Haha. Dear Alistair can’t have it both ways.
he says Boris has made a total mess of brexit, but that almost all business people in ni love it. You’ll have to do better than that Alistair 🤔
downcow...open your eyes...Unionism is behaving like a rabbit in the headlights. Imploding with fear of what is ahead.
Let's live in the real world here. Paralysed with 'fear' at what is happening, the coming together of what was once partitioned and being pushed together by the actions of your own queen, government and union.
On your two points.
the first one is close to offensive. Many of the politicians you are referring to have be directly affected by sectarian violence and are still mourning friends and relatives. This is the case for the leaders of all four unionist parties.
your second point. Of course anything is possible but there is a clear and consistent position that polls always show less people voting for unionists that there are supporting the union. I believe that will be more stark when it’s for real
I hope you and many more nationalists keep believing that as, just like gfa, your Ui is sailing further away into the sunset
What does that mean?
Boris has made a mess of the Brexit the UK wanted.
Northern Irish business has benefitted because the Irish government intervened in Boris's Brexit and ensured he lived up to his country's commitments to international agreements.
The 'rabbit in the headlights' will spend a final moment pretending it isn't an on rushing car or train, I suppose.
At no point does his tweets claim that the business people loved Brexit. However, they see the benefit of the NIP as opposed to the unionist nonsense claims that the NIP is damaging the NI economy (nonsense which is clear to see)
I wouldnt say offensive. True many of them have lost people to the troubles as have we all yet still they are clearly seeking a hard border with all it's consequences...why?
Disagree completely here downcow. There is so much recent history in this island that I think anyone from the Nationalist community, when push comes to shove, will vote for a United Ireland, heart over head, in much the same way as the English voted for Brexit with fear over head. Much more so than Unionists, who can see that their loyalty means nothing in England.
I also believe that although some from the Republic say they don't want to pay for the North, again I don't see them being remembered as the generation that denied Irish unity. And any Irish politician would give their right arm to be the Taoiseach that was holding the reigns during unification - instant political immortality. It will happen, its just a case of when.
Partitionists aligning with Unionism is not going to be a pretty sight and not a single political party here or dare I say, politician of any standing, will go there.
I had to read back to check for my typo. But none there. It means exactly what it says
They are not
There isn't any dichotomy in what Campbell says. It makes perfect sense.
This is quite the insane take. If the north had gotten the 'full British Brexit' then it would have been at the arse-end of some extremely strained supply-chains with severely impacted cross-border commercial activity.
It's being rescued from Brexit by Dublin/Brussels that has, so far, spared the north the economic calamity Frost seems determined to inflict upon GB.
Into the unknown folks.
seems article 16 is a cert. none of us really know the outcome. I do feel republicans here will be upset. 60% of nip is good for business and atm doesn’t annoy northern republicans or the people of roi, and I completely understand that. They would be happy to leave things alone.
I don’t know a single unionist who is against art 16 being triggered. Of course there are significant risks for everyone but unionists have potential gains and really nobody else does. Strange situation. But get your seatbelt on, it will be a bumpy ride for all of us - but a piece of piss compared to the 30 year ira sectarian onslaught.
unionists are up for this.
I still trust common sense will prevail and we’ll get to a better nip.
You do know the difference in percentage of ni goods that come from our mainland as opposed to our neighbouring country? I can’t remember exactly but it’s dramatic difference and you want to protect the wee one.
I've said it before, the Unionist boxed themselves into a corner where the Protocol was a disaster for them and a Brexit like the rest of the UK was an even bigger one for them.
Seems to me they are gonna test that out. Ho hum, bring it on I suppose.
Actually the is one outcome of article 16 that I do know. The Eu will negotiate, which many posters on here have assured me in post after post they will absolutely never do.
The EU always said they will negotiate if there are credible alternative arrangements.
Collapsing the Protocol and the WA only means we will be back to the table negotiating the same stuff again, except that all trust in the UK will be gone and the terms of a trade agreement the UK must get in some form will be tougher and more onerous.
By the way, invoking Art 16 will not collapse the Protocol on it's own.
Firstly I think nationalists and republicans recognise that everything the British are doing is bringing a united Ireland even closer. Now as they say there are none so blind than those who will not see so I'm not really expecting you to see it. But many do see it (including the Scots)!
Secondly, the unionists that you know aren't necessarily representative of all unionists. Many will be concerned at the UK government triggering Art16 and the potential economic fallout. If they are not concerned then again, they are choosing to ignore it, possibly because their bias is stronger than simple common sense.
As for your trolling about the IRA campaign, if I do recall, there was more than one side involved in the sectarian onslaught including groups joined at the hip to political parties and aided by government agencies. One could also make the claim that the government of the time was involved the murder of its own people. But no, you just needed to get a dig at one side, presumably to rile other posters.
As for your point about common sense prevailing: die hard unionism has never done common sense and I don't see them starting any time soon!
Negotiate what exactly? If you look, Belgium are looking for the TCA to be revoked. The UK government has pretty much thrown away all goodwill that was out there; they dont want to come to an agreement
Ok well, they are. And the reason is they believe a hard border will bring them closer to the 'precious union'.
And a return to violence unfortunately is an acceptable cost to chase that dream
Thanks francie. You don’t often accept you were wrong.
yes you are now correct (if art 16 is triggered) the Eu will negotiate.
….and yes it does not ditch the entire protocol (thankfully). The guy on radio ulster (john xxxx) get admired by all sides for his simple explanations complex issues, said tonight that the options under 16 are ‘expansive for the Uk’, ‘they are not as restricted as some are suggesting’. Anyhow, I don’t understand it all but that was music to my ears
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-59167024
Bizarrely gloating over inflicting economic damage on Britain primarily, relationships with the majority in the north secondly and galvanising the rest of Ireland to hold firm against it all. Quite incredible to witness the self-destruction of unionism in real time, it's the kind of thing you'd read about in other places in a different century but no, we've got front row seats.
Bring it on.
The EU have been negotiating within the framework of the Protocol which thay and I, always said they would. You can try lying about what was said but the search function defeats you.
Are you sure, the unknown to me, John xxxx didn't say 'expensive for the UK'? Because it will be for those caught up in the gameplaying of the UK.
The british arent going to cut emselves off from the european market (if anything is up for renegociation-everything is)to save roughly 700K unionists.
Like the dup was literally holding balance of power and still the tories fcuked em over in the end....from ww1 to brexit,the unionist have never been nothing but willing fools for english
..your free to never want a utd ireland,but dont let the english continuely lead yous astray and abuse your trust....yous remind me of the gouls about where i live,who continuely vote ffg and wonder why nothing changes
There are a lot of unionist business people in the North who will surely be concerned at article 16 being invoked if its interfering with their business. Particularly if they export to the EU.
Oh I have have never denied that all sides were involved. I was speaking from a unionist position; we remember well the terrible sectarian onslaught against us. Understandably, none of us are as affected by what ‘our side’ done to the ‘other’. I suppose the subtext of what I am saying is that I never experienced the sense of an ‘enemy’ to focus on that is uniting a community, quite like this since the end of the ‘troubles’. I completely see that that has pros and cons, but it is what it is.
There may be but I haven’t been chatting to any
Ah well, sure if you haven't talked to any, there mustn't be any.
Ignore any pretence that this bellicose posturing is done to help Northern Ireland or its businesses. “**** business,” Johnson said, and he has done just that with his hardest of Brexits: Northern Ireland’s businesses suspect he has even less concern for them. Stephen Kelly, chief executive of Manufacturing NI, which represents 5,500 Northern Irish firms, tells me “not one” of his members has raised the obscure question of the government’s attempt to remove the European court of justice (ECJ) as arbitrator of trade disputes. “Everyone knows a treaty needs legal backup. There have been border problems with the rest of the UK,” he says, but the ECJ is “nothing but a Brexit purity issue”.
The Tories are sacrificing Northern Irish businesses on the altar of Brexit purity | Polly Toynbee | The Guardian
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