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Do speed vans take pictures of the driver?

Orlak2410

Could I say that a named driver was driving the car when it was caught by a speed can and get away with it? Not saying I'm doing it but just in theory because I was done by a Garda with a speed gun and feel it might be unfair if people can get away with it with speed vans.

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AckwelFoley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118970621#Comment_118970621

Yes there is. Speed vans are calibrated each time. But they allow 10% for fluctuation in car speedometer readings.

I don't believe it's formal and written in stone but I expect it's based on a court precident

brokenangel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118978707#Comment_118978707

if you can’t remember who was driving I would argue you shouldn’t be on the road in the first place 😂

flexcon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118978851#Comment_118978851

Not having a go here but that's a very very odd take.

What has my memory of who was driving the family car 2 weeks ago at a certain time got to do with being on the road in the first place?

As someone who grew up on a farm with 4 siblings, 2 workers and and a dad who regularly shared the pajaroo jeep it would be objectively believable that a speeding fine sent 2 weeks after the date would raise questions to who was driving at that exact time. It would be "get the diary out, check your call logs on the phone, check your ical". It's not something that would be immediately obvious.

Orlak2410

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118978851#Comment_118978851

Haha you may be right but if two people share a car and drive around the same areas all the time and it takes two weeks for a letter to come out you could easily make a genuine mistake

Orlak2410

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118978878#Comment_118978878

Exactly they can’t penalise people for genuine mistakes like that. As was stated previously, they would probably send out the full pic after the wrong person takes responsibility and give you another chance to reconsider who may have been driving that day

brokenangel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118979131#Comment_118979131

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118979097#Comment_118979097

If you want to nominate someone else to take a speeding fine for you, just go and do it. Not sure why you are spending so long on here trying to convince yourself.

You have been warned, if something happens then you can't really go crying to anyone

mikeecho

The gosafe vans catch very few drivers.

So few, that they have repeatedly reduced their tolerance for what they issue a ticket for.

Anyone caught by a gosafe, deserves it, they are driving blind.

These vans have a ridiculously short range, if you can't see a transit from 15m away, you should stay at home.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118971314#Comment_118971314

If you can't stop speeding leave our roads alone

AnonZen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118979744#Comment_118979744

Out of curiosity, is that a limit of the equipment or they've just decided that's the range they want to focus the camera at?

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980006#Comment_118980006

Limitation of the equipment, and the manner in which it is set up.

The radar/camera system is designed to be optimal when on top of a stationary pole .

But works just fine at the height it's at in the van, in fact in some countries, they put it on a mobile tripod.

ThebitterLemon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118979744#Comment_118979744

Seriously, the only have a “catch” range of 15m, I googled it earlier and it said the laser technology in gosafe vans can catch you over a kilometre away on a straight road?

TbL

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118981999#Comment_118981999

Presumably this is down to the need for manual confirmation which uses two images taken over a defined time gap. If the images are of a car 1km away then the margin of error would be quite large.

That and they don't want to be doing every driver out there!

Tippman24

I was at the Ploughing Championship a few times and a van is available to view at the RSA stand. There was also a few people from the GOSAFE team available to ask questions to about the range of the vans.

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118981999#Comment_118981999

They don't use laser. They use radar. And the speed reading and picture is taken at the same time.

The 1km range you read about is in the UK, where they have a man in a van with a laser gun with a camera attached,and he manually targets the traffic.

The gosafe system is completely automated and uses a dual radar system made by agd.

Think of the old pole mounted gatso cameras we had before, they only photographed you in the area with the white painted lines,. Very short range.

a-gatso-speed-camera-and-road-markings-with-a-car-just-about-to-go-BNND8C.jpg

ThebitterLemon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118982681#Comment_118982681

That’s really really helpful

Thank you for putting that together

So at a distance of 100 metres you’re very unlikely to be “caught”

thanks again

TbL

Ger Roe

I once got a speed notice for a car that myself and another person drove regularly. I asked for the full photo (not just reg plate crop) and received one that just about allowed me to determine which one of us it was, driving on the particular day. The specific driver could be identified in the full photo supplied - although it would be by accident more than design... you could not guarantee identification with the potential for bad lighting conditions and window glare/reflection etc. I don't think the quality of the photo would ever stand up in court as a means of identification.

It was just for my own convenience in paying the fine and applying the points fairly - no one ever came to check what either of the two potential drivers looked like, by comparing against the grainy photo supplied.

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118983006#Comment_118983006

You're welcome, I did my best to dumb it down, and not get too technical.

Hopefully it will make sense to others.

newmember2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980473#Comment_118980473

some countries?...they use tripods in Ireland.

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118999937#Comment_118999937

Can you provide an example?

I know you can't.

newmember2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119000344#Comment_119000344

Yes...have seen it many times. Down near the bottom of the Tallaght by-pass near Tempoleogue bridge would be one example off the top of my head. Have seen it at Cherrywood before also.

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119001425#Comment_119001425

Not for speed cameras.

That tripod is for a laser gun.

newmember2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119001518#Comment_119001518

Ah OK, although they all mean the same thing to me when I see them.

AckwelFoley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118978725#Comment_118978725

I've actually seen some information now as to why there is a 10% allowance for speed vans.

Different wheel sizes, specifically the diameter will have have an effect on the speedometer readings on a vehicle.

Tyre rolling radius difference of 80mm, Can have a 4km/h deviation in vehicle speedometer readings.

In essence if you change wheel or tyre size on your vehicle it has an effect on your speedometer reading

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037267#Comment_119037267

A difference in radius of 80mm would be huge. The difference in diameter between a new tyre and a worn tyre should only be around 14mm or about 2% for the average car.

As tyres wear from new to fully worn, the speedometer will therefore progressively show a speed of up to approx 2% higher than it would with new tyres.

European law (ECE-R39) says speedometers cannot show speeds less than the actual speed, and they must never show more than the 110 per cent of actual speed plus 4 km/h.

The speedometer should never indicate a speed lower than the actual speed and should be calibrated to allow for tyre wear and still not show more than 110% + 4 km/h with fully worn tyres.

If you change the wheel size or tyre size on your car, the ECU should be reprogrammed to match the new wheel size so the speedometer remains within legal accuracy limits.

AckwelFoley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037651#Comment_119037651

My apologies, I meant to say tyre rolling circumference difference of 80mm the static radius difference is 13mm.

It was only in relation to wheel change, as opposed to tyre wear. I'm thinking when people mod cars and put low profiles on them etc. Are they reprogramming ecu? Perhaps they won't pass the NCT if they don't?

I seem this detail today relation to wheels usually used in trailers but the speedo stats were there none the less

Interesting though, because not something i would have ever taken onto consideration

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037889#Comment_119037889

Interestingly the NCT manual doesn't indicate that the speedometer accuracy is checked, only that a speedometer is fitted, working (including light), can be seen easily from the driver's seat and meets requirements (type approval at time of first registration).

However I wouldn't like to try arguing my way out of a speeding penalty by claiming I had fitted oversized wheels (most likely an unapproved modification with the possible knock on insurance implications).