just noticed a lot of these articles in the British media over the last few weeks https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10118013/Nightclub-spiking-victims-ordeal-left-semi-paralysed-highlights-risks-women-facing.html
While i believe "spiking" does occasionally happen, I wonder how many of these stories are people who voluntarily ingested substances but do not recall ingesting them because they were intoxicated
Andrew said the Garda press office don’t always have the information to hand immediately, which is the case here.
He also said Grift are not a trusted source, which they are not. He was clearly right to be skeptical.
Have they put up an update yet correcting the facts of the case now that they are aware of them? They were happy to push it far and wide when the narrative suited their hateful and fearmongering agenda. A quick look at their website says no, they haven’t. Why is that, do you think?
'Garda headquarters initially said on Tuesday it “is not in a position to verify the contents of the highlighted social media activity at this time” and that it “has not recorded any incidents of this nature at this time”'.
Thus, Andrew was wrong in suggesting that Gript lied. Secondly, we don't know when the incident was reported to Gardai. It may not have been reported at the time the Gardai were initially contacted.
What nasty things did I say about anyone? You attacked the Gardai and Gript. This incident happened on Sunday so may not have been reported till Tuesday, meaning neither Gript nor the Gardia lied/didn't do their job. So no apologies needed.
She said on Twitter when asked by another girl did she notice anything strange, "no straight unconscious". The girl on Twitter's story doesn't tally with the news stories whatsoever.
This is actually a good article that does tie up a few things, so thank you.
It states that the claim is being investigated (which is good), that it had been previously confirmed that no report had been made (validating the grift article), and that the event was “now” being looked at. Doesn’t that just tell anyone how unreliable news and social medial coverage/ posting really is?
I insist: trying to turn this into a gender war helps nobody and just causes endless aggravation.
Everything is linked up.
I gave you two sources covering the same story that a report was filed about a woman who reported that she was spiked after waking up with a needle mark and bruising after a night out and then going to get medical treatment. There is every chance she doesn't remember everything of the night but her friends do and thus gave statements about her being disorientated, which is implied in the statement from Gardai.
Here is a THIRD source.
This one mentions the conflicting statements Gardai gave yesterday and today, which shows @AndrewJRenko was correct in that the Garda press office doesn't always have the information to hand straight away.
All of this ties up with what she said on Twitter, but people here are STILL looking for any possible hole in her story in an attempt to discredit her.
Yes many men have been spiked, but I haven't seen attempts to discredit them anywhere near like what's going on here. That's the problem.
Strange way to spell: "Sorry lads, I got it completely wrong. I take back all those nasty things I said about yez. "
Well, no. At this stage nothing is backed up by anything. You have a deleted Twitter thread, two conflicting “news” sources of questionable character, and a lot of speculation. Nothing is linked up. Which is exactly the problem for this topic, because it’s always one word against the other.
Look, I have done countless unsavoury things over the years, and I am certainly not going to dismiss that this happens. But I find it really annoying when people make claims online that contain partial information, and thereby cause people to fill in the gaps and turn it into a hysteria. Post the whole story or don’t post at all.
And please don’t try to turn this into a gender debate, as some male posters on this thread mentioned that they were spiked, too. Their views are obviously of equal importance.
Fair enough. Be interesting to know when the incident was first reported, as both articles are from today and the gript one from yesterday. I'm glad she had the courage to report it anyhow.
Don't see it in that article but 98FM are reporting that it is from Sunday.
Was the report from the weekend?
What evidence do you want? Her medical records?
Her medical records are none of your business.
She has told a story, which is backed up by a Garda investigation into a report she made with evidence that she has clearly been stabbed by a needle. Why would she say anything so public other than to warn people about it.
She provided a lot more evidence than those trying to shut her down by demanding her medical records and that she name the place it happened in.
And don't tell me nobody was trying to shut her down. They were. It's standard Twitter (and boards) discourse if a woman tries to say anything because some men's feelings might get hurt.
Just look at some of the responses to Cait's post about her experience. "Why didn't you go to police?" "You should have gone to police." etc etc etc.
Some people need to get their heads out of the sand.
Tbh I had the same thought as the poster. This is not what what had been claimed in the Twitter trail, but maybe that's the reason why she (had to) remove it since it might be impacting the investigation.
I do not care whether or not she was spiked. What bothers me is that someone decides to broadcast something via social media without any evidence, and that anyone who asks for evidence is shot down and branded a chauvinist.
This sort of antagonism does not help anyone.
In addition to Faugheen's report from the mirror. Not the same story, or even country but a report of a spiking related tape from the UK.
That is unfortunately buried under the news of the UK budget, Harry and Meghan and **** flowing freely into rivers.
I added a link to the MEN as I am loath to use the Daily Mail for anything resembling fact.
Point in case, the Daily Mail reports that the accused is charged with
'following a woman around a nightclub and spiking her drink before raping her in the street'
But the charge laid is rape of woman over the age of 16. He may have slipped an intoxicant to victim, from the stories it certainly is heavily alluded to. Was it a narcotic or was he adding alcohol?🤷♂️ I don't know.
The circumstances certainly point to the victim being rapidly overcome with loss of control which he allegedly took full advantage of.
Yet the charge lain, excludes any of the OAP 1861 charges available? Incidents such as this, highlight for me at least the need to impose a duty of care on venues regarding customer safety and their ejection if intoxicated. A woman, a man, anyone should never be left leave a venue alone if there is a concern as to their safety. Cut off drinkers if they are too intoxicated and ensure that door staff are better trained to recognise the risks that led to this poor woman's attack.
**Edited:** changed "of" to "have" to tidy up a sentence and not appear to be totally illiterate 😉😂
No surprise there.
I can’t remember what she said exactly, but what she did say is that she reported it to the guards after getting treatment.
Why are you continuing to discredit her? You were the one who pushed the Grift narrative yesterday and now you haven’t even acknowledged that they are wrong and haven’t corrected their story.
A report was made, you said there wasn’t. You now have information which says otherwise and your line of defense is ‘well it wasn’t her’.
Change the record.
Can’t be the same girl. Girl on Twitter claimed she was injected, felt woosy and then unconscious. The girl in the paper went home and noticed bruising the next morning.
Wind your neck in. There's no victim blaming going on, but your race to assume that mantle says quite a bit.
You made a claim regarding being spiked. I take that at your word. I'm not asking you to back it up nor even attempting to refute it.
What I am saying is that your assertion you didn't report it because no serious crime had been commited is wrong. Demonstrably so, and I provided a range of offences of up to 10yrs tariff that such an attack could attract.
Your claim that because you made it home, that no serious crime occured is wrong.
Your response to any attack, spiking or unwelcome attention is entirely your own.
But? Claiming victimhood, sharing a story that thankfully ended without any further infringement on your person, as evidence of widespread spiking? When unfortunately other than your recollection? No matter how well founded. Is not evidence of drug based spiking.
Without reporting same or even the suspicion of it and post exposure medical attention. Claims of drug based assault being widespread and pervasive? Are all too easily dismissed by the wealth of contrary academic and medical reports claiming that assaults of the type are vanishingly rare.
If the stories of widespread spiking are ever to be appropriately actioned? Timely reporting is a must. Indeed it's the advice offered by the Gardaí in the article Faugheen has posted above.
To report an incident of being spiked you can:
contact your local Garda station in person or by telephone
call to the Garda station in person accompanied by someone
According to HSE advice, if you think you have been spiked on a night out or in any other circumstance, you should:
get help from someone you trust, as you cannot be sure how your body will react to an unknown substance
keep hold of the spiked drink if there is any left, it might be used as evidence, so you should give it to someone you trust until it can be given to the Gardaí
ask a friend to take you to the Emergency Department if you have symptoms such as; drowsiness, vomiting, or hallucinations (seeing or hearing things that are not there)
tell the medical staff that you think your drink has been spiked
If you think that your drink has been spiked but you have no severe symptoms, contact the Gardaí. Reporting the incident as soon as possible will help to catch the offender
If the prevalence of this type of offending or the existence of needle based spiking are to be treated as anything more than moral panic? They need be reported, investigated and pursued to conviction.
Otherwise? Stories of random spiking and the potential of every drink being a gateway to assault or worse will carry on being a modern day boogey man.
Without reporting? Without the weight of proof? As harsh and as difficult it may be to hear? Carrying on with an attitude of #ibelieveher or #metoo won't do anything to address any actual issue other than grow a self reinforcing notion of belief in attacks, rather than evidence of them.
Well I wasn't really in a state to speak when I got home let alone report the incident to police. I wasn't aware I had been spiked until I put it all together after speaking to people I had seen that evening. All the memories about the incident are fuzzy and like I watched it on a film. I questioned my memory of things, what bus did I take home, what time did I leave the club... no idea.
It happened to me so there's no 'should' about it - utter victim blaming. Love it how people try to make ME feel bad when I was the victim here. The same would have been said by police - should have come earlier, should have gone to police.
Easy for people to say you 'should' do something, but unless it happened to you then you can't understand.
It's not just that they believed Grift, they worked really, really hard to make sure the Grift line was put out there as the only possible explanation, and worked really, really hard to undermine anyone who suggested that there might be another possible explanation.
Oh look, Gardai have received a report and they're now investigating it.
Complete with full quotes and all from the statement.
"A spokesperson told the Irish Mirror; “The nature of the incident is that the female became disorientated whilst socialising in licensed premises and discovered the following morning physical bruising possibly caused by a needle prick.
“The injured party, in this case, was supported by friends and brought home safely on the night and subsequently received medical treatment.”"
But Grift says there was no reports? Makes you wonder what question they put to Gardai.
Assume people who believed the bullshit from that anti-women piss site will back track now.
Or they'll just deflect with 'lol the Mirror' posts.
Mad how no other media have reported on it. You'd think such a public interest story would be front page news. But, no, no, you are right. It's probably just Gript lying, and the other newspapers don't wanna be done for libel. That's the one.
The simple fact is that Grift reported that Garda Press Office weren't aware of any recorded crime 24 hours later. That's the only fact you can rely on. Anything else is an assumption on your part.
Is there a link to the Garda press office statement? Gript haven't included it, rather they have editorialised and presented snippets.
The source of any news should always at least be considered. That's not a sleight against you btw. Rather a nod to balance and sourcing.
Yes yes, attack the source and the Gardai as expected. Going by your logic, the Gardai press office cannot be counted on to give correct information anytime ever. The simple fact is that there was no recorded crime, which is not unexpected as this crime is rare.
Good point Andrew and TBH, this is a point that needs reiterating. The source of a report, the bias implied and even more importantly the inclusion of the report/quote/info that an outlet bases it's reporting on are vital to it's credibility.
On that basis, gript should be very far down anyone's list of reliable sources.
Gript could have very easily appended the reply received from the Gardaí to the query. It would be a straightforward 1st hand source, that readers could interprets they wish.
Instead gript throw in a few selected sentences from the answer they received, interspersed with reportage. That reportage could include speculation and quotes from named sources, whinge about Regina Doherty.
The story should include the entire statement as received from the Gardaí. Gript can still apply any reportage style they like, but laying out the statement they rely on as the basis of their story?
Would make fact checking and searching for corroboration far simpler.
Gript does not present news, it spins news into rightwing views.
The leap of faith here is the suggest that Grift (home of the far-right, anti-women policies) asked the right question to the Press Office, that the Garda Press Office managed to get a definitive answer covering hundreds of stations (in the context of public, known issues of how they record information) about a very unusual incident, that could be categorised under a number of different offences, all within 24 hours, and that Grift reported the answer accurately.
If you can make that leap, you should qualify for the next Olympics.
Sorry this happened to you.
As for everyone else telling you what you should have done, they're best off ignored because if you did report it to the police, and your story ended up in the paper, the same people pretending to feel sorry for you now probably would have called you a liar anyway.
I understand exactly why you didn't go to police. Short of catching someone in the act it's nearly impossible to prove.
If you have been spiked? 100% it is a serious crime! To opine otherwise is dangerous tbh. If a person feels they have been spiked, they should most definitely both attend hospital as soon as soon as possible to ensure appropriate toxicology is carried out, and report the incident to the police as near immediately as possible.
In the UK spiking is prosecutable via multiple charges such as "Administration of a Noxious Substance" which carries a sentence of up to 3yrs. That's the minimum charge available tbh. Any CPS prosecutor presented with such a case? Would very likely seek to charge it differently via the Offences against The Person Act 1861 which allows for sentences of up to 10yrs.
"Section 23: Unlawfully and maliciously administering, or causing to be administered to or taken any poison or other destructive or noxious thing so as to endanger life, thereby inflicting grievous bodily harm. The maximum sentence is 10 years' imprisonment and the offence is indictable only.
Section 24: Unlawfully and maliciously administering or causing to be administered to or taken any poison or other destructive or noxious thing with intent to injure, aggrieve or annoy the person taking the substance. The maximum sentence is 5 years imprisonment and the offence is indictable only."
Interestingly, the 1861 act is the primary basis for identifying and prosecuting offences of the "spiking" type in Ireland too. A hangover from our pre1922 history but also! A means of ensuring "good" legislation is allowed continue in force despite its "British" origin.
Much of the the 1861 act has been superseded by the Non Fatal Offences against the Person Act 1997, of which section 6 is of particular note. As it carries a potential charge for syringe attacks, which the current panic would imply is becoming common.
6.—(1) A person who—
(a) injures another by piercing the skin of that other with a syringe, or
(b) threatens to so injure another with a syringe,
with the intention of or where there is a likelihood of causing that other to believe that he or she may become infected with disease as a result of the injury caused or threatened shall be guilty of an offence.
TLDR: Never ever assume that because you fear being spiked will be dismissed that "no serious crime has been committed" act upon your worry.
You may have at the very least been victim of an offence that carries a 10yr tariff. Yes the possibility that worse may have happened and a feeling that you escaped that may colour a want for justice or indeed reporting it.
But, anyone, ANYONE! Who feels they have been victim of such an attack, really should report it and seek appropriate support.
The academic evidence posted earlier in the thread points to random drug based spiking being exceedingly rare. It provides copious data in support of that conclusion and without people reporting instances where they feel they have been attacked in this manner?
The evidence available without those reports and gathered evidence will continue to support the notion of widespread drug spiking in pubs/clubs/venues will remain to be solely anecdotal and unevidenced.
All of that is irrelevant. The simple fact is there were no reports over the last weekend. You are making huge leaps of faith. Ignoring 999 calls and breathalyser abnormalities have nothing to do with this. You are simply attempting to undermine the Gardai in their entirety in order to suggest that there was indeed a reported spiking last weekend, a crime that is rare to begin with. You started initially by trying to undermine the source provided (Gript), and are now attempting the same with the Gardai themselves. I don't know the answer to your 2nd question. But then again, I'm not a Garda, the kind of people who would know. Good to know you won't be attacking women, though I don't know why you felt the need to tell me, I had presumed it already. We are on the same page with that at least.
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