If being an unaligned country with a large army is no deterrent to Putin's ambitions is it time for ROI to join Nato?
Francie would be straight on to boards to tell us how he prefers borscht to fish and chips in any case
We're not neutral as seen over the last few years , burying our heads in the muck saying we have a piece of paper with neutral written on it and that's going to protect us if everything goes tits up .
It's cowardice nothing more ,
What a sh*tshow this thread has become.
So you won't accept any criticism of NATO without accusing the person making it of being a pro-Russian traitor?
In that case there's no "debate" is there, so what are we even talking for?
Things changed in 2014 too, invasion and annexation. People were still going to Putin making deals on energy, looking for his vote in the UN, allowing him channel his money through Europe etc.
European security has been under threat and has been breached also for a very long time.
Have you ..
Didn't think so
You don't think that when European security is threatened has nothing to do with it?
You don't think that anything has changed since Feb, as if we are still living likes its 2021?
I see by the one-word answers you have run out of gumption and options now.....
You are a beaten docket, Francie. Out of ideas, morals and options.
Yanks bad, Hamas not so much.
Poor ol Ruari O'Bradaigh was right about SF, Workers Party part deux
So?
Course they could mark. Of course they could.
Syria is not in Europe Francie.....
Are you too lazy to respond?
As I said, the facts changed on the ground since the invasion, but Francie like the Iron Lady is not for turning. Hence why you are zealot.
The Russians could land a division in Galway Bay tomorrow and Francie would be posting his usual talking points here.
Chemical weapons have been used in Syria too. Didn't change my mind about us being in NATO then.
Use of CW is a war crime.
What?
Have you mistaken an emphasis on 'us' for US? If so apologies, but with 'the' missing you really should have worked it out.
???
Ahahahaha. Ah for f*ck sake! Now we're getting somewhere.
You want defence for Europe but defanged from from the thing that makes it effective.
We're now getting to the point where you're finally being honest. This isn't about defence, security of the continent or being "anti-war", it's about wingnut anti-Americanism.
For once Francie, your candour is noted and appreciated.
Unbelievable.
Ireland has taken 10,000 Ukrainian refugees so far, with talks of up to 200,000 being taken in
Russia threatening the use of nuclear weapons on a weekly basis
Intelligence reports growing on the proposed use of Russian chemical weapons
The biggest land war raging in Europe since 1945...
... and we have Francie here saying nothing has changed at all!
Comical Ali
With Finland and Sweden looking to join, Ireland could soon be the obvious Achilles heel to Europe
But sure our legendary peace keeping/immigrant ferrying status would be threatened if we were part of NATO...
Again, the facts change and you don't change your mind. Today we are hearing reports that the Russians are preparing to use chemical weapons in Ukraine. I guess if/when this happens you will still be here with your soft weasel words about how nothing has really changed.....
I am anti US being in NATO. The topic of the thread.
Ukraine wanted to and still wants to be in NATO, what they feared would happen because they weren't in it, has happened.
This is a bit like the IRA saying they would drive the British from Ireland.
What would you expect a militant force to say Yurt...'eh, well maybe we will gain a foothold in Ukraine and see how we get on and then maybe invade the rest of Europe'.
Of course they are going to talk up what they are going to do. As we have seen they seem to be struggling at base one.
So you're anti NATO but think Ukraine should be in NATO because the protection it affords?
Here Francie, you're a waste of time.
I said earlier I won't insult your intelligence. At the risk of going back on my word, I'll bow out for today.
Putin took the line of least resistance (he thought) and attacked a sovereign country that IMO should have been in NATO.
Are you seriously asking me to believe that he is capable of 'marching on into Europe'?
What a numpty laded post. Of course Europe is on the precipice of something far more dangerous. Open a newspaper or turn on the news. Millions of refugees streaming across the continent and Russian news openly speculating on invading further countries.
AND what's more, the only thing holding things back for now is NATO.
You're so ridiculous and so wilfully blind.
On Libya as some here seem to view Nato's involvement there as in some way an attempt to destabilise the country.
In fact the mission was approved at the UN to save lives. As the anti Gadaffi rebellion had failed and he promised to -
Qaddafi called protesters "cockroaches" and vowed to cleanse Libya "inch by inch, house by house, home by home, alleyway by alleyway."
This sounds like genocide to me I am sure the usual suspects will see it differently.
Nothing that has been said on this thread - the impending danger to Ireland-Europe on a precipice etc, is a 'fact' IMO and no it has not changed my mind on us joining NATO.
Now you lack all credibility. This is the deepest security crisis in Europe in a generation with a fascist on the march.
We're on a thread about security and defence issues and you refuse to even call what we're seeing correctly and deploying weasel words about a war that could spin of complete control for the continent.
Zero credibility, wingnut boogeyman contributions, and excuse making for a fascist. You really should be ashamed of yourself.
And a final point, quit trying to paint me in a position about Irish NATO membership that I don't hold.
My criticism of NATO would have been the same with or without Russian aggression or invasion.
So, even though the facts and circumstances change you don't change your mind. Only fundamentalists and zealots think like that Francie.
Seems to me the NATO champions have just come out of the woodwork since the full invasion. Opportunism at it finest, I would suggest and the use of a tragic war for political purposes.
Overblown scaremongering isn't going to advance the 'join NATO' argument. Seems to me Putin is finding it extremely difficult to take Ukraine, so the 'Europe on a precipice' argument sounds a bit OTT.
I am not particularly interested in Russia.
Of course, you are not, as it does not suit your pro-Putin and pro-Kremlin agenda to get a dig in at NATO. It's as if this conversation is happening on Mars and the issue in Ukraine has nothing at all to do with us, or the defence of the nation going forward.
We have a charlatan at work here folks.
