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US Supreme Court to overturn Roe vs Wade

Overheal

UPDATE: Chief Justice Roberts confirms the leak is authentic.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/chief-justice-john-roberts-confirms-roe-draft-opinion-is-real-announces-investigation-into-egregious-leak/

ORIGINAL:

Politico obtained a February draft of what appears to be the Majority opinion in a landmark decision scheduled to be formally announced this summer, that concerns a 15-week ban in Mississippi. The draft, which Politico published in full, explains the courts opinion, authored by Justice Samuel Alito, that Roe v Wade be reversed, thereby punting abortion rights back to lawmakers. Politico doubled down on the documents authenticity when questioned by other outlets.

Court watchers note the odds of leaks like this,

https://twitter.com/jonathanwpeters/status/1521309806430236672?s=21&t=IPlhRfKM_2xqHTNRPpI8oQ

Because this is not an official publication of a complete ruling, of course no changes have actually taken effect, but it has already become a breakthrough development. If the court indeed rules in this manner, many conservative states have abortion “trigger laws” which will immediately take enforcement effect, outlawing the practice in those states.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/05/02/supreme-court-abortion-draft-opinion-00029473

Within minutes of hitting politicos front page, the Supreme Court ordered its entrances barricaded from the public. Members of the public have already started to congregate there into the night. Reactions mixed. Clearly though, this will be the culmination of decades of conservative efforts to nakedly and politically overturn women’s right to choose.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UIYxT7Fe60c

(Politico journalist interviewed about the leak. Full leak pdf on their article page)^

https://twitter.com/ztpetrizzo/status/1521326052722843648?s=21&t=1MNPJ_QvnetbOWsICgenIA

This is going to be a watershed moment in US history…

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ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119009046#Comment_119009046

anybody who would vote against medical care for women because somebody on the internet got their back up is a complete f... actually I better stop there before I get banned.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008988#Comment_119008988

Well some of us lived there for extended periods of time. In my case, about a decade

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119009019#Comment_119009019

Not strange at all. The point which seems to have gone over your head is that by going on about, and sneering at, "God botherers" that fella who says he believes in God might eventually decide "actually, maybe I don't want to be on the same 'side' as bigots"

Case in point. I wouldn't consider myself religious, and if I had a vote in a State in the US today I'd vote to allow it (obviously with reasonable conditions/checks/protections etc), but here you are, getting my back up and I'm thinking "actually, maybe I wouldn't want to be associated with those people". Now I'd still vote to allow it, but if I was subjected to hearing that irrelevant and bigoted crap constantly for a while, I might be turned off it. Not because I'm personally affected, but because people have a freedom of religion and it isn't your right to try to abuse or discriminate against them for that.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119009005#Comment_119009005

Have you seen the Texas and Oklahoma laws? You can sue people for 'helping' and good luck getting a legal definition of helping.

But, otherwise I agree, women will still get abortions. The Texas law also allows lawsuits against women who travel elsewhere (e.g., Mexico) for their abortions.

The amount of mischief the States can get up to will grow enormously. Alito's reasoning is specious at best and full of nonsense. Maybe the opinion will be redone, but I think the vote will remain the same. Fair play to Roberts if its true he voted against this nonsense.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008988#Comment_119008988

Not really, plenty of us have US family members and plenty of us work with people in the US on a day to day basis. Eg I've worked with loads of people from Red states and even have family members that voted for Trump. So plenty of us have pretty informed views on the US and their politics.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008960#Comment_119008960

Strange tangent, but to clarify when I talk about "God Botherers" I'm referencing the fundamental Christians which have dictated government policy at state and federal level for decades.

Not some lad who says on a poll he believes in God.

DrumSteve

The amount of abortions taking place will stay the same, indeed anyone who has a few quid will do what they want regardless.

The difference now, is how many women will die.

growleaves

Imo Irish people underestimate the foreignness of the United States from their own understanding which is mostly refracted through media.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008934#Comment_119008934

What am I disagreeing with?

California is a liberal State. There would not be a hope of people passing a law there outlawing abortion. Yet it has 54% of people who say they believe in "God" with absolute certainty and another 22% percent that are "fairly certain"

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/state/california/

If I was some person that wanted to bring in abortion in California, I'd be recruting the likes of yourself who don't actually care about abortion, but have a different agenda, to try to push those voters towards me. The only way to get it in would be to have the likes of you sneering at and riling up that 76% with stupidity and polarisation.

Fian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008805#Comment_119008805

A federal ban through congress would risk the end of the united states, with e.g. New York and California potentially going their own way. which is why it won't happen.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008916#Comment_119008916

Oh right so you are not actually disagreeing with me, you are afraid to cause offense.

Which is quite surprising given your hanger "joke".

growleaves

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008904#Comment_119008904

That's fine. If you are only interested in your own agenda against "god botherers" then push that and distract from what others consider to be the actual issue if you want.

A person would have to be retarded not to know that one way to rally the "other side" in certain US States is to make something about religion or to try to slur them for it. It would be easily discernible from your actions whether you actually cared about the substantive issue or whether it just happened to be a convenient tool for a different agenda.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008879#Comment_119008879

Huh? If you are coerced or raped by an abusive partner and fall pregnant, you are tied to that abuse in someway for the rest of your life. 'Sure haven't they birth control' isn't quite the silver bullet you think it is.

"God Botherers" is perfectly apt or who do you think is throwing money at the criminalisation of women seeking medical treatments?

I doubt its the atheists. 😕

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008805#Comment_119008805

It would be open to take a case all the way to the Supreme Court to have something akin to "right to life of the unborn" recognised as a constitutional right. If that was done and succeeded, then the States could not legislate to allow for it.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008827#Comment_119008827

Well if you are coerced into getting pregnant, then you're probably at risk of being retaliated against for not being pregnant later on. So I wouldn't put too much emphasis on that unless there was no other point to make

If it goes to the State level, some will provide it and some won't. You wouldn't have a hope of getting it banned in liberal States. There will be some where it would be banned almost immediately.

If people decide to use language like "God botherers" to push a certain agenda, that likely won't help any argument as it will merely distract from the issue at hand.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008551#Comment_119008551

Not exactly, also the God bothers are going after birth control too at state level.

Either way I very much doubt it helps women who were raped or raped and coerced into getting pregnant.

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008805#Comment_119008805

and even if that didnt happen we would see at a state level not just bans but criminalisation of abortion for women in red states including those who travel out of state to get one.

Podge_irl

I would imagine that if this judgment is real in the US, there would be a later constitutional challenge at the SC to try to have abortion outlawed explicitly.

The very nature of this (apparent) ruling would make that highly unlikely. The very logic they use to allow legislatures to ban it would equally apply to legislatures ability to explicitly allow it.

What is potentially does open the door to would be a federal ban through congress.

ancapailldorcha

What a rancid stain of a system where judges can just arbitrarily award and withdraw rights as they see fit. What a horrible country.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008641#Comment_119008641

Those stats are the stats for a person who uses only that method to prevent getting pregnant in a year. It's not quite the same as a 1-in-100 chance every time you get the ride (I'm sure you know, but many get confused). And people can combine different protections anyway. Still, my point was only to the implication that women were going to be almost forcibly rounded up and forced to push out baby after baby. That's a bit dramatic. At least in the US they have fairly robust procedures for chasing down the fathers.

From a skimming of the reports, it seems they will strike down the Constitutional right to it. There won't be an automatic and immediate ban of it. It would just put it back to the lawmakers in their respective states (In Ireland, the Constitution now explicitly delegates the provision of termination of pregnancy to Legislation) . I would imagine that if this judgment is real in the US, there would be a later constitutional challenge at the SC to try to have abortion outlawed explicitly. But I didn't gather that the OP's links were suggesting that was at play yet.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008551#Comment_119008551

Pharmacist here, even if you have the mirena coil, the most effective contraception device. You still have a 1% chance of getting pregnant. So there is always a risk of pregnancy. This just makes everything less safe and will lead to women having an increased risk of death due to not being able to get proper abortion aftercare/ illegal abortions. They'll go after contraception next, I guarantee. It was alluded to in the leaked ruling. The so called "Land of the free"

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008400#Comment_119008400

To be fair, most females in the US have freely available access to birth control (and it would seem that most are on it). Obviously mistakes happen or whatever. So it isn't quite women being forced to have children.

Anyway, I'm off to buy a few shares in coat hanger manufacturers.

(dark humour maybe but reflects the point that there is still going to be a demand for it)

JayPS 2288

Wonderful news. As a previous poster eloquently put it (albeit with several Americanisms in their diction), the Roe vs. Wade was the antithesis of the abolition of the 8th amendment.

Great to see liberal rules allowing the purposeful killing of disabled and “inconvenient” babies once more restricted. Great news to start the day.

Penn

Let's not forget what this is really about; increase birth rates, decrease wealth, make more people struggle financially, make it harder for them to get good jobs and have to take minimum wage jobs (often more than one) to make ends meet and be more susceptible to enduring worse working conditions.

It's cheap labour force. That's all it is. The vast majority of people making the decisions about these laws would happily and easily use abortion services if they needed to. But opposing abortion rights makes them seem "Christian" enough to be more electable, despite being some of the least Christian people imaginable in how they treat and view anyone who they see as being beneath them.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008310#Comment_119008310

"Eire"?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008443#Comment_119008443

The "land of the free" was always an empty slogan, or at least one that was variable depending on the freedoms involved and who was looking for them. The guy who wrote the anthem including that line viewed African Americans as inferior, as most did at the time. It was no land of the free for them, or the natives, or the Chinese when they showed up later on.

Sudden Valley

Has to be a positive for the democrats though, if it happens. They basically have very little that gets their base energised. They were basically only the anti Trump party in the last election and minorities make up about 2/3 of abortions so this is something for them to rally their base.

seamus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008448#Comment_119008448

Conservatives in the US don't care whether people will die, it's all about the money. Cash flowing in from big religious sects and other vile scumbags is what drives them to keep pushing back against clear human rights issues.

Conservatives politicians in the US want the men poor and toiling, and the women barefoot and pregnant. And 14. That's their wet dream.

Cody montana

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008310#Comment_119008310

The majority of people support it though.

Abortion won’t stop.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119008440#Comment_119008440

America and the shìtes Trump left behind are desperate to bring back that 17th Century glory that made America "great".

A lot of the marketing guff America used to brand itself on has fallen apart.