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Upscalers, modern TVs and related blasphemy

o1s1n

I thought we had a thread about scalers here but can't for the life of me find it on the new Vanilla boards.

I've a move coming up and am culling a hell of a lot of my collection, mostly duplicates and things I don't need, but a big hard hit is CRTs. Still keeping the cabs so I won't be totally going cold turkey but I need to start looking into the world of scalers for the time being to play consoles on a big screen.

Last time I searched out info, the xRGB Framemeister was the ****, with the OSSC also being rated up there. The Framemeister now costs a ridiculous amount of cash, so I'm guessing the OSSC is the way to go?

I see there's also the RetroTINK out there too, anyone heard anything about that?

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Colonel Panic

It would look greeeat in my person cave!

Colonel Panic

Just got a GameBoy Player so trying out GBI 360P support on the RT5X as well as its LCD filter. I'm very impressed!

Victor McDade

Can anyone who bought the 5x say what the total price was after tax and shipping? Tempted to upgrade from the OSSC

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117960813#Comment_117960813

I've been afraid to work that out...!

310 for the item shipped and then I think it was 65 tax when it landed. So 375 in total or thereabouts.

Does anyone notice that the scart port on it is a little, saggy? When you connect up a scart cable it sags down a bit, was worried about it putting pressure on the connections so I've put some supports under it to keep it level.

Might have to get one of those 3D printed vertical stands to keep the scart connection stable.

Victor McDade

Nice one, thanks. 375 is a bit lower than I expected, might pull the trigger in the next restock

o1s1n

It's totally worth it to be honest. I'm sitting here happily playing my Saturn on a big Sony panel and dare I say it, it looks really really good.

Victor McDade

Good stuff, I'll keep an eye on Mike's twitter, he usually gives an update on restock dates ahead of time

BuckoA51

I've been trying to get stock of the 5x for months never get allocated any :( Official EU reseller and still not got even one for myself lol.

CathalDublin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118133663#Comment_118133663

Wondering the same, €375 is a bit rich for the retrotink for me as I rarely get the chance to fire up a console but I could spend €80 on an ossc and be happy for it to gather dust

Colonel Panic

The OSSC is great, but I mentioned its shortcomings upthread - Not great for interlaced content, not great for frequent resolution changes, hard to configure vs the RetroTink5x built-in horizontal sampling modes.

That said, it’s mostly plug and play, unless aspect ratio issues bother you, and at that point, you’ll always find a guide.

I couldn’t bring myself to sell mine so I plugged it into one of my office displays.

CathalDublin

That’s exactly what I wanted it for, to have on my office desk for playing the odd SNES/MD game on, I’ll still need something for my c64/speccy but i suppose I can plug a Koryuu into it but that’s another €100 or just buy a RetroTINK 2X-Mini for a little cheaper

Colonel Panic

The RetroTink2x SCART is a good option. There's a few caveats - you'll need to set your display to 4:3 manually, and turn the sharpness right down to get good results since it's only doubling input video

Colonel Panic

Pretty big RetroTink 5x firmware update just released. New OSD, lots of filters, good sensible defaults but tweakable if you want.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118359797#Comment_118359797

Finally got around to giving this a go, that was some update. The ability to crop the image is brilliant, currently playing Sonic in PVM 600 mode with the blue underscan bars cropped out and it looks amazing.

Steve X2

This new scaler and switch from PixelFX looks pretty interesting. I'm liking the configurability of the infinity switch and the fact that the upscaler and switch can communicate. Lots of potential and hopefully they can get it out the door this year.

https://www.retrorgb.com/pixelfx-announces-infinity-switch-morph-specs.html

Colonel Panic

@o1s1n - Great isn't it? The overscan on some console is so annoying. The NES is another culprit!

@Steve X2 - I love that the inputs can include HDMI, which I'm guessing can be just passed though.

Steve X2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118452769#Comment_118452769

I think it can scale the HDMI as well as pass it through directly.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118452769#Comment_118452769

Indeed! It just feels like with every firmware iteration, I'm getting more and more image controls from my CRTs over to a flat panel, it's brilliant.

I was watching their release video on the page you can download the latest firmware and some of the interlacing modes with their CRT emulation effects really look very authentic - quite excited to give that a go with some 480i content.

HDMI on that PixelFX is very interesting, funnily enough I was only wondering if there was some way of getting HDMI through the Retrotink last night while playing some games on my Switch, would love to get some good scanlines on modern sprite games.

Colonel Panic

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00R19BG7O/ref%3Dcm_sw_r_apan_glt_fabc_V091QYMZ4Z9F4X48PHRM?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

HDMI to component into your RetroTink!

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118454389#Comment_118454389

Oh yes! I forgot it had component inputs on the back - haven't any other use for them so I might as well use them to get HDMI in there :)

McDermotX

Disappointing news re: OSSC Pro

Just can't come together at the moment...component market forces etc, so any proposed launch has gone on hold until a more feasible time

https://videogameperfection.com/2022/01/14/newsletter-component-crunch/

Colonel Panic

https://www.retrotink.com/post/retrotink-5x-pro-firmware-updates

New RetroTink 5x firmware. Mostly new resolutions but also you can set a default profile, which is useful

o1s1n

Nice, I'll check that out! Yeah it's been a bit annoying having to select the profile I want to use every time I switch it on. Small enough niggle though.

Do you ever notice a bit of a jiddering in the image at all? I was playing my NES there recently over RGB and noticed something a bit odd - can mainly see it in an Everdrive menu when there's text. Only way I can really describe it is a drop shadow on letters. The drop shadow will be on one side and then it might shift to the other side. It's not constant, just happens randomly.

Must see if it happens for any other consoles.

Colonel Panic

Hmm, sometimes I see it when the resolution changes, or the Tink thinks it has when you change to a very different screen. It's like it's trying to correct its horizontal sampling rate.

It happens sometimes for me on the Saturn when in the Fenrir menus but it's very brief and seems to happen once, then everything is pixel sharp.

I haven't used my NES enough on it to compare but I'm sure it'll be in play soon so I'll let you know.

o1s1n

Ah grand, I was hoping it might be something as innocuous as that - was worried it might be my TV not being a good fit for the Retrotink.

o1s1n

So how are folks getting on with their Retrotinks?

I was moving about some bits in my AV setup last night and it really did strike me how badly placed the scart port is on the side. It's actually backwards too. Can see it here below, the cable comes towards the front of the unit, should be heading towards the back.

I'm actually a bit concerned about the forces being exerted on the port because of this as you've to loop the cable back over the unit.

I see you can actually get an adapter to change the orientation, but you're talking 50 quid+after adding a shell, postage and tax...it is very neat looking though!

https://kytor.com/store/product/5x-y-z/

Inviere

I've never seen the 5x running in person, so @o1s1n, question time...

Full on CRT Trinitron versus RT5X on a modern display...what's the verdict?

I'm thinking down the line a bit, when the inevitable happens to my larger CRT....are they actually worth the seeming constant worry/maintenance if the 5X can get you 90% of the way there?

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120473335#Comment_120473335

It definitely can fool your brain into thinking you're looking at a large CRT screen. The image just looks right, it's definitely quite pleasing.

However, if I still had the space for a 29 inch Trini I'd still have one and I'd still be trying to keep it alive.

This is going to sound really subjective and maybe a bit silly so may not be a concern for most, but analogue video on a CRT to me just feels 'alive' - you've the glow of phosphors which just can't be recreated on a flat panel. The image looks very very similar, but it's missing that aspect.

Saying that, I'm using a 5 year old Sony LED TV, so I'd imagine a decent OLED will improve that quite a lot. Perhaps it helps negate it completely.

I suppose the big impact of it for me is I'm no longer fearful of a future devoid of CRTs. I can now play all my old consoles on something that supports HDMI, scaled correctly and with CRT filters that make it look like it's meant to look. Pretty much future proofed!

Inviere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120473397#Comment_120473397

I think I know what you mean re alive. It's literally what it is, a flat image on a flat panel....it's missing that 'something' akin to vibrancy. Maybe an OLED bridges the gap, I'd be interested to hear anyone's experiences with a 5X and an OLED. Image retention & static HUD elements is a cause of concern, but there's nothing I despise more in a modern tv panel than local dimming zones & the awful halo left around things.

tonyotonyo

Crts can feel alive alright