Old thread seems to be permanently locked. It will be interesting if anything can come of this at last.
Threadbanned Posters:
Surely post mortem would clear that up.
I clearly heard it said this morning on rte news on sky 521.
I don't know who it was claimed the gate went missing in the first place. It may have been a poster on an earlier thread here. It's a theory that seemed to gain creedence after the two documentaries were released. I think the detective from the forensics section who worked on the case and was interviewed in the Netflix film may have clarified what eventually happened with the gate. I can't recall exactly.
I find it interesting Nick Foster hasn't tweeted about it. He was the recipient of the letter from Schull where someone was enquiring about the watch being seen and disappearing if I remember correctly.
I ask myself what sort of a person would write rather than email and I answer an elderly person. And who would actually have seen a watch only someone at the very first discovery of the body. And whose circumstances have changed recently through bereavement.
I am hopeful finally Sophie's family can get an answer either through new witness evidence or advanced DNA techniques.
ok found it
In the GSOC report, the Gardai who were questioned didn't know what happened to it. So the gate was 'lost' to the Gardai, who are meant to be the keepers of the chain of evidence.
There were numerous issues with physical evidence and witness statements, including some illegal tampering with evidence.
https://www.thejournal.ie/grave-concern-over-missing-evidence-in-du-plantier-murder-investigation-4161933-Aug2018/
The Indo says the cold case review will use a new American system which can extract DNA from rocks.
We’ve been down this road before but the technology keeps improving. At least, her murderer will have some sleepless nights.
They mightn't even be alive at this stage.
You mean "he" might not be still alive, not "they". He's alive and well alright and living in Glengariff.
How do you know if it's he,she or they.
I don't remember any conviction(s).
Might be in their interest to confess now or run?
Good to have the input of the French Ambassador - presumably you've just been briefed by the Élysée Palace!
No, if they confess it’s a mandatory life sentence. If they run, they will be virtually admitting guilt and they would become Ireland’s most notorious fugitive. Nowhere will be safe.
Ian Bailey won’t do either. He offered to give blood samples when he believed the Gardai had samples of the attacker’s blood.
Anyone watched 'Murder in the Alps' on C4?
The French police investigating that case make the Gardai in this case seem quite competent.
I wonder is here a special form of incompetence that overtakes police forces when a foreign victim or suspect is involved?
Or is it just we are more likely to hear about them as the publicity shines a light...
That's quite easy to believe given the sham of a court case that convicted Ian Bailey in his absence. Evidence that the Gardai found unreliable was taken as gospel by the French.
It may not just be incompetence.
In the 'Murder in the Alps' case, it definitely seemed to be the case that the french prosecutor seemed to decide very quickly that the source of the murder lay in the UK and had nothing to do with the local French cyclist who was murdered.
I guess there are similarities with the Sophie Tuscan du Plantier murder where the Gardai seemed to focus solely on Ian Bailey from early on instead of keeping an open mind on other possible leads.
I'm not sure whether that's incompetence or some form of inbuilt bias where we like to think 'forriners' are bad and locals are purer than the driven snow.
Oh really? why wasn't it returned to its owners the Du Plantier family?
"sold to a scrapyard" ehh 😯...who got the money from the sale?..the amount of metal in it would have only worth a few Euros, I am sure the Du Plantier family would have preferred the front gate of their house returned rather than the couple of Euro coins from the Garda sale of it to a scrapyard!.
The family were offered it back but declined the offer.
I don't know where the "sold to a scrapyard" story came from.
Maybe he knew he had not left any blood. After all he would have known if he was bleeding. He could have covered his hair too. Wonder if he knew about M Vac when he sought the review. If they do not find anyone else Bailey will always be the suspect anyway
If they get clean away to another country they may never be found and if they come forward and frame the killing as manslaughter or even self defence in a believeable way there would be no life sentance.
The killer may never be caught even if they find DNA but there isn’t a chance in hell that the killer would get convicted of a reduced charge like manslaughter.
Admittedly, this jurisdiction may be the best place in the world for a killer to plead to a reduced charge (“he ran into my knife!”) but no jury in Ireland would believe this is anything other than a most brutal murder.
Smashing a defenceless woman’s head in self-defence?
It's well known that Bailey's arms were covered with scratches which, he claimed, he got while murdering turkeys. So, if he did it, then he'd have been a very foolish (or arrogant) man to to have though that he mightn't have left some blood at the scene.
"The family were offered it back but declined the offer" Has the family confirmed that somewhere, surely given the relevance the missing gate has garnered in the media they would have by now if that yarn was true.
Anyhow as I understand it the legal procedure is that the Gardai have to return property not required as evidence to its lawful owners..it would be up to the owners to dispose of it themselves if they wished.
And why would anybody not want a perfectly good gate that was part of the fittings on their property back.
. The scratches were on his arms which would have been covered at night. even so he would know had he bled, there would be stains on his shirt and arms. I have one or two hives on my arms and sometimes i get a rash and scratch and one might bleed. Blood is on my arm and shirt. even a tiny bleed is noticable. if i murdered someone I'd check. and whatever about being foolish Bailey is arrogant
Being arrogant is not a crime. There is no evidence to point towards Bailey and despite an incompetent garda force carrying out an investigation which appears to have, like yourself, made a presumption of guilt without any evidence (and also despite some members fabricating evidence against him), Bailey is still entitled to his name.
'Temporary insanity' defence? There were many other injuries also evidence of a prolonged struggle.
Irish law has opened the Pandora's Box of the insanity defence but this is an exceptional case. Unless the accused has spent the last 30 years chained to a wall in some foreign Bedlam, no Irish jury will have an scintilla of sympathy for a defence based on his mental state. Unlike every other Irish criminal, his offence will not be mitigated by a terrible childhood, former drug abuse (he's clean now, your Honour!), traumatic experience or anything else that might have affected his mental state that night.
Imagine the jury with Sophie's son watching them day after day during the trial. Would they return with their verdict and say anything other than "guilty of murder as charged"? Not if they wanted to go home afterwards.
"Imagine the jury with Sophie's son watching them day after day during the trial."
If they are swayed by that, they've no business on a jury as it is a recipe for a miscarriage of justice.
If you think a jury would not be swayed by that, you don't understand how trials work.
I'm not suggesting her son would do anything wrong. I mean the jury could never lose sight of the suffering which this crime has caused. No bad thing. Especially if they had to listen to some spoofer of a psychologist brought in to back up a plea of insanity.
Here's Senan Moloney's "yarn" about the gate.
Have you seen the photos of the "perfectly good gate"?
Would you want such a gate as a daily reminder on your property?
Edit, forgot link;
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