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Double standards or unrealistic expectations?

[Deleted User]

I'm in a 5 year relationship with someone I have truly grown with. When we met, we took things slow, and developed a stable base. Our lives over time become interlinked, we get on great with each others families and friends and have established ourselves as a serious couple. We both have great jobs and I am currently studying part-time again.

In 2020 my parent became sick and died very quickly. I was worried at the time my partner wasn't able to support me in the way I needed, but in fairness, he did. I am very emotionally aware, possibly from my line of work. He, and his family are not so much. They don't communicate about problems, and my partner has not experienced much adversity compared to most. His parents are separated. Mine were married 40 years. I am just mentioning this as it influences our views on things like marriage and children. We get on with both families really well. During the pandemic we were renting a family members house (who moved abroad) and also lived with both of our families for long periods at various stages. This went really well and we established good routines. We are in the process of buying a house together for the last 12 months. Things were moving in the order I wanted them to, or so I thought until I reached a birthday, and since our five year anniversary.

We have both had nights out with colleagues and friends, and usually offer a lift if the other is stuck, but more often than not my partner tends to stay out later and ring me in the middle of the night to be collected. We tend to set a rule like if it's later than 11pm to get a taxi. Two weeks ago, I was out, and did the same thing, i.e. stayed out way later and got a taxi home. It was my first night out in a year and I had a fall (cut my face) and was very embarrassed about it but I was fine. I had never gotten into that state of drunkenness over the course of our relationship.

My other half was not impressed. We had plans the following morning but I was too fragile to stir from bed. All acceptable reasons to be annoyed, and for getting drunk and being messy. The next day we had a chat, which stemmed from my partner basically saying he was disappointed in me getting in that state and missing out on our plans. It turned into more of a general feedback session which surprised me. Things like, getting drunk and acting out of character was framed in a really negative way, and made my partner question my integrity, due to a few things like my safety being compromised. (I was home at 11pm and shared a taxi with a friend but partner was really worried as I was slurring speech on phone).

Anyway, something in what was said triggered me, because he wrote notes about what bothered him and on one page he had something about longevity of our relationship. During the discussion I brought up times he had overdone it and it wasn't received well, and it annoyed me as he has double standards because he is a man. I was concerned at how much my partner laboured the point of how disappointed he was in me, and when I asked was he reconsidering our relationship he said no. But it got me thinking about where we are going. I am a really good partner and wonder if there is something else under the hood for my boyfriend that he won't say.

I am planning to talk to him on the weekend about how his chat has left me feeling. I don't want to waste anymore time on someone who isn't fully accepting of me, or who doesn't think the world of me. I get if you hold your partner/spouse to high standards but this felt a bit much. When we do argue it's because of his expectations of me to cook or do more of the domestic chores which I do the majority of anyway, but the expectations in this area are unrealistic at best! He expects the romance and the gestures and perhaps doesn't realise he is not the strongest in this department, either!

I'm in my 30s and also feel a lot of pressure from people regarding marriage and children which we do want, but not right now. We spoke about engagement and he is at the point of not being interested in marriage, because his own parents are divorced. I don't know if this is normal relationship milestone stuff or something else. Any insights are welcome.

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[Deleted User]

What struck me was that you're planning marriage and he's not.

Sooner or later plans have to merge or diverge. Why do you think he'll change his mind on this?

Would you be happy just being the girlfriend?

[Deleted User]

No, I wouldn't.

When he has had a few drinks he makes lots of comments about marriage and always tells me I'm the woman of his dreams, but after 5 years and us not being young, it has made me think of where things are really going. Marriage isn't an absolute must for me, but the older I get I want this for myself, in addition to everything else and he knows this. I don't want lukewarm and generally don't feel that's what we have but this could become an issue in short time.

TheadoreT

That taxi story seems very familiar, have you told that here before?

Anyway he sounds like a bit of a dick and a proper loser tbh, the expectations with regards cooking and chores is like something from a bygone era. He's cold with regards romance and sounds non committal about your future, controlling when you're out with friends/colleagues.

Are you sure you can't do better than this? He's not got much going for him by the sounds of things.

YellowLead

Hi OP - I think your partner is being unreasonable regarding the night out and getting drunk. A little controlling even. If this was repeated behaviour his concern/comments would be justified but everybody let’s their hair down now and again and especially these days when we don’t get a chance too often. And I’m sure you didn’t intentionally get so drunk words were slurred and a fall was had.

Regarding the chores that unacceptable - why on earth should you do more of both working full time (presumably) - he gets to do less because he is a man?!

in relation to the marriage/kids piece this is something that you will need to both align on at some point and if he’s not fully into it, it’s time to work that out so you have time to find somebody new who would desire to have that life with you.

Purple Mountain

I find it disconcerting that he confronted you with notes about your 'faults'. It sounds very anal to be honest.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118304098#Comment_118304098

On that, I’d run a mile, that doesn’t bode well. That’s ridiculous behavior.

[Deleted User]

well it's an over-reaction if that's all it is but he was worried about you as you say.

get it out in the open as soon as possible that you think that it's out of order and see what he says.

Big Bag of Chips

I'm in my 30s and also feel a lot of pressure from people regarding marriage and children which we do want, but not right now

Well regardless of everything else in your post you really should make life decisions based on what you want, and when you want it. Not because you're getting pressure from others. Other people aren't going to live your life or raise your future children. Just because you are in your 30s doesn’t mean you have to tie yourself to someone you are not completely happy with. Especially not because of a perceived “pressure from people”.

As for the night out you had. I can see his point. You went out, got very drunk, fell, cut your face and were not able to keep plans for the next day. If he had done that and you were posting about it from your point of view you’d have people telling you to be aware of his carry on. That it was a bad sign that he got so drunk that he fell, injured himself and was then too hungover to keep your prearranged plans. If he rings you for a lift home after 11, why did you not ring him? I know you have an agreement, but he doesn’t stick to it, so why do you feel you have to?

Coming out with a list of faults might be controlling, or it might also be his way of remembering what he wants to say. Often people are advised if they want to address something to write it down, that in the heat of the moment things can be said, or not said, and having it written down can help address the important points. Like it or not, OP, you will both have things that the other person sees as a fault. None of us are perfect. You have things about him that you aren’t happy with. You both need to communicate better. He needs to move away from the 1950s women in the kitchen attitude, but he is entitled to air his concern about the night you went out, fell, injured yourself and then were too hungover to do what you had planned. It may only be a once off, but I think he has a right to discuss it. In the same way that you would if he had done it.

You two need to get better at communicating. And if you don’t want to collect him late at night say so. Turn your phone off when you go to bed and let him get a taxi. If you don’t mind collecting him then say so, but tell him you expect the same from him.

[Deleted User]

Your post is very articulate. You’ve outlined a lot of serious concerns. All of them are valid in their own right and may have been festering for a while until your night brought them all to a head when you had a fall (excuse the pun !)

you need to bite the bullet and get the answers you deserve from your boyfriend, don’t accept brush offs or excuses at this stage. You’ve started a real and honest debate about your relationship and it matters . Good luck

HildaOgdenx

Two weeks ago, I was out, and did the same thing, i.e. stayed out way later and got a taxi home. It was my first night out in a year and I had a fall (cut my face) and was very embarrassed about it but I was fine. I had never gotten into that state of drunkenness over the course of our relationship.

Things like, getting drunk and acting out of character was framed in a really negative way, and made my partner question my integrity, due to a few things like my safety being compromised. (I was home at 11pm and shared a taxi with a friend but partner was really worried as I was slurring speech on phone).

You say you were home by 11, but previously said you stayed out way later? Anyway, this sounds like something that has been brewing a while on both sides.

I agree with Big Bag of Chips, I have just quoted the final lines of her post above. And you have said it yourself, there are double standards at play here. Not just about the collecting/ getting a taxi after an agreed time, but that is symptomatic of wider issues, in my opinion. The two of you need to clear the air, calmly. Maybe it's the end of the road for the relationship, maybe not. But better communication needs to happen, on both sides.

As pp have said, ignore pressure from others about marriage or children or anything else. It's your life, not theirs.

cj maxx

After 5 years , if we both had agreed on children maybe marriage and nothing was happening I'd thinking of my next move.

the_syco

We tend to set a rule like if it's later than 11pm to get a taxi. Two weeks ago, I was out, and did the same thing, i.e. stayed out way later and got a taxi home. It was my first night out in a year and I had a fall (cut my face) and was very embarrassed about it but I was fine. I had never gotten into that state of drunkenness over the course of our relationship.

My other half was not impressed. We had plans the following morning but I was too fragile to stir from bed. All acceptable reasons to be annoyed, and for getting drunk and being messy. The next day we had a chat, which stemmed from my partner basically saying he was disappointed in me getting in that state and missing out on our plans. It turned into more of a general feedback session which surprised me. Things like, getting drunk and acting out of character was framed in a really negative way, and made my partner question my integrity, due to a few things like my safety being compromised. (I was home at 11pm and shared a taxi with a friend but partner was really worried as I was slurring speech on phone).

So, were you out way later than 11, or not? Confused about this part.

Regarding

We spoke about engagement and he is at the point of not being interested in marriage, because his own parents are divorced.

Consider couples counselling. If it doesn't go well, or he decides not to go/not needing to go, consider that the marriage thing may never be on the cards.

notAMember

You sound like this was not normal for you. Your tolerance for alcohol is way down and you got it wrong, but yes, getting that drunk and falling was unsafe.

You’ve crossed a line for him, he sounds really upset about it, and seems like he wants to be heard . He said it to you and wrote it down. It’s not clear what he wrote, but I’m implying it was something like he has doubt in the relationship long term if this becomes normal for you. I wonder does he see it as part of a pattern you might be returning to? You need to make sure he understands it was unusual and not something you want to repeat.

The piece about him not wanting to get married because his parents divorced is damage he needs to sort out himself. Does he have the impression that his parents relationship would have survived perfectly if only there wasn’t a wedding?

witchgirl26

OP I think Big Bag of Chips gave some great advice but I'll just add my own perspective.

Forget what others are saying about marriage and kids - what about you? Myself & my partner were together a lot longer (& a bit older) when an engagement happened, followed closely by kids. The marriage side was him (his parents don't have the greatest relationship so marriage meant more to me than him) and the kids was me (I wasn't ready in my own head). I didn't put any time limit on the marriage side because I knew it had to be on his terms too - it couldn't be me dictating that I wanted us to get married. He knew my thoughts on it and I knew, given time to come round to it in his own head, he'd be there too. Vice versa with kids - he was ready way before I was but let me come to terms. We didn't ignore it during that time and did talk about it though.

In terms of the notes for the chat - I do that sometimes as I know I can get quite upset during conversations or confrontations as I don't like them. Therefore I sometimes write down a couple of things so I don't forget them but it also keeps me a little grounded. If the shoe was on the other foot, would you not have been annoyed at him and questioned things a little. If it's the first time in 5 years that he's seen you that drunk then it obviously came as a big surprise.

You question right at the start about your partner being able to support you after the death of one of your parents (sorry for your loss). I think that's more fundamental than anything - if I was with someone for that long and didn't think that they'd be able to support me through that, I'd be questioning why and having a conversation with them about that. As mentioned, my partners parents don't have the best relationship and it has coloured his view a little. My dad died before we got together but it was something I was still actively dealing with for a long time and I never doubted his ability to support me through - in fact he's been great.

Genuinely I think you both need to have a proper conversation with each other about your relationship, any issues you have with each other and expectations (both on marriage and domestic routines).

bucketybuck

It might just be me, but what struck me most about the OP was how sterile it all sounded.

It all seems like a relationship of convenience, you are interlinked and it works but I don't get a sense of any great passion or love.

Which is probably why after 5 years you get a situation where he says some things you don't like and you are now thinking that you don't want to waste any more time on him. You don't seem to have deep feelings of hurt or rejection, you just don't want to waste time on this. It all seems very transactional, like having to exchange romance and gestures like they are just part of the deal rather than a spontaneous thing couples do.

I can only see words on a page, only you know the truth of this, but are you in this relationship because you love this guy or just because it works?

DeepBlue

I don't want to waste anymore time on someone who isn't fully accepting of me, or who doesn't think the world of me.

This bit jumped out for me. Tbh I'd run a mile from someone if she told me those were her expectations from a relationship. It would appear that no disagreement or any negative feedback is welcome.

And while it might be harsh and unfair - a guy going out and getting falling-down-drunk is different to a girl doing the same. Sadly, the guy is not going to be at the same risk as the girl.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118326272#Comment_118326272

Indeed - any relationship is always an act of compromise at some level or another. Perfection is a myth. As regards marriage OP, there are various reasons to get married but the most compelling are around creating a secure structure within which hopefully children can be raised. We lived together for maybe 7 years and I always felt in some ways that that was more committing at a personal level, as either of us could walk away (not easily but handily). Once we decided we were ready to have a child, it felt right and even necessary to marry and create that more secure legal structure. So maybe that's what you need to figure out first with your partner, are ye ready and willing to try having children. You say your in your 30s - early, mid or late is a big difference. Time waits for no one.

[Deleted User]

Hello everyone.

I wanted to come back to some points and update. Thank you for all the replies, the advice is really helpful as is having this space to just be really honest.

Regarding me saying I stayed out way later - I should have been specific in that he offered to collect me at 9.30/10pm as I never intended staying out until closing time, in the pubs case was 11pm. To me, this is late considering my evening started at 6pm and 5 hours of consuming alcohol is not something I regularly do. (And clearly am not able for)

The different perspectives are really interesting and made me think. It really comes down to me crossing a line from his perspective and how I come back from that. I haven't made excuses about the state I was in, but this was the first time since my college days since something like that happened. Maybe it is about him trusting I won't do it again.

We had a discussion about it again when the dust settled. It was calm. We both spoke from our own positions and finding a middle ground was tough. He continues to have expectations around domestic duties. Granted, when we are together these things happen naturally and he contributes and cooks and I hadn't worried about this issue the last months we've been searching for a house. I think when we live together again full time these routines will be established as they had in the past.

Feels the issue hasn't resolved fully.

@DeepBlue - I take your point but just to say I don't live in a bubble of naivety. In the past I had tolerated behaviour I now wouldn't in relationships regarding effort and consistency. Even though relationships are hard but I still want my partner to think highly of me. Maybe that is alarm bells.

@bucketybuck My post was concise but this phase since the night out two weeks ago has been very difficult for me. To feel the relationship is vulnerable is devastating for me and I deeply love this person, who has stood with me through the most difficult period of my life. I would miss the laughter and sillyness beyond words.

The communication piece about where we we are going is easy, the discussion about where we are is tricky, and, for someone who usually doesn't have trouble in this department I'm finding it a challenge...

[Deleted User]

How did he justify himself when he expressed these expectations around domestic duties?

I'd be nervous about how that might escalate once you have a house together.

TheadoreT

This begins and ends at him clearly seeing you as lesser despite both being working professionals. It's a deeply condescending attitude. He wants his prim and proper partner who doesn't indulge in alcohol and knows her place in the kitchen.

It's fine if you like that role and being treated inferior in a relationship but if you don't it's a massive issue. You'll always have to accept a deep lack of respect in this regard. It will probably manifest into rearing kids being the majority of your efforts.

Bob Harris

If you were to get married it doesn't sound like it would be much fun.

[Deleted User]

"I am very emotionally aware, possibly from my line of work. He, and his family are not so much. They don't communicate about problems."

For me, this is the biggest red flag on your future. Research attachment styles in adult relationships. You do not want to lie awake at night facing up to the reality that you'll never get the love you need from the person you married. An emotional dullard who does not communicate screams an insecure avoidant-dismissive attachment style. Find an emotionally secure person who has the courage to communicate their needs, dreams and desires and you'll save yourself years of withering loneliness.