I for one do not believe he shot them people out of self defence and never meant to kill them. I think he intended to kill them and thought he would get away with it. The Judge as well is a joke. What a very strange trial. Only in America.
JUST IN - Rittenhouse verdict expected within the next hour - media reports
I was of the opinion that it would have been a speedy acquittal but the longer it goes on, the more likely it will be that Rittenhouse will be found guilty of something.
It's such a clear cut case of self-defence in my mind, I think something else is at play here. One/some of the jurors may be influenced by other things than the evidence. Have I proof of that, no.
Whether or not you like Rittenhouse or agree with his actions on the night, the prosecution do seem to have infringed on his rights to a fair trial so even if Rittenhouse is convicted of something, there'll still be a long way to run. The judge still has to rule on the two mistrial requests. And if they don't go Rittenhouse's way, then I'd fully expect Rittenhouse to be granted an appeal.
I honestly thought it would be a reasonably speedy acquittal given how the trial seemed to go. Surprised to see it drag on this long.
A hung jury is a better outcome than a negotiated guilty on some lesser charge for the sake of pleasing the one ideologue on the jury, anyway. That's a mistrial and Rittenhouse gets another shake at it, probably with a much better defence team funded by donations from people who will be outraged that he wasn't acquitted.
The judge has yet to rule on the defence's motion for a mistrial though. I'm not actually clear on whether or not they have included a request for prejudice (meaning he cannot be tried again), nor on whether that request has to be placed prior to the end of the trial or if the defence can cite all the prosecutorial misconduct at the end and ask for a mistrial with prejudice. I saw some lawyers on YouTube speculating that it may have been Rittenhouse's request that his lawyers go for mistrial without prejudice as the jury deliberations drew on and he became nervous about conviction, which suggests to me that if you ask for a mistrial with prejudice then the judge will consider that and that alone, rather than coming back and saying "I have considered your motion for mistrial with prejudice but I'm granting it without prejudice" kinda thing.
And then you have to wonder, if it is a mistrial on a hung jury, are the prosecution even going to want to try this case again given what a disaster it has been. I know that Robert Barnes is already chomping at the bit to refer the prosecution to the bar because he has a bee in his bonnet about how often small-time defence attorneys are punished for misconduct as compared to prosecutors. And Andrew Branca, a lawyer who specialises exclusively in self defence cases, has taken an interest in this case. No idea if he has a license in Winsconsin but he'd probably be willing to consult on it.
It's all very dramatic and interesting, really. So much so, it's easy to forget that an 18-year-old's life is hanging in the balance of it all.
We don't know for a fact that the delay is 2 jury members etc. That's just speculation. It may or may not be true.
I read in 90% of murder trials where deliberations enter 3rd day it will result in hung jury,also the delay is 2 jury members including fore person who are pushing for conviction on a lesser charge.
Or if you are a Kenosha prosecutor, a mostly peaceful protest and they should have just accepted a whooping. After all, we all need to take a beating sometime.
Ashli Babbitt was advancing through a smashed window, while trespassing, in the middle of a high-pressure situation. IIRC the agent who shot her shouted a warning and then fired when she continued advancing. I think he could have reasonably believed that his life was in imminent danger, especially given that there was a mob likely to advance behind her. Despite the fact that there were people behind her, I think the angle she was shot at (more or less from the side) precludes reckless endangerment.
So about the same, I guess.
I'd imagine it's similar. Self-defence is a pretty universal concept.
Out of curiosity, how does Kyle Rittenhouse's self-defense plea compare to that of the Capitol officer who shot Ashli Babbitt?
You honestly think that the left media like CNN etc would report on a BLM supporter being spotted with a rifle outside the protest?
2BN worth of insurable damage done during their "mostly peaceful" riots in the name of BLM, who knows what the uninsured damage was.
I'm pretty sure the idiot with the AR15 was arrested as well, because it's illegal to possess a firearm or open carry a firearm (I forget exactly) within 1000 feet of a school without getting permission from the school first.
I personally think they should disallow protesting that close to the court house while the jury is deliberating. It doesn't seem to me that It's productive enough to outweigh the downside of potential jury intimidation.
One word - Antifa. Try looking into exactly why Kyle Rittenhouse went to Kenosha that night. The place was being burned and destroyed, and they were not Trump supporters that's for sure. (Imagine if they were!)
You'll figure out how the world works some day, don't worry.
The summer of love 2020 was quite arson-y and property damage-y and was condoned and sometimes encouraged by politicians and people on the left.
Are you for real?
But but but the violence, no not that type of violence!
Do you have a shred of evidence to back up “the left loves arson and property damage”.
But that's referring to "terrorism" i.e. guns/bomb plots. I'm referring more to political violence in the form of rioting/looting.
You see I am referring to arson and property damage which doesn't fit the FBI's profile of "domestic terrorism" so is conveniently omitted. This is a massive assymetry - the left loves arson and property damage - "burn this MF'er down" - whereas the right tend to be property owners and have no interest in destroying things.
He is not a republican hero because he shot people.
He is a hero because he went out that night with good intentions, to try and protect the people/businesses in the nearest big city to him which was being burned and looted over misinformation in the media.
He found himself in a life threatening situation by some pretty gruesome people, and defended his life. He then handed himself in to police.
People have sympathy because his name has been dragged through the mud, he is anything from a murderer to a white supremacist apparently, with no evidence to back it up. His life has been turned upside down based on what was intended to be a good deed. The context has been completely stripped on the propaganda in the media paints a distorted picture.
People also don't like the idea of mob rule, of media misinformation, of juries being intimidated into giving the "correct" verdict. THAT'S why people are rooting for him.
Again the assymetry in violence between left and right.
The right will show up, shout some things and generally not get violent. They might be armed and shout obscenities but that's not really a crime.
The left on the other hand, are always the ones who get physical. They try to grab signs and damage people's property, and show no respect for police.
There will be exceptions to the rule, no doubt, but the pattern is clear to anyone with eyes and an open mind.
The only people arrested outside the courtroom so far was one kid wearing a 'fcuk kyle' t-shirt and another lady who claimed to be a leader of some black lives matter chapter. I saw some footage it seemed she just wanted to along for the craic, the kid though attacked a woman and a journalist. Of course that MSNBC journalist was arrested aswell and banned from the court-room for following the jury.
They really are reaching for straws here.
Haven't fully read into that story but yeah, seems like he was there to counter the BLM supporters. I wouldn't be a supporter of how he seems to be conducting himself.
From the little news report I did read, it seems that he has complied with all police directions.
What was your point?
The trial sounds bizarre, alright, but it shouldn't be viewed through a political spectrum.
A minor shot three people and killed two of them. The circumstances and the background should be investigated and the evidence presented and a judgement made on that basis.
This isn't/shouldn't be about Dems vs. Republicans/"Left vs. Right"/etc. (I know that, sadly, it has become that). People championing this as a win or a loss for either side need to get a grip. Two people are dead and a young man has to face up to the consequences of his actions that are going to greatly affect the rest of his life.
People using the trial for political point scoring are disgusting.
In terms of gun control objectives, what would be the point of putting this guy in prison?
You are making a martyr out of someone, who your opponents can very clearly show was using his weapon in self defense. And is a clean-cut kid with no criminal record. It would be counter productive.
You're actually strengthening the case of the pro-gun lobbyists. Especially considering the ridiculous arguments made by the prosecution, suggesting Rittenhouse should have "just taken a beating". No self respecting pro-gun American is ever going to buy into that sort of rhetoric. The whole point of being pro 2nd amendment, is that you are self-reliant and can take measures to protect yourself instead of just rolling over and allowing yourself to be an easy victim.
"Just take a beating" is one of the worst quotes to come out of this trial. And many American's will see that as being the antithesis of what it means to be an American.
Let your city burn, and just take a beating! (and while you're at it, bow and take a knee as well) lol
If you really want to make an example out of someone, with this objective in mind, the guy you want to go after would be someone like Gaige Grosskreutz. A man with a criminal record (domestic abuse, burglary and more), who was running around with a gun that he wasn't legally entitled to be carrying on the night.
Excuse the pun, but the left in America are notorious for shooting themselves in the foot when it comes to these issues. Even pushing for such a high profile trial of Rittenhouse, is a perfect opportunity for their opponents to shine a nice big bright light on some of the horrible characters that make up these BLM type movements - who would otherwise get to hide like the cowards they are in a big crowd.
You're probably right, the republicans will be laughing all the way to the bank with this circus. It's a massive own goal from the left.
Man spotted with AR-15 outside Kyle Rittenhouse trial confirms he is a fired Ferguson police officer
KENOSHA — A man who screamed obscenities about Black Lives Matter and carried an AR-15 rifle outside the Kenosha County Courthouse while the Kyle Rittenhouse jury deliberated is a former Ferguson, Missouri, police officer, he confirmed Thursday.
Bloody blm at fault again!
If the kid has any sense, he'd be better off staying well away from that sleazeball.
Though I imagine Gaetz is only interested in him as he's proven himself as a minor who crosses state lines.
This 17 year old is made for life. He is a republican hero. In America shooting people is profitable.
Another Germanic surname!
wow, the German's have really been patient and played the long game, before finally deciding to take over America! 😀
In fairness, although this must be horrible for a 17 year old kid to go through, these things can be the making of someone when/if they come out the other side. Rittenhouse did appear to have some aspirations to serve his community in some civic capacity before all of this crap happened. Hopefully he doesn't get used by people with shady ulterior motives, which is always possible with an impressionable naive teenager. (particularly in the dirty world of politics)
"He deserves a 'not guilty' verdict, and I sure hope he gets it, because you know what, Kyle Rittenhouse would probably make a pretty good congressional intern," Rep. Matt Gaetz of Florida said. "We may reach out to him and see if he'd be interested in helping the country in additional ways."
It's not the FBI drone footage.
This is footage that was apparently dropped off a few days ago by an anonymous source who didn't want to be named. But the (original) video had a strange aspect ratio, and has since been shown to be a video that was aired on Fox News last year, and the aspect ratio is strange because the top part of the video that includes the Fox logo has been cropped.
I don't honestly know how they were able to get the video admitted, considering the time that's lapsed, the anonymous, unknown source, and how easy it is to manipulate and edit video footage to add, remove or change details, but here we are.
That video was not the one that was sent to the defense, anyway. The video the defense was sent was a much lower resolution and had been renamed.
Kraus (the co-prosecutor) had his laptop on screen in the trial, and he has two video editing programs on his computer that would generally only be used by professionals working regularly with video editing - coincidentally they just happen to be one that is used for cropping video and one that is used for reformatting at different resolutions.
IF the judge decides to carry out his stated intention to take testimony under oath from the prosecution about how the "mix up" occurred, and take Kraus' laptop into evidence so that an expert can look through the log files of those video editing programs, Kraus might find himself in some seriously deep **** of his own. Tampering with evidence in a capital murder case is a very serious crime.
New video and photos have also come to light from earlier in the day of the shootings, clearly showing Rittenhouse and his friend with the owners of Car Source, who testified under oath as prosecution witnesses that they didn't know Rittenhouse of his friend and had never spoken to them or been aware that they were intending to guard the place. The prosecutors apparently had access to these photos and videos, and therefore may be guilty of suborning perjury. The penalty for that is disbarment and/or suspension of their license.
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