Anyone else think Jackman is turning into a pretty decent pundit/analyst/commentator/whatever? I tend to learn quite a lot from listening to him, he goes into good technical detail on things the average fan wouldn't really spot.
You could rightly argue that making a mockery of the HIA procedure shows scant regard for it.
when Ireland are putting players through 3 HIA tests to play a game
This is the protocol mandated by World Rugby.
The England guys (Itoje anyway) were ruled out after failing the second, post-game assessment. This is the 'early diagnosis of concussion' test - the HIA assessment during the game is only for 'potential concussion'.
TLDR Ireland are doing exactly as dictated by the governing body and exactly as other teams are doing.
What sort of example does this show to youth players/ amateurs when Ireland are putting players through 3 HIA tests to play a game
Leaderships for concussion comes from the top down, which is the national teams and England show be thanked for putting the player first
The whole building depth thing is only 1 aspect to squad management. It’s important, no doubt, but it’s still just 1 of a number of elements. I think the big thing that Farrell wants from this tour is getting the experience in our starting XV of winning big, high pressure games away from home. Remember, the RWC is effectively a tour. And there’s a bunch of guys in our 23 who are on their first ever tour now, and the only one they’ll be in before the RWC. It’s great having depth and all, but if we don’t have the mentality that we can win big, high pressure games away from home on the bounce (which we’ll have to do in the RWC and which can only truly be learned by actually doing it) then the depth won’t really matter that much in those knock out games.
Although, I think winning the 6nations is a better achievement!
Nah no way. The 6N is essentially 4 games, 2 of which are at home, all against teams we've beaten loads of times.
Winning a 3 test series, in NZ (where we'd never won before), at the end of a long season, against the standard bearers of world rugby, would be a much bigger achievement IMO.
I don't believe that we'll test many or any fringe lads in the autumn.
I don't know. I think against Fiji and Australia we could see a good bit of rotation.
Right! It's possible that was Farrells goal. Winning this series would be fantastic. Although, I think winning the 6nations is a better achievement!
I think Farrell has been very good! I wasn't chuffed when he got the job but, I was in favor of giving him the full cycle. He's done some good stuff.
I agree! That side were poorly coached and had no clue as to what to do in tight matches! That was a coaching failure more than individual players.
For the first 20 minutes of the Japan game, things were going great and Carty was pulling the strings really well. And let's not forget Sexton was also on the pitch when things turned to sh*t against England, Wales and NZ. I don't think Sexton would have made much of a difference.
Agree, I don't think a couple of personnel changes were going to make a huge difference. We might have beaten Japan maybe with Sexton but we were never threatening to go far in the tournament.
And one other thing. I've heard a lot of people complaining about "not building depth" and "repeating the same mistakes as the last cycle".
Was depth really our problem at the last world cup? I'd have said that our obsolete game plan, lack of evolution of said game plan post the 2018 GS, persistence with underperforming players, and performance anxiety as a result of an over-controlling coach, were far bigger problems than our depth.
I can't think of an example of a player being called upon due to injury, and then underperforming due to not being given enough exposure in the build up. I genuinely can't.
I get all that. But maybe, just maybe, a series decider away in NZ isn't really the best match to "throw guys in" and "give them experience". You wouldn't be throwing guys in for a grand slam decider to be fair. Winning a series in NZ would be a bigger achievement than a grand slam.
November matches against the likes of Australia or Argentina maybe. And to be fair, that's what we scheduled the two Mãori games for. I think Farrell knew that we'd be going all out to win this series, and that's why he pushed to get the two Mãori games, to have a look at young guys and give them experience against a team who would be roughly the same level as a Japan or Fiji.
Suppose VDF misses the world cup? Suppose Connors does to. What experience against top level teams does Timoney have?
There's a fair chance that our back-up 7 is POM, not Timoney.
Larmour has earned it! On the other lads, it's best to find out sooner, rather than later? Suppose VDF misses the world cup? Suppose Connors does to. What experience against top level teams does Timoney have?
The same with Casey! He's clearly a lad that is good enough. Whatever weakness he has can be worked on before the world cup. But, we won't know. Especially if he only plays against weak opposition.
You plan for every event and have a full deck prior to the world cup! That's all I am thinking.
Yeah, I'm not disputing that, but I'm saying focusing on and celebrating successes in the interim period and aiming to win RWCs is not mutually exclusive.
Writing off the significance of 75%+ of international rugby and the other achievements that are out there is what I'm opposed to.
Everyone wants us to win the World Cup, but the point you're missing is that there is plenty more to be achieved.
You can get phenomenally lucky and have good success in a world cup; in terms of the draw you receive, injuries etc.
It would be suicidal for team morale and counter-intuitive to trying to win a WC if the team don't do everything in their power to win this test series next week. That means picking the best team.
I've no problem if some guys like Coombes, Timoney, Larmour or someone turns in a huge performance tomorrow morning and forces their way into the test squad for this weekend on merit, but this thing you and others constantly tout for of just throwing in players who haven't earned it to "build experience" or to see if maybe they might be good enough doesn't make sense.
It's really not. The world cup is the pinnacle of rugby. It's the hardest competition to win and the only true marker of how good teams are, because everyone has equal preparation time and everyone is going all out to win it. Our record at world cups is embarrassing. Our best ever finish is the same as Canada's. And no matter how many times we beat NZ or how high we climb the world rankings, I don't believe we can ever consider ourselves a true powerhouse on the world stage until we at least win a knockout game. And we should absolutely be targeting winning it.
My obsession with the world cup, is I want to be the best. Ireland won't win many world championships in any team sport, if any. The 6nations is grand! It doesn't make you the best. I believe we think small. A qf win is seen as a success, a 6nations title? We should be setting the goals higher. We should be aiming to win every competition. Fcuk the small mindset of winning a series. Go win everything!
Sorry, just sloppy on my part on all three points.
RWC has been around for 35 years and international rugby would be about 150 years.
Also France have won a series in NZ. 1994.
Live in the now.
and as an addition again, POM most probably used the HIA procedure to allow Doris come back on for him, or we'd have been down to 14 for the last few minutes. But really, we dont know, he could be stood down for next weekend, but if hes selected there could be more "ireland don't care about concussion" claims but they could be completely baseless in that instance.
A problem with the concussion discussion is that we in general don’t know enough facts to really be able to discuss what’s happening. Its not to say certain teams don’t play fast and loose with the facts but as we don’t actually have the facts it’s a pointless enough discussion.
To add to this, Ringrose has rightly been stood down, was pretty much immediately ruled out of the game this weekend.
only Curry has been sent home, due to the fact this player has suffered 3 concussion within 6 months and will likely be stood down for a long period, similar to how sexton was stood down in racing due to the number of head injuries in a short length of time.
Itoje and Underhill have both suffered concussion and are not available for selection, but have not been sent home.
Underhill is just back from along lay off himself due to concussion issues, and has along history of similar issues having missed 3 months already this season, so it makes complete sense to stand him down without having to go through the HIA 2+3
Itoje failed his in game HIA and as he displayed clear concussive symptoms on the field, it was not required that he do the HIA 2 + 3 as concussion was clearly diagnosed due to what the medical officials could see.
you can argue, with merit, that Ireland stretch the elastic on this, but your post is factually incorrect in a few different aspects and disingenuous in others, your argument is much better placed if you stick to what is known.
Why are Ireland being so indifferent about HIA's
Look at England who have sent home 3 key players who have failed HIA's no questions asked and not doing HIA 2&3
Where has player welfare gone for Ireland?
This obsession with World Cups is so bizarre. People have been playing the game of rugby for almost 200 years, the World Cup has been around for 25 years.
4 teams ever have won a series in NZ - the Lions in 1971, Australia twice and South Africa once (in 1937).
I find this notion that we should just obsess over a tournament that comes around every four years and forget about trying to achieve things in the interim period really strange.
Or maybe achieving things they've never done before - like winning against the All Blacks in NZ or winning a Test series in NZ - will give them confidence to go on and do something else they've never done before.
I'm thinking long term. The benifit of getting lads involved would be great. The series counts for nothing in relation to next year's world cup!
Crazy thinking. Do you want to lose?
It's a chance to win a Test series in New Zealand. A chance to make history. And you want to hamstring the team?
Carbery got 50 minutes in the 1st Test, and played a big game against France in the 6N.
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