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Murder at the Cottage | Sky

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  • Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    But who here can put themselves into the thoughts of a hitman or know what risk they would take?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Gussie Scrotch


    Well, with regard to the effect of the moon, I'm fairly certain that some people are susceptible. My wife's best friend is married to a guy who simply cannot sleep on the night of a full moon. Its the same every month, he stays awake all night and the following day and then sleeps for about twelve hours straight the next night. He's perfectly normal the rest of the time.

    Thinking again about the car issue with regard to the "hit man " theory - another drawback - you would probably need two people to perform the kidnap itself and two again in the car. One to drive and one to keep her under control.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,197 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    From a website

    'those with paranoid schizophrenia are more susceptible to deterioration at the full moon'



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 207 ✭✭DivilsAdvocate


    If Sophie always visited with her son, husband or boyfriend then wouldn't it make it more unbelievable that Ian Bailey would call to her house in the middle of the night to try woo her?

    In regards to you disagreeing with the hit theory because of the murder weapon of choice, if a hitman was coming from France even in 1996 pre-9/11 he wouldn't have been getting a gun or knife through airport security if coming from France.

    How about the man that came into Maurice Sweeney's travel agents looking for the first flight back to Paris, mere hours after Sophie's body was found?

    "The mystery man came into Mr Sweeney's travel agent business in Loughrea, Co Galway around 2.30pm on December 23, 1996 -- some four-and-a-half hours after Sophie's bludgeoned body was discovered outside her holiday home near Schull, Co Cork. "He came in looking for a hotel near Dublin Airport and also inquired about numbers for bed and breakfasts in west Cork," said Mr Sweeney

    "He had been in a bed and breakfast there and had left without paying. I assume he wanted their number so he could send on the money.

    "It was two days before Christmas and I thought it was a bit odd."

    Garda were so fixated on IB that they didn't even take a statement from Maurice Sweeney until 2006, 10 years after the crime.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 282 ✭✭drumm23


    Her clothes - putting on her boots and tying them particularly - doesn't fit with the murder for hire narrative to me - can't see a pro having to "coax" her out of the house somehow.

    Saying that, her clothes has always led me to lean towards the early morning death time than 2/3 o' clock at night.



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  • Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    How do you know.One was a dentist. Just because they are savage thugs does not mean they are not organsied.Whoever killed Jill Dando was a vicious thug and was organised. You think someone like ex military couldn't kill someone in the dead of night in rural cork and escape.? you think Daniel couldn't hire someone like that if he wanted? I am not saying it was. i am saying if it was they would have had all bases covered and being a thug is irrelevant. Jill Dando wasn't Hollywood either



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 282 ✭✭drumm23


    Keep it up and the Gards will be fingering Bailey for Dando next.



  • Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Police in UK did a Bailey on Barry George for Dando and Colin Stagg for Rachel Nickell, so what the cops would do would not at all surprise me



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,103 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Not to mention the trial, verdict and hanging by social and news media of Christopher Jefferies for the murder of Joanne Yates.

    About 2 months wasted by police trying to find evidence to satisfy their fixation on Jefferies



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,103 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Earlier in the thread the idea that the man in Schull watching Sophie wore a beret and "looked foreign" was ridiculed.

    Did he have onions on his bike and stuff.

    Well maybe there was someone around trying to get her attention.

    She was known to not speak much English and did go to Crookhaven where the publican had a little French.

    So put on a beret , carry a copy of La monde and go ask her if she'd like to feel the firmness of your oignons.

    Maybe she had even flirted with him and he had misread the messages.

    Also, Ian Bailey at more than a foot taller than tiny Sophie would not need to resort to any weapons, be they rocks, blocks or whatever else was used.

    Though I do believe he used a crutch when he assaulted Jules.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 984 ✭✭✭flanna01



    Where does the Doc Martin foot print found on her head / neck fit into all of this??

    Ironically, the preferred shoe of the Gards, maybe a horney one even??



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 289 ✭✭EdHoven


    Bungling not unique to Sophie's case.

    The guards also managed to lose skull.

    Must be some great bargains at Templemore car boot.

    https://locate.international/unidentified-bodies/bellinamona-woman/



  • Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,491 ✭✭✭✭Sardonicat


    That's akin to a French man dressing up as Darby O'Gill to gain the attention of a visiting Irish woman.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭Massive Berevement


    A theory i've not heard mentioned but I guess is as plausible as any in this crazy case - could it have been a paramilitary figure who was on the run that was using Sophies house? We know there was evidence of someone using her bath in the lead up to her visit yet the guards didnt find any evidence of anyone else in the house. If someone like that was on the run then using a very remote house in a very remote area would make sense. After all a lot of the houses in that area would be holiday homes and typically unoccupied, especially that time of year. And her's was particularly remote. Perfect for such an individual to stay under the radar.


    So what if he gained entry while she was out that day and she came back to eventually find him. Maybe he kept her there in the house with the promise he would leave in the morning. She would have had plenty of time to put on her boots and may also explain the second wine glass if that is even a thing. Then at some point she makes a run for it and he catches up with her down at the gate. The ferocity of the attack is not a crime of passion but fear of bring caught and brought to justice for prior crimes. Pre Good Friday Agreement aswell. Who knows.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭jimwallace197


    Anything is possible I guess, but id find this hard to believe because of the following reasons

    1) No DNA are any sign of a struggle was found anywhere in the house

    2) It would clear there was evidence of Sophie being back earlier in the day even if she wasn't in the house. Suitcases, etc. So it would be strange for him to wait for her or not notice she was back earlier in the day.

    3) Although the location is remote, the house is relatively close to other houses there, one of which is occupied, I think paramilitary figures could find better safe houses than that.

    4) She called her husband in France around 11 that night before she went to bed. He confirmed this and it checked out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭Massive Berevement


    Thanks Jim. Yea its not without its holes in fairness. Out of interest, im guessing phone records support that call the husband says they had?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭jimwallace197




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Gussie Scrotch



    For me, the key questions, which, if answered, may shed most light on this enigma are:


    What was the real reason Sophie chose to visit her holiday house in the week before Christmas?

    Why was she wearing nightclothes but also walking boots fully laced up and tied?

    Who was the mystery man in the car with MF?

    Why did the bottle of expensive wine get dumped?

    In the light of the victim's stomach contents, the fact that no light was on in the house and the uncovered loaf on the table, was the did the attack happen at daybreak/breakfast time?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    Judge hearing that case profoundly problematic as he also heard the libel trial.


    Moran should have recused himself. Gutless not to.



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  • Posts: 205 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Anyone ever hear that Alfie Lyons answered the door to a disheveled IB on the night of the murder??

    I've just read this and am officially mind blown. Apparently SF let it slip at a dinner party to other neighbours 6 years after and went to the Gardaí

    Um.... What??



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    I wonder if the body found was actually that of Sophie DuPlantier



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    Don't forget the beautiful model with a tragic past.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭marieholmfan


    The French investigators had every reason to keep any motive for the crime in Ireland and to ensure that if necessary Daniel Toscan du Plantier got away with MURDER!

    But did he?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Gussie Scrotch


    If true, that would be a key piece of evidence.

    First time I've heard it though...what's the source?



  • Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭nc6000


    That would be of huge importance if it's true. Like huge!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,061 ✭✭✭Kenny Logins


    Dawn at 8am and the autopsy found no alcohol in her system, so yeah, I think it could have happened early that morning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭nc6000




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  • Posts: 205 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Shirley Foster.

    Reddit. Not the most reliable. Apparently the woman (unnamed) went to the Gardaí so if its true it surely must have led to developments... I'll find the thread



This discussion has been closed.
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