Yes, a proxy war for the west vs Russia.
I believe when I mentioned this as a possibility last week I was slated by certain posters for demeaning the ukrainian situation. Its the likely outcome - west keeps selling arms to Ukraine, they allow soldiers to fight under the Ukrainian banner, but no overt declarations of war (due to nuclear deterrent).
Good for arms dealers, bad for Ukrainians as it will prolong the conflict.
Who did?
"But they presumably expected that when they invade"
I'm not totally sure about that. I think they might have expected that when push came to shove, Ukrainian army wouldn't fight for Zelensky, and it would be less of an invasion than a coup. This isn't Afghanistan. They see Ukraine as Russian. They want it as a functioning vassal state to boost them not a bombed out rubble draining their economy. But they might reduce it to rubble if they think it's gone from their orbit forever.
Note the button for depositing unsuccessful henchmen into the shark pool. 😄
That's because they have to meet high societal and economic standards. Is why it takes years and years.
No way they'll let the least developed simply skip the queue undertaking no reforms that take years.
None of this is serious possibility.
Mwahahaha! Now I can copy his signature onto any document of my choosing! <strokes white, long-haired cat>
Yes, they almost definitely will eventually conquer it if they so wish. Holding it will be a nightmare and all the while their own economy will be tanked by sanctions. They will be unlikely to profit at all from their new acquisition given the instability, it will suck manpower and resources from an army that can ill afford them and all the while their currency will be worth nothing, and they'll all be locked out of Europe/US. And all to paint a different colour on a map.
And nothing I have read from those who know better have suggested that Russia did know this when the invaded because otherwise their strategy makes absolutely zero sense.
There is nothing rational about continuing this course of action.
It's also a signal that despite Russian threat-demands that Ukraine should never join EU, they are still in the queue as far as the EU is concerned.
60 have gone from the UK in the last few days. Ex-Territorial Army, Ex-SAS, Ex-Royal Marines and a number of "Adventurers".
Wonder will many Irish go? Quite a few went out to fight for the Croats in the 1990's.
What role did he have in the Ukrainian government until 2019?
I'll spare you the effort Googling trying to backfill a post that you didn't know was disinformation, he wasn't a member of the government, he was merely a member of the parliament.
Can people please please start doing some fact-checking on themselves? People are so willing to become vessels for propaganda it's ridiculous*
*I know it's propaganda because I've seen it being repeated a number of times by people making excuses for Putin. "Nazis in the government" canard and referencing this very item of disinformation. It's one of the lies that has become a pretext for a fascist war, and you're eating it up like a Mars bar.
Okay, but some key points. Countries are mainly donating arms to Ukraine, not selling them. It's becoming a proxy war not by choice, but by necessity.
As for your last comment "bad for Ukrainians as it will prolong the conflict" - hmmm, I'm getting vibes that you just want the West to capitulate to Russian demands and sacrifice Ukraine. As mentioned, we've done that before, it doesn't work, it just encourages Putin.
I can see a minority queueing outside the Russian embassy with their 'End US Hegemony Now' pamphlets in their back pockets.
I would go, how do I apply? Ive only got basic skills
Pussy...
Big efforts by Russia to force investors and people to sell foreign reserves, try to bump up the value of RUB
Zelinskiy.
There's a growing chorus of people that want to see Ukrainians cut their own throats, extinguish their state and lay themselves down in front of the tanks of fascism so that Putin can walk away from this saving some face. Capitulation is the precise word.
Oh I'm talking about 2014 when the Russian puppet got toppled and fled the country.
Zelenskiy has signed the request to join the EU. Good for Ukrainian morale.
Wow, so a neo-nazi founder of a neo-nazi group officially incorporated into the Ukrainian national guard was merely a member of parliament, that changes everything.
To fight for Ukraine? Fly to Poland, get to Lviv and the Georgian National League unit have a mobilisation base in the city. They are the foreign Merc contingent. Commander Mamuka Mamulashvili is the man to ask for. Apparently.
Vladimir Putin is Mr. Burns with none of the redeeming qualities.
Yes it does, because a prime-time fascist in the Kremlin is using it as an excuse to extinguish a nation, pumps out disinformation to rubes like you about "Nazis in government" when the man was merely an extremely isolated member of parliament, and you swallow the propaganda and barf it back out everywhere without switching on your brain.
Hard to get a decent plumber as it is...
I think given Russia's behaviour this past week there is a real chance that Finland will end up a member of NATO by the time 2023 rolls around. Certainly the contrast of what did not happen to the Baltic nations as opposed to what is happening to Ukraine makes the benefits of NATO membership crystal clear.
Maybe the 3 NATO countries on Belarus's borders need to start massing troops there. Lukashenko would be forced to counter them with his troops reducing his ability to send those troops into Ukraine.
If Lukashenko ever gets voted out of power in Belarus, Mad Vlad would try the same caper there that he's currently undertaking in Ukraine. He wouldn't wait for the noises about joining the EU or NATO. He'd want to put the kibosh on that right away.
Liz Truss says in House of Commons that they will not rest until Ukraine's sovereignty has been restored. Will this extend to Crimea?
Talks have broken for today. Apparently there are "common positions" they can work with.
Will resume in next few days.
I think some feel uncomfortable at the possible notion of a greater conflict, which I get. They want us to take the normal actions without doing anything too provocative, again I get.
However the red line has been fully crossed, we now have Europe in war. We're past the appeasement stage, it didn't work. If this makes people uncomfortable or scared, they should be. Very serious situation, very serious measures are required. Putin knows the second that the EU and US start to fracture and weaken and will take full advantage, thankfully that hasn't been happening.
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