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Irish Judicial Decisions That are soft on criminal

[Deleted User]

I think it will be useful to have a discussion on Irish Court sentences for convicted criminals, particularly recidivist criminals, and also act as a repository to links to the court cases

Irish Courts seem to be unduly lenient and looking at other threads their leniency seems to be both common, and lead to repeat criminals being free to seriously hurt or maim normal law-abiding people. The original term for outlaw, meant the person was outside the protection of the law, so could be punished with impunity by fellow citizens. The modern outlaw seems to be under the protection of the law

Anyway to get things started from today's paper, 71 previous convictions, and assaulted a minor causing harm, https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/man-who-punched-boy-14-and-knocked-him-to-the-ground-avoids-prison-41313748.html

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[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586579#Comment_118586579

I agree, judges should be able to set minimum tariffs.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586466#Comment_118586466

2.5kg is 25k worth or so

it would actually have been much closer to 6-7kg. Gardai value it at €20/g but street prices vary and in large amounts it’s never €20/g

[Deleted User]

We shouldn’t be sending 21 year olds to prison for a decade for drug offences. No way. Better to decriminalise drugs than to do that. Come down hard though on the violent offenders any sort of violence whatsoever, these people should be locked away and forgotten about.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586715#Comment_118586715

i would imagen the courts use the value set by Gardai not by the offender, saying that 56-7 kilos most certainly deserved a substantial sentence of 10 years taking into the account my previous post

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586747#Comment_118586747

yeah, I think the valuations are on purpose inflated to make it look worse.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586823#Comment_118586823

well values vary wildly according to where you are and the way the product is sold .

One gram of something sold as flake cocaine might be 100 E in mayo or kerry and 60 or 70 in dublin ,

where as a gram of rubber might be 40 E and have the same contents .

ditto a ounce of cheap Spanish weed might be cost you 150 or 200 , but pack it ad sell it as pharma grade American weed and you could ask 300 or more easily .

and all this varies of course on what happens to be available in an area . and obviously trading in bulk drops the value

so why set the value to a min to benefit people who are criminals ?

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586290#Comment_118586290

It's parole - that's probably what is meant by 'life licence", regardless of any technical difference.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586579#Comment_118586579

In murder cases that are especially horrific (e.g. sexual motive) or where the perpetrator is a gangland criminal (e.g. Brian Meehan), the perpetrator has been in prison for much longer than 12 years. In some cases, parole has been revoked because of breach of conditions.

Danno

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118583855#Comment_118583855

Are you seriously clamouring for more waste of taxpayers money?

The vast majority of offenders before the courts are already a drain on the state even before they get marched up the steps. It's a costly exercise keeping these offenders between welfare, free legal aid, courts time, prison service, etc... money which these offenders will never ever repay.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587139#Comment_118587139

Im not clamouring for anything, merely trying to explain to the OP that if there is an unduly lenient sentence handed down, the DPP is entitled to appeal that sentence.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587179#Comment_118587179

i think the point being made is that if judges applied the law properly the dpp wouldn't have to intervene with expensive and lengthy appeals while the criminal benifits by roaming the streets committing more crimes with more victims

surely you agree that sentencing in Irish courts needs to be changed dramatically ?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587218#Comment_118587218

I would like to see mandatory minimum sentencing.

If the judge did not apply the law properly then it would be appealed.

Spanish Eyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587024#Comment_118587024

I know that. However this happens merely because the probation service or Minister for Justice decides that 12 years is not enough. Should be judges deciding this at the outset. Or are judges not capable of setting a minimum tariff because the law doesn't allow it? Probably. I am not sure even if Garda killers (capital crime) serve a minimum of 40 years either, although that tariff is set in lieu of the death penalty. I do know that Garda killers were released after 30 years served. (Callan and McHugh), so it would make you wonder what is the point. However I think the Criminal justice act of 1990 has firmed up on serving the full 40 years, but I wonder.

So we have those other than the judge deciding when a perpetrator is ok to release (or not), and the follow up is costly too I would imagine.

[Deleted User]

It's not that they think 12 years is not enough. That is merely the minimum length that must be served before eligible for parole. They don't decide if someone has served enough time, the temporary release is based on issues such as, the prisoner does not pose a risk, that they have been rehabilitated and that all circumstances are appropriate.

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586466#Comment_118586466

2 and a half kilo 50k hahah your Clearly not a cop. A jacket is 6500 euro 8500 depending So yeah move it up.

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118586376#Comment_118586376

No it doesn’t anymore. Ireland doesn’t have life licenses like the UK. A life sentence when released is expired unless ordered by parole commission. Very few prisoners have it attached to them.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587619#Comment_118587619

No, it is not expired. Someone who has been temporarily released can be sent back to prison to see out the rest of their sentence. It's not 'licence ' in words.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587619#Comment_118587619

Actually life means life. A paroled life sentencer can be sent back to jail without trial or nee convictiom

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587860#Comment_118587860

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118587704#Comment_118587704

I can assure you 100% a lifer is not on life license.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588176#Comment_118588176

Parole act 2019. Allows for the revocation of parole order.

100%

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588325#Comment_118588325

Yes for anyone released after January 7th 2020. Doesn’t apply to anyone before that. Fact 100%

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588437#Comment_118588437

It does indeed

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588545#Comment_118588545

It doesn’t apply to me.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588592#Comment_118588592

Fair enough, but if you were released prior to that date by a parole board, then it is still a temporary release. And there was power before 2019 to revoke the release. It is now in a statutory basis, whereas previously is was not

CaoimhinCong

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118588730#Comment_118588730

I’m out from a life sentence a number of years I won’t say the year as I don’t want to risk identifying myself but I don’t see probation that some lifers have to. I met all criteria before release I.E AVPs and the likes I’ve not broken the law since release so haven’t risked new charges.

[Deleted User]

laoisgem

As well as sentencing not being long enough, you have this **** of 25% remission for good behavior 😡

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/sex-beast-simon-mcginley-set-26151541

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589632#Comment_118589632

Why do you think it is a bad thing? I'm not saying it's great, but it is understandable, it's an incentive for prisoners to act well in prison. Definately not perfect.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589795#Comment_118589795

Well for them to behave in prison only to act the prick when they’re out. Like that fella raped a girl of 13 in 1998 got 13 years (didn’t serve the full term obviously) and in 2009 *11 years later and presumably not long out of prison* he raped a pensioner.

So, he got out a bit early before and with that went and raped someone else.. and they let him out again? Early? Systems not perfect? Give me strength.

[Deleted User]

https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-48885846

https://www.lifeinnorway.net/prisons/

maybe should take a Norwegian approach?