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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,560 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Yeah get ya, but that’s my point.

    If Germany don’t have Russian gas there’s more chance of social upheaval in Germany due to lack of gas and industry closing etc.

    If they accept the gas they’re breaking EU sanctions and going back to a despot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,669 ✭✭✭brickster69


    ^ Only 1 person knows that answer. Just guessing but no doubt there would be a trade off for xyz, an acceptance or a refusal to supply. But the request would have to come from the Germans first after getting permission from Biden and also the permits needed from the EU. Could they both refuse given the situation, doubtful you would think.

    Anyway looks like the idea is gaining debate.

    "According to a Forsa survey, even now, in midsummer, 66 percent of Germans would have no problems with the gas from Nord Stream 2"

    Probably be up to 90% in two months you would imagine. Totally mad really considering there are no sanctions on Gas apart from transportation of parts and maintenance of them.

    The longer it goes on they will have to make the decision at some point. Better to get it over with ASAP than heading into winter twiddling your thumbs.

    If it went ahead Sholtz would be a hero to his people and the other side would get what they want and prices would come down for everyone else. Win win


    Niccolò Machiavelli :

    "To ally with great powers to defeat your neighbour is a strategic trap; if you win, you become the slave of the greater power; if the allied power is defeated, you remain alone and defenceless against the angry neighbour, and you are destroyed." - Niccolò Machiavelli



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 888 ✭✭✭bb12


    German craftsmen write an open letter to Scholz decrying the sanctions and the effects they are having on Germany

    “Do you want to be the chancellor , who ruined Germany. Do you really want to sacrifice your country?”




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,895 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Seems to be some issues with the figures, another source says

    The Germans also take a clear position on the question of whether Nord Stream 2 should be opened for gas supplies from Russia. The proposal is rejected by a majority (53 percent), but just over a third would be in favor of it.




  • Posts: 776 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't think Putin interested pumping gas to Germany after Germany brought weapons to kill Russian solders again.

    The 50 per cent of NS2 already turned into Russian domestic market and the rest of it's capacity will go to China soon.

    Russia investing money to new pipeline trough Mongolia to China,do you really think that Russia which already investing to new ways will return losing money on project started?

    Also Germany not interested in long contracts,they still want play with them renewables.So what the point for Putin and Qatar supply gas to Germany under temporary contract?

    The NS2 cost 11 billions to built ! When and how this money will back ? Russia also paid millions to new gas places to research,when this money will back ?

    There is no way Putin will fill NS 2 without at least 5 years supply contract and only after Germany will pay heavy fines for making pipeline unusable for amount of time !

    That why Putin actively building new pipeline to China ( link above in my previous post )

    Also Putin well understand that weakending Europe economy he making Russian economy stronger.I don't think he interested lose this chance.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    My point being that Putin wants social upheaval, the worse the better.


    That he isn't too concerned about what Germany do or don't about aid to Ukraine, they give so little it's not a game changer.


    He sees either Russia or Europe as coming out on top of this. It's a multi generation defining of power.


    The article above posted by Brickster mentioned that the German VP wanted to open Nordstream 2 as a way to see if Putin actually wants Gas to go West under any circumstances.


    I don't think there is.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,274 ✭✭✭EOQRTL


    Very interesting. If that's the pulse of the German nation in the coming months then Scholz is a goner unless he changes course.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,669 ✭✭✭brickster69


    I think the same Rev to be honest, i think Russia will just keep supply down and prices high for the next 2 or 3 years until they get other customers sorted for the long term. If you are selling 80% less for five times more it is just the same really.

    All a bit crackers but there you go.

    Niccolò Machiavelli :

    "To ally with great powers to defeat your neighbour is a strategic trap; if you win, you become the slave of the greater power; if the allied power is defeated, you remain alone and defenceless against the angry neighbour, and you are destroyed." - Niccolò Machiavelli



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Scholz has played his part in it but it is only a bit role compared to Angela who blocked LNG terminals being built, blocked the Norwegian Gas option, ran down all other energy sources bar Russian gas.


    Hopefully Comrade Merkel won't get to enjoy her Russian gold funded retirement.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,609 ✭✭✭Tonesjones


    There is another poster on here who writes on behalf of the German people.

    He has stated they will just wear an extra jumper.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Darth Putin


    1A5A5E5A-61BD-4FE3-AEF1-E7AE9FA04214.png

    Thread can be closed, RT confirms!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,669 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Talking of Germany they are doing quite well in support of Ukraine alongside Poland. Look at Italy, France and where the **** is Spain at ?

    Seems like plenty of countries waving blue and yellow flags from the sidelines but doing sweet **** all in helping them.

    eu.jpg


    Niccolò Machiavelli :

    "To ally with great powers to defeat your neighbour is a strategic trap; if you win, you become the slave of the greater power; if the allied power is defeated, you remain alone and defenceless against the angry neighbour, and you are destroyed." - Niccolò Machiavelli



  • Posts: 776 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Unfortunately the White House representative was first telling us about New Definition of Recession.



  • Posts: 776 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Just got information from one lad from Latvia.

    He is builder,he built his energy saving passive house.Not big,not small,just slightly over 200 square metres.

    At Summer started he got his monthly gas bill at 80 euros for hot water.In July he got bill at 160,and now in August he got 561 euros bill ! In August lads ! Just for hot water! So what gonna happen in October or December?

    On area were his house is live plenty pensioners,with pension of 300 euros per month !

    What he are saying: I will come on streets and will throw this f,... government trough the government building windows !

    Let's see what will happen in Latvia this winter.But Putin will watch all this with Huge smile on his face.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Subzero3


    Social upheaval and a change to the status quo. Fingers crossed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,259 ✭✭✭Sultan of Bling


    Could you ask your friend to send you a screenshot of the bills with personal information redacted of course.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,578 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Europe as ever is cutting off its nose to source its face. Let’s face it. We need to trade with Russia and vice versa. This madness was ok for a few months but we can’t afford years of it. These stupid sanctions have hurt europe more than Russia in my opinion, time to start talking actual sense again



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,002 ✭✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    The EU may need to go cap in hand for more Russian gas but long term the EU will cut that bridge and get energy supplies from elsewhere. This winter will be tricky but ultimately Russia will lose. China may well fill the void and so be it.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth house?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,669 ✭✭✭brickster69


    In Poland the price of coal is now equivalent of 3000 Euro for 4 tonnes which is what people use for the whole year. Average pension is 6K Euro per year.

    Niccolò Machiavelli :

    "To ally with great powers to defeat your neighbour is a strategic trap; if you win, you become the slave of the greater power; if the allied power is defeated, you remain alone and defenceless against the angry neighbour, and you are destroyed." - Niccolò Machiavelli



  • Posts: 776 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I don't think he will bother scan his paper version bill and digitalise it to mail it to me .Not that type of person.

    I am pretty sure we will see similar bills in Ireland soon or see screen shots on Google photos sent from another countries.Tik Took, YouTube and Facebook will be full of them soon.



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  • Posts: 776 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Hope we will see it soon same as happened with wheat and fertilizer already.But something tells me that Putin will wait until full effect of energy pain for Europe governments.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,669 ✭✭✭brickster69


    How are they going to be able to pump more gas when they only have one turbine working and can't get the other ones delivered because of sanctions on transportation and servicing of energy parts placed on them. It has taken 3 months to get one from Canada to Germany and it is still stuck in limbo waiting for paperwork.

    It may of been a good idea to look at the consequence of these sanctions or even look at what parts are due to be serviced or something like that before going full on kamikaze mode. Now people could be sat around cooking a sausage over a candle in the middle of winter.

    Niccolò Machiavelli :

    "To ally with great powers to defeat your neighbour is a strategic trap; if you win, you become the slave of the greater power; if the allied power is defeated, you remain alone and defenceless against the angry neighbour, and you are destroyed." - Niccolò Machiavelli



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,259 ✭✭✭Sultan of Bling




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,609 ✭✭✭Tonesjones



    Canada won't be supplying Germany with gas any time soon and the trip to Qatar yielded little results.

    Olaf is better off staying home and saving the fuel



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,578 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    It’s not possible to replace it affordably just like that- no matter how hard certain people virtue signal, it doesn’t change the fact we need to trade with Russia



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,609 ✭✭✭Tonesjones


    They are protesting in Germany already about gas affordability and its only August!

    Wait until November weather!

    I said this on another thread and was told the Germans will just put on another jumper



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,578 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    If only it was that simple. A jumper isn’t going to heat your water or keep your manufacturing plant going…a deal should and must be cut soon to end these ridiculous self foot shooting sanctions. You’d imagine some realpolitik is coming soon if not already



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,126 ✭✭✭Thespoofer


    What system does he use to heat the water?


    Edit. Just saw there he uses gas to heat it. Just out of curiosity and maybe off topic, would heating your water with gas be classed as 'passive? Surely solar would be the way to go here.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 996 ✭✭✭Ozark707



    Looks like the house prices are imploding in Canada (albeit after an incredible run up).

    The average home price in Canada down more than 18% since February

    https://www.msn.com/en-ca/money/finance-real-estate/home-sales-declined-by-53-per-cent-in-july-back-to-pre-covid-levels/ar-AA10GKGL



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Habeck rules out extending Germany's last nuclear power plants.


    I'm not a fan of nuclear but in the context of the situation another few years would be warranted.


    Germany really deserves a very cold snap this winter.



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