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Worm test results on store lambs

Dinzee Conlee

I had some posts about worms and results on the General thread, but said I'd create a new thread for it...

So, on 13th Oct, I did a fecal test on the store lambs and it came back positive for both worms & Coccidia.

I dosed on 15th (~2 weeks ago) with

Vexocan (for coccidia)
Fenebor white dose (for strongyle & nematrodairus)

As recommended by @wrangler - I did another test last Monday (about 2 weeks after initial dose) - and the results are not what I would have liked (I just got the results today)

See screenshot below...

It seems the white dose didn't achieve a great kill (it was 3100 EPG 2 weeks ago, so 85% kill maybe?) It did kill the nematrodairus , as you'd expect. But the strongyle is still there.

It also seems there is still some coccidia (although this was extremely high 2 weeks ago, at 22400)

So - what are peoples thoughts?

Should I go in with Bavicox for the Coccidia? (I have since read online, that one dose of Bavicox is better than two doses of Vexocan)

Should I try a clear dose for worms? I think you mentioned before you test at 500 EPG @wrangler

or given the white dose gave an 85% kill - should I just go again with this?

EDIT - thinking about this, dosing with the white drench again just selects for resistance I think, with an 85% kill…

Lastly, I'll come clean and say I have done FEC tests in the past, but it wouldn't be a regular occurrence. I guess these last two tests have maybe opened my eyes a bit to them, and how useful they can be. Does everyone routinely have these done?

Thanks folks...

PS - waiting from a call from my vet on the results, but as interested to hear what folks here do as much to be honest...

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wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058216250/worm-test-results-on-store-lambs

Try the clear dose, and test again in a fortnight, Or a yellow dose and test in a week 900 is way too much to be left and if the white didn't kill those 900 it was unlikey to kill them the next time either. You'll only make them more resistant. Levafast diamond might be a good dose as it'll kill the rumen fluke as well, you can test again in a week after that too,

I wouldn't know much about coccidia, but I'd expect six mth old lambs to be immune, however with such a high worm infection their immunity might have been compromised ,

As you know we do FECs here for nieghbours and this is the worst year for resistance in samples brought here we've ever had

We dose here based on FECs and after every dose we test again.

I would be interested to hear what your vet advises

You only got a 71% kill, There's a resistance problem if the kill is below 95%

Mad about baa baas

Screenshot_20211103-170947_Chrome.jpg

That seems good value..never dealt with that company but always got a great response from levafas diamond

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118112568#Comment_118112568

Spoke to vet, she said pretty much the same as you Wrangler

Previous dose wasn't effective, needs 95%
Dose with either clear dose or yellow (levafas)
Test after 7 days again
Wouldnt be too concerned with current coccidia numbers. Compared with first numbers, there was good kill. If they are thriving, and not scouring, she said leave as is. See how the numbers look in the next test...

So, must get some Levafas... (which is grand, as tisn't too dear, not compared to the coccidia stuff)

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118114165#Comment_118114165

Yea, coccidia only affects lambs under 12 weeks they seem to be immune after that,

I told a neighbour not to treat lambs for coccidia after a high coccidia egg count but they started passing blood a week later even though they were 5mths old, so I don't advise on coccidia now

Dinzee Conlee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118114210#Comment_118114210

Where do they pick up coccidiosis?

or could it be that I wasn’t on top of my dosing for worms, which put then under pressure which then led to the coccidiosis problem?

Not sure if it’s something we might have an underlying issue with here. We seem to be very short of minerals, but am wondering if it’s underlying coccidiosis, which is preventing the uptake of minerals as much as anything…

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118114346#Comment_118114346

You'd know if you had coccidia, lambs straining, passing blood, and the lambs get it at a month old.

See how they go after the next dose, Healthy lambs that age shouldn't have a problem with coccidia

eire23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058216250/worm-test-results-on-store-lambs

Intresting that you started this thread! I'm at the exact same thing currently, dung sampled the ewe lambs Im keeping on last week and they had a count of 2000. It was over 11 weeks since they were dosed last with oramec which is a ivermectin and not a moxidectin iirc.

Dosed them with a white dose to see if its still working. Have only used a white dose as a first dose for nemo for a long time now so hoping for a good result. I think the last time I used it for a late season wormer a member here done the dung sample for me, I was meant to start at it meself but never did. I'm sorry now I didn't start at it. Il post the results when I get them back.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118115227#Comment_118115227

Another person left in a post dose test today and showed only a 50% kill, is this wormer resistance going to be a huge problem now that we're getting a decent price for lambs

eire23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118126967#Comment_118126967

You would certainly think so, Id be hoping that the 3 classes of wormer would be working here. Closed flock and any ram bought in gets zolvix and try to use each class just once in the year.

Does anyone here give zolvix at any stage during the year? Seems to be a lot of conflicting advice about it.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118127752#Comment_118127752

Yea teagasc advise dosing bought in sheep with one of the POM doses and one of the doses that's working on your farm as well, we use zolvix and a yellow dose and leave them in a shed for 48 hrs.

Did you get the result of the last test yet. It'd be interesting to see whether it worked as once resistance occurs it's theere for good

We've double dosed bought in sheep for years here and have avoided resistance in yellow and clear dose, white dose is a bit iffy now but we'd use it an odd time for worms.

OH gives Zolvix to the ewe lambs after mating but that's the last wormdose they get in their life......... don't know why she uses it. What advice have you heard about it

eire23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118128106#Comment_118128106

No, it will be over a week until I sample again as it's two weeks after a white dose to resample I think. I'd be hoping there isn't resistance but that's probably wishfull thinking.

Id be the same here and never dose ewes for worms so hopefully that's helping aswell. On the zolvix, I've read that it should be used as a mid to late season drench to clear out lambs, sort of like what ye are doing and it stand to reason thinking about it but then the place where I buy some of the womers was saying to not be using it as it would only accelerate resistance.

Is the moxidectin/cydectin drench as bad for promoting resistance as the cydectin injection? For some reason I thought that because cydectin is persistent and it stays killing worms and then as it's effectiveness wears off its promotes resistance. I could be imagining that though.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118128278#Comment_118128278

Cydectin will stay killing susceptible worms but the resistant worms will keep multiplying untouched. It'd be like you continuing to dose with the same product even though it was getting less and less effective.

Fine if ivermectin is 100% effective but if there's any resistant worms they'll be multipling

razor8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118126967#Comment_118126967

What dose did they use?

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118134123#Comment_118134123

A yellow one, levicide, there seems to be poor results from the three different doses on different farms

paddysdream

Have been through all that .

FEC lambs here during the year and also ewes for fluke .Rarely if ever dose an adult sheep for worms and fluke dosing is only done on test results.

Had a serious worm (resistance )issue here a few years ago .Blamed it on doing ewes for fluke with Closamectin for a few years .

Started getting an issue with dose resistance in lambs about 8/10 years ago .Usual thing of poor thrive esp. in September/October .Started doing FEC regularly and found that ivermectin drenches were very ineffective .Killing 90% plus but no residual effect whatsoever .Egg count could be back up to 500/1000 within 3 weeks of dosing .

Got PMs done and a real chicken and egg job .Low cobalt and huge worm burden which could either be lambs were low in cobalt and so more likely to succumb to worm pressure or high worm burden was causing low cobalt levels .

Used Zolvix once on them after weaning .It didn't seem to do much for that crop of lambs thrive wise but did clear worm burden totally .Went back to white/yellow/clear following year and touch wood no issues since .

Get normal worm issues but dose and 10/14 day retest shows its working .Was recommended to use Gen 4 dose at weaning if problem persisted/returned but all good so far for the last few years .

Advice I got was to change my nematodirus drench each year from white to yellow to clear and then alternate the 3 classes each year eg on the lines of;

Year 1 yellow clear white yellow

Year 2 white yellow clear white

Year 3 clear white yellow clear

plus only dose on FEC results and to check dose if working or not with after dosing test .

Local vet does testing with result in a few hours so very handy .

J.O. Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118146935#Comment_118146935

You dose for fluke only on FEC results? Is that your vets reccomendation.

Fluke have a 2 host lifecycle and by the time you get eggs most of the damage will be done and in a bad infestation you could lose sheep without ever seeing eggs.

The eggs are passed and hatch on pasture and infect snails for the first part of their lifecycle.The ewes pick up immature fluke that then migrate (burrow) through the liver as they become adults.

Unless you have very dry land in all likelihood you have fluke on your land.

paddysdream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118147356#Comment_118147356

Replied on the phone and reading back over it only now .

Have very dry land here .Have tested ewes for fluke for a good number of years and have yet to get a positive result for liver fluke .An odd year shows up a small amount of rumen fluke .

Waste of time and money routinely dosing ewes for fluke .

The dosing recommendation came not from my own vet but a vet involved with one of the major pharma companies .Met him a few years ago on a farm and he said only fluke dose sheep that need it .Have phoned him a few times for advice re worm issues and he was the one that gave me the advice about the Zolvix and alternating the dosing regime etc etc .

J.O. Farmer

Around here if you didn't dose for fluke you'd know about it, ewes would be losing wool and falling round the place when you send the dog out. Some of them would have the bottle jaw.

Land round here would be wet though.