This is the big advantage of Tesla and their supercharging network
The VRT rate is not just 2..5k though. The Arteon I wanted to buy in 2018 had 178g/CO2 -> 31%VRT. It has been replaced with the PHEV version claiming 26g/km->7%VRT. It is a 2.3t car. If one has time to believe the CO2 getting reduced to 13% of original value by adding 10kWh battery good for them. To me it looks doggy. The thing is the car in 2021 > 15% expensive as it was in 2018/19 and the difference is cashed by the manufacturer. The user is getting a lower specced car as if one drives long distance and the battery is depleted it has available 75% of the power for a heavier car. The state gets less tax more than it looses from me not buying petrol 5 years in row, but no think tank in IE cries about it.
Got proof that manufacturers knew?
Its only 2500 euro, I imagine manufacturers will soak up some of that.
Yeah I don't really swallow that study, only meet one person who did not bother to charge their car but I do see loads here complaining about phevs plugged in and rubbish like cheaper to charge at home or saving a euro.
Well you can definitely blame the manufacturers who claimed that BEVs of that level were decades away and lobbied for governments to give generous grants and tax breaks to PHEV buyers despite knowing they weren't being driven in a low emissions manner
And now that the Irish government has copped on and is cutting grants for PHEVs those car manufacturers are up in arms, again despite knowing that the average lifetime emissions of a PHEV is no better than a hybrid and very similar to an ICE car
You will get that and more power to them, but 10 seconds work would have saved them even more but a PHEV is intended to reduce emissions no point knocking the car, if used correctly.
If you have 2 EVs in a house and use enough range that both cars need charging every night (or enough nights to clash), you're probably living in the wrong location 😂
Seriously though. Standard family EV these days has 400km range (~70kWh battery). A 2nd EV would likely have 100-200km range so a <30kWh battery. 7kW for the big car gives 63kWh every night rate, and 2kW granny plug gives 18kWh for the 2nd car. That's a hell of a lot of driving if both are needed every day. CEE plug would certainly be worth it for a cheap fix if there's high mileage on both cars.
This will work and is great for powering oil heating in long power cut, along with freezer etc. Just beware this is a 12 volt to 240 volt system, and you need the car "on" to fill the 12 volt with the main battery. Worst case you may damage the car if you draw too much power and pop something. It's probably not that efficient and you are draining your EV battery during a power cut. Even a 300 watt inverter may work the basics for 50 quid.
You have to look at historical use of large SUV PHEVs, lots of UK ones were pure compliance purchases where owners never charged ever, just a purchase to avoid congestion charges etc
"Rapid charging capability at up to 50kW is included, so an 80 per cent top-up will take less than an hour; a full charge takes five hours using a home wallbox."
Nonsense that battery pack only weights 300 kg, it will function as a normal hybrid when depleted and average commute is what 30-40 km. So on balance it would save more than use giving average usage. Any way on a long journey what does it matter stopping for 20 minutes for a break and topping up for another 100 km.
Can you imagine the inefficiency of dragging around that battery pack once the battery has used up it's range, loopy.
PHEV always were and remain a dirty option
Get a pure sine wave inverter and attach it to the jump start points on the car, 150 euro for a 2000w on done deal. Pure sine wave is the important bit.
That's the dream, most EVs however don't have inverters to convert DC back to AC and there's no simple way to hook into the DC battery
Some car manufacturers are starting to cop on to reality and are offering inverters as an option. Ioniq 5 and Honda E are two good examples. The Ford F150 lightning will also have this option and the recent VW ID.Life concept had an AC output
So hopefully it'll become standard in the next year or two
EDIT: I forgot that ironically most EVs actually do have an inverter for the motor, and it's possible this could be modified to output domestic electricity. So it shouldn't be a huge job to start including V2H on many EVs
Maybe, but you have to balance the cost of getting 3 phase against the cost of charging at the day rate for a few hours
If it cost a euro a day extra in day rate electricity and it costs around €3k for 3 phase then that's nearly 10 years to pay back the cost. Might make sense for a new build where you're paying for a new grid connection, but seems a lot for a retrofit
If you did get 3 phase then 2x 7kW chargers might be a better route. Gives you almost full power and no load sensing nonsense. Alternatively you can get load sensing chargers like a Zappi and they can share a single circuit.
I have my Zappi and EO Mini in a single 40A circuit. The Zappi senses the load and if the EO is charging at 3.6kW then it'll adjust the charging speed to stay under the 7kW limit
And then this is announced
That's insane. More usable energy than my ioniq28. And it takes CCS.
In Europe, The PHEV variants combine the 3.0-liter inline-six engine and a 38.2-kilowatt-hour lithium-ion battery (31.8 kWh usable). The 141-hp (105-kW) electric motor integrates into the transmission. The P510e PHEV gets to 60 mph (96 kph) in 5.3 seconds or 62 mph (100 kph) in 5.6 seconds. Land Rover estimates a WLTP range on electric power of 62 miles (100 kilometers) and a real-world range of 50 miles (80 kilometers).
That's some battery for a PHEV, is there any other PHEV with a larger battery than this?
Just use load sensing charge points. Its almost standard on new charge points now.
You have 15-20A to spare when the two cars are charging and you have 9hrs to get your 99kWh. Easily achievable, even if you leave to go to work before night rate ends.... could be done in 7hrs even.
Dishwashers etc are not a big deal. They only heat water for a very short period of time during their 2hr cycle and the charge points can ramp down by 1kW to allow that to happen for the few minutes it takes them to heat the water. The rest of the wash cycle is only a few hundred watts. Not a problem.
Basically, you dont need more than 16kVA to get 99kWh's into your cars overnight.
Heating circulating pump, broadband router and a few lamps. It would be a very handy option to have on the BEV alright.
I saw some articles alright about by directional tech in the offing, I just want to run a cable through an open window and keep a few gadgets going in the living room, last time my kids were on the verge of moving into the car lol
The new ioniq5 supports 16a V2L. In order to use this for the house, legally, you'd need an isolator switch to disconnect the house from the grid and a blue CEE 16a connector for the house.
in the event of a power cut can you run a cable from an EV into your house , through an inverter to keep a few plugs going? our house had a powercut because of a road side fault a few weeks back , I wouldn't mind having an option or 2 if it happens again
I'd be concerned with 7.4kW + 7.4kW running on a 16kVA setup, there's only a 1kW "buffer" and I like to run everything at night, dryer dishwasher etc.
If we end up getting two EVs I may scope out the cost of a 20kVA upgrade. I know the 13 to 16 is not a substantial amount cost wise but I suppose the 20kVA is more chunky
EDIT: seems to be "€2,717 + MV Network Charges"
https://www.esbnetworks.ie/docs/default-source/publications/esb-networks-dac-statement-of-charges.pdf
Nothing stopping you having two EV's charging at the full 7.4kW each all night long. You just need to have the enhanced electricity supply of 16kVA and then ensure that the charge points are load sensing just in case something else like a kettle comes on for a few mins, but you can easily get your proposed 99kWh on a single phase supply overnight.
If needs be you can even go up another notch to 20kVA.
Not sure I'd like that but maybe it's just anxiety on my behalf going from a one to a two EV household. We've had 4 EVs so far but never 2 at the same time. Early next year we'll likely be a two EV household and I was thinking of getting a 7kW home charger and a 3.7kW CEE plug.
We are two EV household, we just chat as to who needs to use the charger what night, it's never been an issue in 4+ years. We have Zappi and worst case scenario an outside socket to granny charge but the need has never arisen
I think there may be a move to 11kW for some folks, particularly rural.
It's the norm in some EU countries already. If I have 2 Evs I'd like the option to charge both, or add 9*11 99kWh overnight in some breakdown. EG 60kWh for a main car and 40kWh for the second.
I accept we're an edge case but there's probably a few rural dwellers like us that do 50k plus in a year.
Actually, hold that thought, if I were installing 11kW I'd just install a single phase 7.4kW and a single phase 3.7kW instead.
I have no problem with one or two stops on a journey, but I would have a problem with waiting an hour in a queue for a charger. The public fast charging network is the weak link in all this and EV sales are increasing way faster than the network, so things are only going to get worse.
Hopefully you're right, no need for 90% of people to have a battery bigger than 50-70kwh in Ireland anyway.
Mine is only around 50 and can get anywhere on the island with one stop, which I'd do anyway if driving over 3 hours
Yeah I feel like people who think mainstream EVs are going to have 200kWh batteries are dreaming.
Even if all the upcoming battery technologies pay off it'll likely translate into smaller lighter batteries for most cars rather than more capacity
I think 50-80kWh is going to become the norm for most cars for the next decade. Most people are fine with a car that will go 300-400km between charges. Bigger batteries will be reserved for the luxury segment
