our local FG TD was Min of State for natural resources I believe it was. A Canadian mining company sought rights to start mining in my area and very possibly on my own farm. Naturally this was quite concerning to me. In our area we have a lot of EU imposed environmental restrictions in the form of Special Areas of Conservation, which have been dictated to us and handled extraordinarily badly. Relations are very sour on that front. These reg's devalue property, constrain what you may do to provide an income for your family (even to tiny details like putting one wood post in the ground, or cleaning an existing drain), and adding insult to injury it turned out they were so badly managed anyway that 92% of the habitats within failed to improve or went backwards since their introduction by the Rainbow Govt way back when. With us "natives" having to live under those regulations, foreign mining companies were at the same time being invited in to plunder and pollute the same area. That was quite enough of FG for me.

[Deleted User]

Have we considered that the age profile of Fine Gael voters might play a role in the reduction in support and that they might just be dying off and not being replaced by new young voters.

I am from a traditionally FG family and their candidates only get a low preference from me so very unlikely for my vote to transfer to them.

theguzman

I was actively involved in politics and a former member of both FF as a teenager and FG up until last year. I will never again in my entire life vote for either party. This Govt of 2020 forward has been the worst Govt we have ever seen, making the days of Haughey and Bertie look good.

Reasons why?

Covid lockdowns, Garda harrasing people, mandatory mask wearing, I resigned from FG the day Mandatory Hotel Quaratine was implemented and I got stranded abroad as a result.
Housing Crisis, No form of social housing, but ensuring that people who are trying to better themselves have places to live. The working poor are destroyed, you should not get access to Social Housing or HAP etc unless you have a minimum amount of PRSI contribs in, reward those who help themselves and try contribute to society. Those who refuse to engage or work deserve nothing. Fresh off the plane economic migrant scammers get social housing in a smack in the face to taxpayers.
Helen McEntee, a disgrace, the worst politician in the Dail, her hate speech legislation is only designed to gag anyone with genuine concerns and brand anyone who dissents as a racist and homophobe or transphobe. She is a dictator and lets real criminals away with it.
Crime, at least 5,000 new prison places needed, get rid of the judges. Bring in proper sentences.
Healthcare - what Healthcare? Trade Unions wrecked the HSE like all public and civil service.
Infrastructure, no regional rail, no Dublin Metro, No Airport link - North West forgotten.
Green Party - Taking these mentally deranged people into Govt was a major mistake.
Immigration - Its out of control, real genuine hard working people get screwed by the system and yet absolute scum criminals get welcomed in. We need to stop inward migration immediately until such time as the house supply catches up. All English schools are visa factories for the Brazilians, end the ability to work and study for a few years until housing is built. The Ukrainians get far too much welfare, several hundred per week plus bed and board, some are working and living rent free in hotels, again a joke. Asylum Seekers (scammers) get around €30/week, the Ukrainians need to get this. Genuine refugees will stay on and the Ukrainian economic migrants will either work or leave. We cannot house the world. A man from Nigeria on €30/week and a man from Kyiv on €200 is ridiculous, there is no war in Nigeria so that asylum claim should be denied and those deported. Paying the Ukrainians huge money plus housing them is insane, no wonder they keep coming. As this is like Social housing contributions are needed back now.
Landlords/Tenancy: No protection for landlords, the whole thing is designed to drive small investors out and a bad tenant can mean 2 years of hell and tens of thousands in legal fees.

Some of my reasons above, I am a small landlord now exiting the market since I am apparently the bad guy. Between 40% tax and everything else I'll keep the house for when I'm down home where it is based. I derived around 20% of my income from that house. There is a housing shortage caused by open doors immigration and govt corruption. I would consider myself as a PD type conservative who voted and campaigned for Fine Gael, FG now are not the same party of 12 years ago, they are a liberal woke mob of absolute cretins who are actively working and plotting against the people, both FF and FG now I consider to have committed multiple acts of treason and are the enemy of the people.

I emphatise with the working poor, students and anyone trying to do the right thing, we have become a sick welfare state where crime pays and your better off stay in bed and draw welfare. Mental illness is a handy copout for wrong doing when the genuinely mentally ill get no support. I look at Sinn Fein like this, I will vote for them because they deserve a chance and unlike the current lot they are not enemies of the people, they came from the tradition of willing to die for what they believe in up North. Sinn Fein cannot make things any worse and even a bad SF Govt would be far better than this shower as they would not actively be working against people. Like a stopped clock they will be right at least twice per day. FG and FF need an electoral wipeout.

[Deleted User]

I think we need more options, I don't think any of the current political parties are worthy of a vote.

A lot of reform is needed to fix a lot of the states obligations to its people, I don't see any of the current parties having the potential to resolve any of our issues. The majority of current parties generally focus to much on one class in society, we need a party that tries to represent everybody equally.

We have parties full of career politicians, they are mouth pieces that will promise the sun moon and stars at election time but once they get a bum on a seat they coast their way through to the next set of elections. A politicians pay should be performance based if they cant deliver their manifesto their pay and pension should reflect that, we should be able to provide feedback at the end of their term.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773782#Comment_119773782

The idea that "Sinn Fein cannot make things any worse and even a bad SF Govt would be far better than this shower" was emphatically disproved by Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwarteng. Things could be an awful lot worse with a different government.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773782#Comment_119773782

The majority of your post (which I agree with 110%) does not tie in with the last bit about SF.

Your views are to the right of FF and FG, yet you want to vote for a party further left than FF?!

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119803851#Comment_119803851

The words for that are cognitive dissonance.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119773870#Comment_119773870

First line of the 2011 New Politics document issued by Fine Gael before the election.

"The New Politics is the most ambitious programme for political reform since the 1930s. Fine Gael, the party that created the State and declared it a Republic, will build a New Republic in Ireland - where trust is restored in our democratic institutions and the concerns of the Citizen, rather than the elites, are placed firmly at the centre of government."

It was complete and utter BS on their behalf. Zero reform. It was more of the same only worse.

Mad_maxx

The FG TD in my constituency is a waste of skin so I’ve never voted for him , the FF TD is also useless, I vote for the independent TD as he’s significantly less useless

if the local FG TD wasn’t useless, I’d still vote FG as while they have bizarrely come to the conclusion that FG should chase the same voter’s as the Soc Dems, at least they aren’t as left wing economically as FF are

options have been awful for centre right voters for years and it’s unlikely to improve anytime soon

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119754487#Comment_119754487

Thank you for posting for me 😂😂

Interesting the number that say they won't bother voting. I am the same.

Cowardice is a big one for me, they have taken the easy media friendly option time and time again and/or just throw taxpayers money at problems with no regard for value. This government has avoided, covid aside, big decisions. And in doing this have actually made SF more palatable. The eviction ban was pure SF populist BS which will cause longer term issues for example.

I think we'll look back on this period of massive tax take as a massive opportunity missed, all to avoid unpopular decisions and placate the media /ngo class.