Granted there's not a lot of them but women do work in construction, food processing etc so I don't know what you mean.
I take your point regarding specialized skills, there's no argument there and it goes to the point I was making about trying to match skills to employers. I don't know if that will be a runner, but we'll have to wait and see.
As for the govt not knowing what they are doing, no argument there. Nobody does as this is an unprecedented situation. I liken it to covid when that kicked off, nobody has a clue what to do and it was a shambles. As time went on we got a better handle on it. This will be no different
O Gorman is a do gooder virtue signaller and wants to be liked by his crowd for being such a humanitarian but the results of what hes doing will only be felt down the line when he iis out of the hot seat. Its typical of this government get short term approval at all costs and **** the future. He has no kids nor does Leo so they dont think like family men with childrens futures to think about. Children make people grow up and become mature until you actually have that responsibility for little ones you have no clue of their needs thats why its a dire mess they are making for twitter likes !!
You are quite right to be concerned, because we are staring into an abyss.
if I was a teacher, would I bust my hole encouraging Irish kids to do their best ? Doesn’t feel right enabling them with false hope…
ultimately, now…
get sick, you are fûcked
look for a chosen college place, you are fûcked…
stiiting on roads and in public transport for an inordinately large percentage of your week…
if current Ireland is getting bleak, future Ireland will certainly be more bleak, more unfair, more against opportunities for taxpayers…
I take it that in conjunction with 200k Ukrainians the government is continuing with the amnesty for the 8k in direct provision, amnesty for illegals here estimated at 17k by government n will also be paying a billion in foreign aid this year. Sure it'd be racist not too I suppose!
I know you can't answer this, but I'm slightly concerned about how this will play out.
Most / almost all the Ukrainian refugees are women with young children or older people of pensionable age. Given these demographics, I'm struggling to see how they will fill skills shortages in the Irish economy, which are primarily in construction and food processing, plus tech and health care. It's fair to say that few young mothers will be lining up to work on building sites or in an abattoir. In fact, I read a report from Poland that quite a few construction projects have halted there because such a large number of Ukrainian men returned home to fight.
Tech and health care require specialized skills that only a relatively small % of any population possesses. That's before we even contemplate the language barrier...
My overriding sense here is that the government is in panic mode and hasn't a clue what they are doing. I happened to catch the Roderick O'Gorman interview on Newstalk whilst driving home yesterday evening. To say that he does not inspire confidence, is a gross understatement.
Personally, I'm very concerned about how this is evolving. The projected numbers have grown exponentially from 10k to 20K to 80K to 100K and now to 200K. As somebody with young children, I'm also worried about the impact this will have on access to educational and medical services going forward.
You have to understand that as your cousin is Irish she has to work with the Irish social welfare system so is liable to be interrogated intensely when claiming anything, thats the guidance given to social welfare inspectors. Asylum seekers and refugees are in a different system so don't have to go through the same hoops as some elderly person person who sees their carer hours cut due to lack of funding while millions are spent on funding for new arrivals. Same as O Gorman can promise own door accommodation withing three months for newcomers while native Irish can spend 10 years on housing lists.
The intention is the visa these folks will be given will allow them to live and work freely without restrictions so a lot should be able to get into some kind of employment reasonably quickly. This should ensure the pressure on the exchequer is alleviated to some extent.
I know there are plans underway for some employers to be matched with some Ukrainians where a skills match is identified. This is in early stages so there should hopefully be more on this in the coming weeks.
DaCor believes that Ireland (or any western nation) should accept/encourage an unlimited number of foreign born migrants. It's come up on this and other threads. Basically, he's previously covered the pov that it would be great if Irish people were a minority in their own nation as long as it's an ethnically/culturally diverse society.
He is the poster child for multiculturalism. Good luck getting any logical thinking, or realistic/practical consideration of the problems involved though. Everything is perfect in "la la" land.
There was an article last week saying it'll cost an average of 33k a head to accommodate each refugee in a hotel for a year. Welfare, children's allowance , medical cards, extra teachers etc etc on top of that. The children's hospital will be peanuts in comparison.
The government don't intend to pay a subsidy to house owners for hosting which is very unfair if the alternative is 33k a year in a hotel. The Brits are giving 350£ a month to owners.
I must have missed it in amongst all the nonsense and this stupid new boards doesn't allow you just click on a profile and see their previous posts. I guess it will be lost to posterity. It doesn't wind me up, I just don't understand it.
If I go to England, I like to meet English people and chat with them. If I go to Spain, I like to meet Spanish people and chat with them. Same in any country I go to. Ireland is the same, according to a lot of Failte Ireland tat, come meet the locals. You seem to want a hodge podge of homogeneity with no defining culture or "locals".
My rationale has been explained multiple times in this thread.
If a different opinion winds you up.......
was talking to my cousin of FB, she’s on disability as she recovers from a LTI and cannot work… she is returning to health and will be back healthy later in the year, after a difficult three years… but today in tears as she gets a letter from the social welfare to attend an interview with some **** to prove she is entitled to claim. Some rancid knacker of an individual up in mellows road with all the manners of a castrated hedgehog in her correspondence…which she showed me. A seriously unreal lack of courtesy and professionalism…
asked to bring everything from bank statements and so on to prove she’s not sitting on xxxxxxxx grand, she’s sitting on a couch a lot as she isn’t good on her feet, in pain and uses crutches…
so in one breadth we are facilitating tens of thousands of people from the Ukraine with tens of thousands in assistance per person but my cousin who has worked full time since she left college and never asked anything of the state most of her adult life has to go and be victim of a cross examination, just to receive what she is entitled to… worried sick now because they are coming they are after her due to the ‘new arrivals’… and the state being under pressure…on the balance sheet…she’s right…
she’s done fantastic in her rehab, has paid for a private physio instead of a state one… living in private accommodation….so what she is costing the state is negligible yet her ‘entitlement’ important and needed…
but, now just as we are inviting tens of thousands and the bill for that…. She’s called in for an ‘interview’ to justify her ability to get help.
this .. another product of multiculturalism, more pressure, more bullying of citizens, taxpayers, this is just the beginning.
Semantics, eh? Course it was. Why would you want Ireland flooded with non-nationals? I understand giving refuge until the war is over. I don't understand your rationale, unless, of course, it's to wind people up.
Well yeah, if they are on a stamp 4, which is what it sounds like, then their stay is counted as reckonable which means they will qualify for citizenship so strictly speaking after that point they are no longer refugees, semantics I suppose.
Either way I'm delighted to see how many are being granted the chance to come to Ireland.
But you weren't talking about war zone refugees when you said some will stay for the "some will live here for the rest of their lives.......the more the merrier".
Pretty much our government and anyone who thinks taking 200k people in is a good idea.
a 5% population increase over a few weeks and months for a country this size and all will be exclusively depending on this state, for everything…. So a fair number will stay and will be of that ability as has been acknowledged.
you choose to dress it up in disingenuous terms, I’ll stick to what’s happening.
How dare they provide safe harbour for war zone refugees
Those bastages!
The more the merrier for them, certainly. :)
the more also, the greater challenge to the wellbeing of us Irish people,, which has being eroded over time already… and will continue to be as politicians make these decisions to compromise our wellbeing.
It sounds like they will be on a stamp 4 type of permission which is reckonable for citizenship so its very possible that some may stay and become full citizens.
Even if some don't, its unlikely that Ireland is going to turf them out if the war is still raging or Ukraine is still in ruins.
So yeah, some will live here for the rest of their lives and personally I don't have an issue with that, the more the merrier
Yes, what percentage ( I believe it will be high ) will apply for leave to remain ? If Russia, stands down, withdraws…. It could easily flare up again.
while here the Ukraine visitors will get used life here, feel safe here, will become accustomed to our social welfare system, free healthcare, comfortable standards of living, amenities, far from the threat of Russia why wish to return ? Some will but I’ve a feeling a big enough percentage will seek leave to remain.
You plan for the worst but hope for the best. They don’t even have a compensation plan for the properties being offered. Three months from now the generosity of offers will dry up if people are not being paid and I’ve no doubt they will be as it’s the tax payer footing the bill. I wonder how many Dail members will be hosting refugees and paying for it out of their own pocket?
Imaging you are a student in say Donegal…after working your hole off. You want to come to Dublin to study medicine…you have the points…
where are you going to live ? rent will be sky high, if you can find anything ! Supply vs demand in an industry that political people don’t wish to regulate ….How will you live ?
country is a shîtshow
Is anyone allowed to ask the conditions on them returning? Because this could easily turn into economic migration for the long term.
It’s too easy because it’s too obvious as to what’s going to happen.
the script is written and for Irish people it’s not going to be a happy ending.
TBH It's just too easy to rain doom and gloom on this overall situation...
Simon Coveney was on the news saying other services may suffer. I’m not sure he’s prepared for interest rate hikes and servicing our existing debt. Then add rising fuel and energy cost with inflation and we are looking at some tough times ahead with limited government help.
They are also looking at putting refugees in student accommodation, that will be interesting to see what happens when the next term starts. Good luck getting a place to live in Dublin as a student. I’m still not seeing long term plans on how this is going to work.
Also the digs are already starting about how this refugee crisis is being dealt with compared to Syria or the ME, as of course there are no social or religious problems from those places, they’ll all be down the local for a pint.
On about 200k now potentially coming in. Our politicians are dangerous fools to allow that.
I can see their point in that we should absolutely be deciding on applications faster
That we should be approving their applications faster... I doubt many of them would be willing to drop the multiple rounds of appeals so that administrators can focus on those in the system.
Deportations of those here illegally, or those who have had their Asylum claim denied, would free up loads of resources, allowing us to cater to the needs of the Ukrainian refugees. However, I agree with you that these refugees are here for the long-term. Thankfully, the focus is on them working, rather than providing Asylum-like supports, so there's scope for the economy to grow. We're likely to see a rash of small sized companies spring up, especially in tech, which is something the Irish economy kinda lacks after covid and past recessions.
But yes, we're setting ourselves up for a fall.. but there is an opportunity here too.
Site is still fundamentally broken, 8/9 months on or whatever it is.
Anyway...
Listening to NT here and predictably now the Asylum seekers are complaining about our response to Ukrainian refugees and essentially want the same fast tracking.
I can see their point in that we should absolutely be deciding on applications faster, but I am increasingly concerned about the Ukrainian response for different reasons having listened to O'Gorman yesterday on NT as well.
There seems to be no thought of an upper limit of Ukrainian refugees that we will accept. Instead the focus seems to be acquiring or repurposing accommodation to house them and issuing PPS numbers and settling them for what seems to be the medium to long term with numbers in the tens of thousands or higher still being floated.
Now, we should absolutely help as much as we can, but what seems to be happening here is the same free for all that we've already been feeling the effects of with the existing asylum seekers/DP system.
As genuinely tragic as the situation in Ukraine is, the reality is that we cannot support or house everyone that arrives on our doorstep (a texter to O'Gorman's segment rightly pointed out that wouldn't it be great if we could be so responsive to our existing housing crisis), but so far the response seems to be more about virtue signalling our willingness to help and the more naive among the population calling for Irish and NATO involvement (which would only escalate the situation to a place we don't want to go).
As unpopular as the above may be, are we sleepwalking into yet another crisis?
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