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Does any state organisation regulate Myhome.ie, Daft.ie and the other property sites?

[Deleted User]

Or is it simply a matter of no laws existing to regulate them?

In particular:

1. Estate agents advertising properties without putting the overall sqm of the property. [Lynam: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/17-shanagarry-milltown-road-milltown-dublin-6/4513605]

2. Estate agents, when they give sqm, it is not for the overall property but rather more obfuscation by only giving individual room siezes (DNG: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/158-the-oval-block-o-tullyvale-cabinteely-dublin-18/4496278)

3. Not giving metric sizes but rather sqft - it's over 50 years since imperial was taught in Irish schools so why are these shysters allowed to advertise property in Ireland in these measurements only? [Ray Cooke Auctioneers: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/23-the-bottleworks-ringsend-dublin-4/4551882] [Mullery O'Gara: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/65-orwell-gate-marianella-rathgar-dublin-6/4538629]

4. Using imperial/miles and acres to make some place look closer (6.6 miles might sound closer than 10km) to somewhere or larger (2.5 acres might sound larger than 1 hectare) [Sherry Fitzgerald: https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/two-bedroom-apartments-trimbleston-goatstown-road-dublin-14-goatstown-dublin/4340515]

5. The wide range of dodgy apartments which were in the news some years ago for fire and health safety issues, but not a single note to that effect is on the ads (I remembered from memory, and when I googled I found that the apartments I was looking at were the ones in question)

It's bad enough enduring the extortionate prices in this rigged marketplace without having to endure the games of these clowns. It would seem to me the entire problem lies with the owners of Myhome.ie, Daft.ie, etc who accept these paid ads which are deliberately intended to conseal property sizes, or make them seem bigger than they are (by using imperial over metric), or closer to some place. Is there any state organisation responsible for ensuring these websites cut out these practices?

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endofrainbow

As far as I know, these are private companies and pay their E30 to advertise. I doubt these ads are monitored. Perhaps a call to the Property Registration Authority might clarify?

L1011

There's no regulation

The EAs themselves have a regulator, but there are no rules on giving size for instance.

Mrs OBumble

The rules which apply to advertising property apply equally to website, press advertisements, flyers handed out by agents etc.

For example, there are a range of things which Daft will not show on rental advertising, because it is not legal, eg HAP not accepted.

The same regulatory authorities which apply law on other platforms apply the law on websites. I'm thinking that there is likely no law against using imperial measurements (miles etc) or that it is not enforced: if there was, Daft at least would likely comply.

There certainly are requirements about disclosing information about properties, either up-front or not request. These requirements apply to real estate agents though, not to the media - and I'm not sure that there's a requirement to put everything in the advertising, though.

[Deleted User]

Am I missing something?

Can you not add the individual sizes up to get the overall? And the conversion of m2/ft2 could not be simpler.

In relation to size, the advertiser/brochure does not owe a duty of care to you, you have to measure the dimensions yourself.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/supreme-court/property-investor-s-350-000-award-over-brochure-error-overturned-1.3104735

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118374073#Comment_118374073

Why should we have to add up every measurement in every room in every property just because these shyster auctioneers and websites want to obfuscate the real size of their midget properties? Oh, and it is most definitely illegal to have measurements only in imperial.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118374079#Comment_118374079

Because it’s simple to do.

In relation to imperial measurements, are you applying consumer law to property?

RainInSummer

While I have no great sympathy for estate agents (one step down from used car dealers mostly) I don't feel the owners of those websites should be policing estate agents beyond what is required by law. It's ridiculous to suggest the entire problem lies with them.

If it is required by law then contact those websites. You might even get some rent money for the space they're taking up in your head.

Economics101

Maybe the State agencies should up their game before we look at yet more regulation of the private sector. For example the PSRA gives a record of actual transaction values for all relevant properties but no information on the area. This should be dead easy to provide and would add immensely to the value of the price register.

So get you act together, civil servants, before telling everyone else what to do.

C3PO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058224250/does-any-state-organisation-regulate-myhome-ie-daft-ie-and-the-other-property-sites

Are you serious?

C3PO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118374079#Comment_118374079

Can you reference the applicable law please?

[Deleted User]

And your problem is what, precisely? That we should say nothing when these chancer auctioneers/websites try to obfuscate consumers in 2021 by advertising their property merchandise in the larger-sounding imperial measurement system which hasn't been taught in Irish schools since... 1970?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118375617#Comment_118375617

How about these:

In March 2009 a new directive (2009/3/EC) was agreed amending existing EU regulations on metric measurements.

The new regulations permitted:

• the indefinite use of dual labelling in metric and imperial measurements;

• the indefinite use of non-metric measurements where no metric ones exist, such as bytes in computing;

• the indefinite use by the United Kingdom and by the Republic of Ireland of the pint, the mile and the troy ounce for certain specified uses

Metric should be displayed as the lead measurement, imperial is allowed also as long as metric also featured as the primary measurement.

Legislative references:

https://www.interregs.com/catalogue/details/eec-20093/directive-no-2009-3-ec/si-units-of-measurement/

SI 255of 1992

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1992/si/255/made/en/print?q=255&years=1992

Metrology Act 1996 – Section 19 (third schedule)

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1996/act/27/enacted/en/index.html

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118376500#Comment_118376500

If someone is soo stupid that they cannot use Google to convert miles to km etc, then they have no business buying property.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118376553#Comment_118376553

Great. I'm off to sell a product in Ireland in 2021 in pounds, shillings and pence. "If someone is soo stupid that they cannot use Google to convert..."

[Deleted User]

The first thing I did when I looked at buying a house was get a tape measure and check the measurements.

If you cannot do this you should not be going in to sign complicated mortgage documentation.

I'm sorry but missus O'B is absolutely right. You cannot have your hand held for absolutely everything.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377401#Comment_118377401

Strange analogy, that currency hasn’t been legal tender since 2002. What would you do if a customer paid you in the currency you advertised the item for sale?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118376553#Comment_118376553

I don’t always agree with you, but I can’t disagree here. This is just a waste of energy to concern about, like honestly who gives a shite.

i wouldn’t give much of a rats ass what they advertise anyway, you’ll have a viewing and bring a tape measure and check yourself.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377401#Comment_118377401

right cos that’s definitely the same thing..

”anyone wanna buy my house with non legal tender?”

“only if you measure it in feet and inches!!!!!!!!”

Furze99

I'm inclined to agree with the OP that EAs will use every ruse and trick in the book in their trade. But it's not the problem of the web portals mentioned above. Long past time for government legislation requiring metric measurements in metres, square metres and kilometres for such property advertising.

If people want to use feet, inches and miles in their everyday lives then well & good and let them at it. Purchasing property is not an everyday activity for most people and this advertising should be standardised for clarity and comparative purposes.

[Deleted User]

To be fair Furze, it’s hardly a ruse/trick to advertise in ft/ft2. Many of us still refer to our own, and others height in ft and “s rather than m/cm. We know small/medium/large rooms/houses by their square footage and builders quotes are still often given in ft2. I recently had to increase the insurance on my house to take into account rise in cost of rebuild, I was asked about ft2 size of my house by insurer.

The conversion from ft2 to m2 is among the simplest calculations there is, as others have said, if you can’t do that in your head, chances are you will find other facets of buying/building almost impossible.

We still call a pint a pint (I know, it’s exempted), the op’s ire and your accusation is akin to accusing a pub of trickery/a ruse for not referring to it in its metric form. The fact remains, a pint is a pint, the same way a foot is a foot or an acre is ….., well you get the drift, the length/area does not get shorter/smaller depending on the unit of measurement. It’s just being outraged for the sake of it.

Nermal

It's a perfectly reasonable suggestion.

Regulations that improve the quality, availability and reliability of information help a market function more efficiently.

Contrast it with the 'HAP not accepted' law that actually hides information, and increases transaction costs.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377695#Comment_118377695

Make no mistake, changing to metric was all about harmonising measurements within the EU, the reason they still allow imperial to be used as well is that an American wouldn’t know a metre from a shilling, and with the UK reverting to imperial, you can be sure it will still be used here.

Does referring to a room in feet really reduce the quality, reliability and availability of the information to you? Sounds like you are saying the unit used in some way alters the length/area of the room. Strange.

Does anyone think stating your height in mm rather than feet/inches changes how tall you are or is a trick/ruse?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377416#Comment_118377416

In fairness, nobody is going to get a tape measure to the myhome/daft page on his/her laptop screen while trying to narrow down properties above a certain size. Once he/she has narrowed down the properties by that criterion he/she may very well decide to visit them and then bring a measuring tape.

They shouldn't have to physically visit every single property with a measuring tape when clear and transparent advertising could save everybody time. This practice only exists because of shyster property salespeople and websites trying to make properties appear larger than they are. In most/all other businesses the size of products conforms with the law that there must be a metric size. The person visits the online website, sees the product details transparently advertised, and then can go into the relevant business to buy or indeed measure them. But auctioneers on myhome/daft, etc?

[Deleted User]

He/she should buy a calculator if mental arithmetic is not their strongpoint. It only “appears larger” to the very few.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377433#Comment_118377433

Not a strange analogy at all. It is at least 1992 since it was made illegal to advertise a product only in imperial measurements in this state, yet this is precisely what these chancer auctioneers are doing in 2021 when they refuse to give the metric sizes of the properties they're selling, and myhome/daft are facilitating them. Transparency in sizes/product offerings should be a professional standard by all members of the IAPV, but far from it.

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1992/si/255/made/en/print

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377944#Comment_118377944

In 2021 would you accept payment in pounds, shillings and pence for the item you are selling? The answer to that should give a clue as to the strangeness of advertising the item for sale in those units of currency.

Besides which, an advertised price for an item is merely an invitation to treat. You can advertise the item for sale in beans if you like.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377650#Comment_118377650

It very much is a ruse; imperial makes their midget property seem larger, closer to a large town, etc. That's precisely why auctioneers use it. It's also most definitely illegal to refuse to give the metric size. As pointed out, it's 1970 - almost 52 years ago - since the imperial system was last taught in Irish schools so just how many property buyers in 2021 learnt anything other than metric in school? Meanwhile, while people make excuses for auctioneers, every shop, every butcher and the rest of society must conform to selling their products in metric...

silver2020

Hope the op never wants to buy in the UK.

If you ask for the overall sq ft of a property you will be answered with a blank stare.

Unless there's an obligation to give a size, there's no obligation as to what metrics to use and most people will know the approximate equivalence between metric and imperial as we get a huge amount of information from the UK

Methinks the op is ranting for the sake of a rant.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377979#Comment_118377979

That really only applies to those who would be easily taken in by such a “ruse”. A tiny apartment is a tiny apartment, the unit of measurement does not change that.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118377730#Comment_118377730

Given that most of us never learnt the imperial system, giving the bigger-sounding imperial measurements is certainly designed to hide the size of the product. Again, no other business in Irish society can get away with selling their products only in imperial. Why should shyster auctioneers and their websites be given an exception when it comes to clear and transparent advertising for Irish consumers?