Most powerful nation in the world couldn't kill of a few bearded nutjobs. See they never even tried, they just hung around keeping the peace, not kicking ass.
Funny how a few guys in a pickup truck can take over a country in a few weeks, and the US couldn't do it in 12 years
I think you have a list of countries that America doesn't like there. The Taliban's traditional funding came from Saudi Arabia and the US. When fighting Russia. Pakistan is definitely involved.
Tonight the Allies are sending troops and resources to evacuate their embassies and other staff from Kabul.
A good analysis of how the current situation came to be in Afghanistan.
Had a look at this to see if what I instinctually thought to be true was correct.
Out of the 139 attacks in Europe ascribed to radical Islamists by Europol (both fatal and non-fatal) between 2006 and 2020, just a single attack was perpetrated by an individual of Afghan origin - and that was a non-fatal stabbing in Germany. So zero terrorist fatalities at the hands of Afghani origin people in Europe.
For a country that has a significant refugee population in Europe and has been the staging ground for an occupation and conflict involving pretty much every Western country (even the Irish Ranger Wing were there on missions), I think that's pretty remarkable.
Terrorism in Europe appears to be almost exclusively an Arab phenomenon, with second or third-generation Pakistani youths thrown into the mix in the UK. Afghan settlers in Europe don't appear to pose much of a terrorist danger at all. Surprising, but there you go.
Europe needs to get serious about it's border security to prevent any future attacks. American geographic isolation will provide them with a huge helping hand against any major attacks.
After 20 years it could not be made work. The country is just ungovernable and can't be changed. At some point you have to recognise that and leave them to it.
Best can be hoped for is that the seeds of a future massive terrorist atrocity are not being planted atm with the dark age theocratic despots coming back and those they'll harbour.
Taliban are not waiting around and will have control of that entire country before long.
What excuse will the US have for that?
Looks grim tbh.
And not only the Tajik / Hazara / Usbek + others, but home grown Afghan Pashtuns, don't want Taliban rule. How could they, when they have previous experience of Taliban barbarities? . The Taliban were and are being supported by the usual anti-US suspects...Russia, Iran and Pakistan. This time round though, they will meet much stiffer resistance.Ismail Khan is organising the defence of Herat, and I'm pretty sure that the Northern Alliance will be active too. Currently, there are mass protests in the main cities, with people congregating on the roof tops and streets shouting "Allahu Akbar" in defience of the Talibar. Will be interesting to see what happens when the US leaves, will the Pakistan-Iran-Russian support continue, especially if / when the Taliban threaten these Countrys? Putin has already offered military help and support to the Tajiks.
Historically, imposed borders have rarely been successfull,and to this day its understandable why in parts of the world they a have proved to be disaterous. And the longer the borders are, the more porous they become.But with Afghanistan, we are where we are borderwise, and with a duly elected Government, endorsed by a Loya Jirga. And to my mind anyway, and call it what you want, but when an army from another state ( in this case Pakistan) entered Afghanistan uninvited they were in fact invading, At the present time Pastuns in Afghanistan make up 42% of the total population, and are the majority etnic group, ( Yes , I know that there's more Pashtuns living outside Afghanistan borders ) But had there been no interference by Pakistan, would there even have been any Taliban?
I think that I mentioned that when you leave the cities, and go to the rural areas, you are travelling back in time. This is very noticable in the way of life, and has not changed in generations. This is especially true of their way of thinking, it has not changed either. They have completely different outlook on life, even to the molesting case you mentioned, and this includes corruption,which is what eventually defeated the US. It was common practice for the US to give contracts to the local warlords to transport their supplies to the huge US Military bases like Kandahar. It was the most cost efficient and safest way to get the job done. Even if the same warlords were actively involved in attacking ANA / US forces. It was just business, and nothing personal...When the US started to wind down their activities, and needed less contracts, there was a corrosponding rise in lawless criminality, and attacks . Basically, warlords ran the Country. But maybe the 20 years of education ( especially for women) will prove to be the most important benefit to Afghans.
The sentiment on the ground...
The sentiment that the Taliban are harboured, sponsored and manned (in a significant sense) from Pakistan is widespread in Afghanistan. And you can be damn sure among its minority ethnicities as well.
You must have missed that whole Northern Alliance thing then. Tajik dominated (with other assorted ethnicities) who very much regarded the Taliban as both a Pashtun hegemonic threat and that it was powered from across the Pak-Afghan border (in more than one way as we know).
I have yet to see any such sentiment that the Taliban are foreign force from the aforementioned groups. You seem to be putting words in their mouths.
Regardless, the border is manned these days, and the current Taliban are very much of Afghanistan these days.
You're missing the point. The Durand Line objection is almost exclusively a Pashtun preoccupation. I'm not playing gotcha here.
The point was well made that the Taliban are a Pashtun hegemonic phenomenon that is active both sides of the Pak-Afghan border, then a further point that they couldn't possibly be exogenous to Afghanistan because Pashtuns are native to Afghanistan. All well and good, but ask a Tajik, ask a Hazara or Uzbek if they think a military force with a large Pakistani origin contingent is 'of the soil' so to speak. I'd doubt it very much.
Then, I am sure we will see the Afghan government accept the Duand line any day now then. I look forward to it.
For the most part, I doubt most local tribal leaders or Afghan ethnicities think beyond their valley or village hinterland. The Durand Line objection is very much a Pashtun preoccupation, an ethnicity that has dominated Afghanistani politics by dint of being a plurality of the population.
You're sexing-up other ethnicities' objection to the division of historical Pashtun lands. Tajiks for instance, are predominant in the Afghan army and are naturally wary of Pashtun hegemony in Afghanistan - if you're trying to convince me that they are hardcore anti-Durand Line in their outlook, you have a way to go. Indeed Tajiks were front and centre in both the Afghan civil wars as they feared Pashtun dominance.
Well, then they need to ask their government to recognize the Durand line then, as no faction in Afghanistan recognizes it.
The problem is the us government never built up a proper civil society with a strong army and police force the country was held together by currupt officials and bribery of local leaders
It's a bit like Lebanon in that respect. Thev taliban have endless support from Pakistan they are likely to take over the whole country
The air strikes can slow them down but how long will the air strikes continue
As we saw in Vietnam America could not defeat an insurgent army with basic weapons who have endless time and energy to fight maybe the Un could go in and stop the march of the taliban
Depends on who you're asking. Someone from the 50% of the non-Pashtun population of Afghanistan may not regard Pashtun militants from Peshwar as their national brethren and would have a hard time believing they are operating in their interests, and there's likely a plurality of Afghan Pashtuns that have had a gutful of the Taliban movement as well.
Sure, an origin they reject as they don't recognize the border and never have.
The point stands that the Taliban movement can be said to come from without to a large extent and large proportions of people making up the Taliban movement are Pashtuns of Pakistani origin. It's been that way for a very long time.
They didn't just come from Pakistani tribal area's, they very much were educated in Afghanistan as well. The border area, when the Taliban was created, was pretty easy for people to move back and forth. A lot of the people who live their, have never accepted the Durand line border. To say the Taliban invaded is imo absurd. They were part of the mujahedeen as well and split from them.
The origin is gone over here:
Yeah I am well aware that their are plenty of Pashtuns in Pakistan as well, but it should be noted none of the Afghan factions including the Taliban recognize the Durand line. The ISI has helped the Mujahedeen and allied with the Taliban to varying degrees in the past, but as can be seen by Pakistan fencing off the border with Afghanistan, those days are long gone.
You even have Pakistan taking in Afghan soldiers who fled from the Taliban these days:
Fascinating. I remember watching a documentary about a group of US army engineers building infrastructure in an Afghani town - a completely Syphisian task.
They'd put in telecoms/electricity infrastructure etc for the locals and a week later the copper and anything of value would all be stripped out and sold on the black market. The local security services were constantly high on opium and would fire randomly into the distance at the walls of the town when American officers came around to make it look like they were doing something. The local tribal chief who the Americans had to deal with to get anything done was known to be molesting teenage boys. Thankless endeavor and must have been like banging your head against a brick wall.
There will be a civil war there in the next 12 months, it’s either that or people will end up as slaves once again.
After the Russians left, the original Taliban ( students) swarmed out of the Pakistani madrassas. Hence my statement calling them invaders. They were never invited in to Afghanistan, and were never democratically ( or otherwise ) elected. What they have now morphed into is something else, but for sure, they are not what the majority of Afghans want.
Now the Afghani government are blaming the deterioration in safety on the USA’s sudden withdrawal, so yes they really wanted them to stay there. Not to mention that the taliban have refused to even talk about women’s status in the future. The country is doomed, those who got rich on US greenbacks will leave to live wonderful lives in Dubai, the average person will get screwed.
Pashtuns are a transnational ethnic group, there's 10s of millions of them in Pakistan across the border. At various points, Taliban activity would have been more directed from across the Khyber Pass in the tribal areas (and elsewhere) of Pakistan than not. Not to mention with the on-again-off-again assistance of the Pakistani ISI.
I mentioned him earlier on in the thread, but the West's foremost Afghanistan expert is an Irish chap called Michael Semple. Very much 'went native' so to speak (fluent speaker of several local languages including Pashto and Dari) and there's plenty of videos on Youtube and article contributions where he explains the complex mesh of Afghan and Pakistan tribal politics as it related to the conflict in Afghanistan.
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