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Shared house eviction notice and not all moving out together?

NeptunesMoon

Hi, I'm in a shared house and weve been given our termination notice for a few months time. We're all on good terms and all get along great and were thinking to all move in together to a new place, but not everyone is 100% they want to stay in Ire.

This means we may find new places at different times. Ive read on this forum before that once eviction notice is given, you dont need to give any notice to the LL for moving out and not only do they need to give you your deposit back (providing everything is in good order) but say if you pay rent at the start of the month and move out the second week, they need to reimburse you the difference for the remainder of that month.

I'm just wondering how this works with a shared tenancy? We're all indvidisually named on the lease, although there is one lead tenant who we all pay and then they pay the LL. Can each of us just move out when we're ready before the eviction date so and even there was only one person left, would they only have to pay their share to the LL if it was just them for the last 2 months or so, with the others having already moved out and gotten their deposit and portion of the last month's rent back, or how does it work?

cheers!

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houseyhouse

It depends on your lease. From what you’ve described, I think the remaining tenant would be liable for all the rent. You can have Threshold take a look at your lease to confirm that.

wench

If you are all on the same lease, then you would all remain jointly liable for the rent until the last person moves out.

The landlord may agree to release you earlier, but they do not have to.

1874

Getting refunded because you left earlier than the end date of the lease would be uncommon and there would not be much grounds for it, ie you have date x to leave and voluntarily decided or need to move before that date, thats not the responsibility or fault of the landlord. A full deposit return is reasonable and to be expected so long as there isnt anything above abnormal wear and tear.

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118494260#Comment_118494260

No, that’s the rule where the LL has given notice. On the basis that it’s not reasonable to expect tenants to find somewhere from exactly the date of their eviction or else pay for two places concurrently.

meijin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118494260#Comment_118494260

You're incorrect. There were RTB rulings on this topic. The notice always says "on or before". This "before" gives a tenant a way to move out earlier.

Of course it's a bit more complicated with multiple people on the lease. Best way would be to move out together at the same time, or talk to the landlord and come up with some arrangement.

NeptunesMoon

cheers everyone. so one of you is saying it depends on the lease, and that probably the one remaining tenant would be liable for the full amount, then another is saying if we're all on the same lease, we're all jointly liable?

I must have a look at the lease and see if anything on this is mentioned and then get on to threshold and see what they say. Hopefully the LL will be flexible either way.

tscul32

Seems a bit harsh that the last one might have to cover the whole rent given that they can't exactly replace the ones that have already moved out, because of a decision made by the landlord.

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118495347#Comment_118495347

Ok, show me the legislation that says that then? Or even an RTB outcome, although I wouldnt put much stock in what they say.

Usually, joint tenancys are paid for by all, so if one or however many leave, the full rent is due up till the last day by whoever/how ever many reside there, even if that is one person left. Ive never heard anything about refunding in the legislation, because if the landlord/agent gave notice up till a certain date, the rent is due up until then, if a person decides to leave before that Id say it is on their own bat and there is no obligation to refund anyone by the landlord. It may be a reasonable and nice thing to do, but never heard any laws about it, there may even be an agreement between tenants if people leave early.

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118501445#Comment_118501445

I’m not looking up the legislation for you. It is my understanding that after LL gives notice, tenants can leave before notice is up without being liable for the remaining rent. I know an LL who was in this situation and they had to return rent when tenants left before the end of the notice period.

Another posted has mentioned RTB rulings above so you may be able to find one if you’re interested.

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118505934#Comment_118505934

Becuase it does not exist, you (and another poster) are claiming this is the case and it is bad advice.

Another poster states that it seems unfair one person staying should have to cover the entire rent if everyone else leaves, but this is also the case usually, that everyone is severally liable to pay the full rent, not just what they think is their share, just because the other tenants or co-occupants have left.You made the claim it was the situation, so, back it up please. Now you say, "it is your understanding".

This is a huge part of the problem with letting in Ireland, 1. the laws are a total screw up, to cover the withdrawal of the provision of housing by the state and transferring that to the private sector, 2. You have quite poor (slow) and usually one sided legal dealing with problems, 3. The above (are some of the reasons that) ncourages private owners to leave the sector, which worsens the situation.

IMO there are good landlords and tenants, but picking and choosing what rules you will follow is easier for a tenant and any tenant who doesnt meet their obligation to pay is undermining that service being provided, because it discourages investors entering the market to provide the same service, thereby reducing competition and availability of house to rent, the current set up encourages bad landlords and tenants, but more so the latter. In the greater scheme of things, the above situation is low down on the scale of problems, but it is just one example of why housing has been fcuked up for renting (as it also has for buying and selling) in this country by bad politicians, likely self serving and poor legislation.

houseyhouse

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118506400#Comment_118506400

OP brought it up and you disagreed with them so maybe you should provide evidence. I also stated it was likely the tenants were severally liable so not sure why you’re bringing that up.

I agree there are problems with the private rental sector. I have been on both sides of it and am currently a landlord.

meijin

I have relevant RTB cases linked in some of my previous posts, but it's impossible to find it on the new boards... maybe someone else will have more luck.

meijin

Ah, found it. See https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/112183070#Comment_112183070

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118506702#Comment_118506702

I commend you on finding anything in boards, I cant.

Anyway, I had a quick look over the first report, that was where the landlord withheld the deposit, at no point does it appear to say the landlord gave notice and the tenant left before the tenancy was due to end and the landlord refunded any unused portion of the tenacy. It does state the landlord gave invalid notice (it even says the refund was for x amount and why)

"The Tenant is entitled to a refund of the rent prepaid on her behalf less the period she was in occupation of the dwelling"

So the tenant had to pay for when she was in occupation, she was refunded for other reasons, appears to be her deposit retained and for prepaid rent.

Whats worse about that example is it appears that the tenant did appalling damage or through deglect allowed the property to deteriorate into a poor condition, which looks like willful neglect (overflowing bath like, wtf?!) if not outright vandalism, and the landlord seems to have been woefully disorganized and unprepared for dealing with a tenant and the RTB.

MacDanger

My understanding of the situation is that:

Once you've been given a termination notice, you can move out any time before the termination date; you are not liable for rent after the date you move out
If people are moving out on different dates, the full rent is due until the date when the last person moves out