Basically it comes down to Farrell not rating Carty. He can outplay other 'deemed better' number 10's. Munster last week. Ulster this week.
Non of that matters. All that matters is Carbery once had form. (I forget the year) and he'll find it again, some time. Sooner, later, who knows.
As for Burns? I honestly have no idea. Non. Zero.
I think thats a lot of supposition and hope being put into Carberry, without much evidence to support it. Similar to the hope that Murray and Sexton could be played back into form. If he was good enough, he'd be showing it currently. Fact is, it's been years since he's lived up to the billing
Murray has been playing like a glacier for years now, it's a joke he's still getting picked, let alone starting.
He hasn’t been good enough since his return in March, but in the previous 2 years he had ~200 minutes for Munster. Your “It’s been years” comment is more than a little disingenuous.
He didn't do much when he was fit. Certainly nothing to suggest he could challenge Sexton. I feel like most of the hype for him still goes back to his Leinster days.
Ok so we have 2 of the greatest all blacks of all time. Jonah Lomu an absolute genetic freak. John Kirwan one of the greatest players ever. Both of who came through before professional rugby existed. But good examples, do continue.
Kirwan got his debut before any of the current Ireland squad were even born. I think OP has defeated his own argument.
I'm struggling to join the dots between Munster fans praising their players and Andy Farrell picking his Irish squad.
He had a run of games around Dec / Jan 2019 where he was very good.
Following that, he had an appearance off the bench early for an injured Sexton against Scotland where he played better than anything we’ve seen from any of the other options for Ireland, imo.
He’s not good enough at the moment. But I think he has a higher ceiling than the other options like Burns, RB and Carty if he can re-find his form. I’m not denying it’s a big “if” at the moment, mind.
I hope he does, we desperately need creative players. Really been disappointed with Larkhams influence. Munster have a lot of quality in the backs that isn't being used well.
Of the current ABs squad there's Tupaea Quinn 22, Josh Lord 20 and Ethan De Groot 22, the point I was trying to make is the Nov series is the time to try out some young talent against Japan and Argentina, sure play our A team against the ABs they won't get a chance in the 6 nations, hopefully the summer tout of NZ, but these lads have to be tried out under pressure, who knows we could unearth another Rog and Stringer.
In the current Irish squad we have three 22 year olds and four 23 year olds.
I don't know what point your trying to make but it can't be that we don't give youth a chance
It is absolutely nothing to do with age.
As always, people are pissed off that their pet players haven't been picked but are trying to deflect from that. And coming up with some spectacular nonsense in doing so.
Harry Byrne 22
Ryan Baird 22
craig Casey 22
Then you have Ronan Kelleher, Dan Sheehan, Gavin Coombes, Finian Whycherly, all 23.
if you’re good enough, you will make it through. Ireland aren’t any different than NZ in that. There’s a path way for all professionals. Tupea Quinn has 40 professional games under his belt at 22.
Andy Farrell has given so many new caps that the “we’re too conservative” argument has been practically distilled down to a single position, without any hint of irony.
And even then, I’m pretty sure Farrell has given debuts to Burns and Harry Byrne, and a 2nd Test start to Ross Byrne.
A lot of what’s being claimed just doesn’t stack up to any scrutiny.
Andy Farrell has given 22 new caps in 16 games.
Ian Foster has given 14 new caps in 17 games.
I'm of the opinion that the gap between international standard players and provincial players in Ireland has decreased. But we discuss international squads as if the gap was still huge.
It probably doesn't make a huge difference if Farrell selects Casey as 3rd choice 9 or blade, McGrath, cooney or Marmian the difference between them on a world stage is fairly minimal. Or Harry byrne, Jack carty of burns etc the gap isn't that great and they are only getting a few token minutes anyway.
Farrel will pick all the central contracted players plus a few likely lads. Anyone using form as a guide to selection is smoking the funny stuff imo
I've been a fan of Carty but I'd add to this that he made a couple of scandalous decisions against Ulster, one whee he called for the ball when Connacht were on Ulsters line pulling in forwards with pick and go's. Carty called for it after a couple of phases, passed it out and it resulted in a turnover. Just a really bad call that Farrell would see as a gilt edged opportunity wasted from impatience and a lack of smarts.
Possibly unpopular opinion but imo when we inevitably pick Murray at 9 against NZ whichever 10 we pick is on a hiding to nothing. We'll be playing slow, turgid, box kicking rugby.
I'd imagine that this is probably the most popular opinion on this thread at the moment.
But id say if Murray is picked and plays a box kicking game then that is the gameplan from the coach, its not Murrays fault. Personally I'd pick Gibson Park with Casey on the bench, with Burns starting and Sexton on the bench. So that Casey comes on with the experienced Sexton. But I am fully sure that will not happen.
Should be Casey and Healy. Need to back the future.
Burns isn’t there but perhaps you meant Byrne?
Scroll up about five posts. Someone else is 100% convinced that Doak and Crowley are the future.
Gotta say, it's been a decade since we produced a top quality nine or ten but now we have so many we don't know what to do with them all. Exciting times.
Yep, I meant Byrne. I dont think Carbery should be anywhere near the team.
Thought Crowley was very good on a poorly performing munster team, to me he is by far the superior of the u20s fly halfs over the past few yrs based on u20s six nations games
But if we don’t start playing these guys now then we will be in trouble come the World Cup. Sexton is a legend but he is the past. Burns and Carbery are not up to the job - although Carbery can be a utility back. Carty is a good player who should be around the squad. Not convinced on the Byrne brothers but perhaps I am harsh. Healy and Crowley do have a lot of promise. But game time is needed.
Doak is definitely the player I would prioritize pushing thru. We desperately need a 9 who can control a game and be a creative fulcrum. Look at much better France and SA have been with their 9s.
No one here has the slightest clue how much promise Crowley has cause he has started one game of professional rugby and has less than 150 minutes of gametime.
Does Healy have promise? Does Harry Byrne?
Yes. One of them is even in the squad and already capped.
My assessment of Crowley was based almost solely on u 20s six nations, that makes superior to the more touted byrnes and healy
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