Following on from here
New Munster chat thread folks. warning deserved there. https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=109477571#post109477571
McCall will never coach in Ireland.
Aside from the various rumours of bad blood between him and the IRFU , what would he have to gain by going to Munster**?
Move to a club where he has less control over players etc. with more "oversight" from Nucifora and the IRFU in general and probably for less money than he's getting in Saracens today.
I just don't see the "carrot" for someone like McCall.
To be honest, I doubt he'll ever leave Saracens - He'll do a few more years as DOR there and then probably "move upstairs" in that organisation.
** This isn't a dig at Munster , the same would apply to any Irish team with central contracts etc. compared to the relative freedom and autonomy he'd have at Saracens.
If the IRFU didn't hire anyone who doesn't love them to bits, they wouldnt have many staff.
I daresay McCall is bigger than that sort of trivial nonsense anyway. He's not blind, he can see that the Irish system is decent and promotes excellence at provincial level. Most of the admin crap is dealt with at exec level anyway, the DoR usually only has to deal with the Nucifora office.
I think Van Grann leaving could be gold for Munster. He's not a top end coach. The replacement coach will be key and I hope Munster get it right.
I would love to see Humphries or McCall get the job, very unlikely though. The thoughts of Baxter at Munster would be mouth watering. There's obviously not a huge selection of coaches available at the moment. I wouldn't be surprised if Easterby took the job.
I think it's too early for ROG and Flannery. Leo is only signed for this season, so Lancaster could potentially take the reins at Leinster, so he is probably not moving.
Think Mark mccall has a sore spot for the irfu right? Or is that just rumor
I can't believe one name isn't in the conversation. Lift the phone and give Mark a McCall.
Probably the most experienced and decorated DoR in the NH game today.
Let him pull the strings, and have Rowntree and a conscripted Mike Prendergast run the effort on the field.
If Munster couldn't develop an ambitious and entertaining style out of that lot, well.......
He's got my vote.
Bernard Jackman? Anybody!!!
Im sorry i don't follow what your getting confused about. It would be very unusual if the Munster head coach didn't have a say in the signing and resigning of players.
The head coach and Professional Game Committee would all be involved in identifying new signings and the resigning of players. Then CEO would get the contract moneys sorted and in conjunction with Nucifora where necessary.
The IRFU of course deals with the central contracts (PO'M, Murray and Earls) but again Munster and the head coach are at least consulted.
And he's not being rushed. If he was ready, it wouldn't be rushing him to play more senior minutes.
Is Nathan Doak being rushed? Is Murray being rushed at connacht?
He's just not ready yet. It's not a case of them having a star who is ready and they're choosing not to give him more minutes. They're choosing not to give him more minutes because he isn't ready yet. That's not a slight against him and doesn't mean he won't ever be ready, he's still very young. But let's report the situation the way it is.
I think he's a highly touted player that could be excellent but that does not mean he should be rushed.
Yes those players are the exception. I think Ahern was touted as a potential exception too. He hasn't burst onto the scene as an exceptional player ready to play senior, but that's not the end of the world.
I don't understand why there is pressure to have players playing heavy minutes at 21/22 particularly a guy with aherns frame.
With regards to the few above comments I'm not aware of concussion issues James Ryan is having but I'd say its not entirely surprising that heavy contacts at a younger age would cause issues. I'd also suggest if you start players younger at senior level their more likely to retire young. At the end of the day it's down to the individual some guys have frames to deal with high loads younger sone guys need a few years.
If 10 caps at 21 years of age is seen as holding a guy back i suggest you should reevaluate your standards
This is the first time I've ever heard any suggestion that Ryan’s concussion issues are because he was "targeted" by opponents.
Ahern is just about to turn 22, that's still very young for a second row. Guys like Ryan and Baird, playing for Ireland at the age of 20/21, are the exception.
how is that linked to him playing top level rugby from 22?
And 3 years later seeing a specialist because he's experiencing symptoms from repeated concussions, a career threatening development
Yeah the last thing you want is a player to be hyped up, and then live up to the hype so they go straight in the provincial team and international squad. Baird is less than a year older than Ahern and he has 28 provincial and 5 international caps.
Ahern is doing grand, but he hasn't lived up to the hype yet. If he was as good as the hype then he'd have earned more munster opportunities.
Munster have 2 start second rows who have been injured since signing. If you add those 2 ahead of him then I don't see much genuine opportunity for Ahern in the short term.
hyped out the gate? you mean being an excellent second row and ready for top level rugby at 22?
Murray is a very good player but after only 6-8 appearances between them, its a bit early to be Judging them against each other
Ahern has had 2 80 minute games at senior level, In one of them, he was man of the match (admittedly against Zebre)
Ahern is being given time to develop by Munster. We don't want to see the same thing happen to him as what James Ryan has gone through. Getting absolutely hyped out the gate, thrown into huge games and then being targetted by the opposition and getting concussion after concussion putting his career in doubt at the age of 25
20 months out from a RWC the only options in Europe are a coach in a struggling team.
the one name that stands out there with loads of experience all over the world, in a lot of positions including head coach and DOR, is John Mitchell. Currently attack coach in Wasps.
If Kidney wasnt interested in moving back, he would certainly be worth a phone call.
otherwise youre looking to lure someone like Razor out of NZ
For all the talk here, some one has to really want to do the Job, a lot of people wont want the role. or are happy where they are.
Would love to see Sales defence coach Mike Forshaw at Munster, he's a proper take no shīte coach and a good task master, exactly what the team needs after last Saturday disciplinary display.
Carolan's a good shout too. Him and JVG are polar opposites in terms of their rugby philosophy.
Munster's defence wasn't very good when Costello was defence coach under Foley.
Agree on Kidney as DOR plus someone like Prendergast or Carolan or McNamara as head coach. McNamara looks unlikely with his contract with the Sharks (hopefully he'll be the next Leinster head coach after Lancaster). Carolan might be more open than Prendergast when it comes to bringing through young talent - given his U20s background.
Kidney as DOR, with Prendergast as head coach would be a shrewd appointment IMO.
Kidney putting the overarching structure in place, handling recruitment and contracts, promoting academy players and dictating the overall direction of the province. He has the province's D.N.A similar to Cullen at Leinster and he has experience in that role at London Irish.
Prendergast looking after the coaching, game plan and in-game strategy. He's put together a pretty impressive C.V. in France and I'd like to see him given a shot.
Rowntree signing on is great news. He's a top coach and a certain level of continuity is good. Obviously there'd be need for a new defence coach with Ferreira going to Bath. No names jump to mind, but perhaps that's a role for a foreign influence, or maybe promote Costello.
There's a serious crop of talent down at Munster. Get this appointment right and the next few years could be seriously exciting.
Absolutely agree but when i say DOR i mean a guy who'll co-ordinate the entire pro side of the team, from feeders into the academy right through. Big jump between coaching and that.
I know DOR isn't really a defined term.
James Coughlan is quietly building a very nice CV, don't think he's ready for the top job yet, would love to see him as defence coach with a longterm view to moving up.
Don't think Baxter would work as well outside of Exeter tbh. He's built something amazing but doubt he could replicate it here.
What Munster player or AIL player even could be our Baxter is the question for me. Even though he's never mentioned as a DOR type, Flannery is a bit of a nerd of the sport. With the right support I could see him as DOR.
Rob Baxter please, I think himself and Rowntree would work well together, and if we don't get Prendergast as attack coach I'd like to see Conor McPhilips in the running for it.
What on earth makes you think that JVG would have a say on Irish internationals signing new contracts? The professional game board and Nucifora will be doing that. Even if JVG wasn't leaving he wouldn't be involved in those negotiations.
Coaches arrive and work with staff already in place all the time. Tabai Matson is the most recent high profile example at Quins
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