Then why is there blood on the door? The garda originally thought
"The 38 year old woman appears to have been attacked in her five bedroom home which overlooks Dunmanus Bay a few miles from Schull sometime after 10 pm on Sunday. A trail of blood led from the house to a laneway shared by her home and one other. Her body was found there the following morning.
Detectives believe she was hit on the head with a blunt instrument before she ran from the house. Her attacker caught up with her and it appears she tried to defend herself."
i think she was hit outside the door and tried to get back in , couldn't and ran. Hence blood on door. If she went down to the gate and was killed at the gate why would the killer go up and smear her blood on the door and not go in the house?
Sheridan says its a couple of hundred yards to the gate. Sheridan also say the police belive she went down through the field, there was blood on a stone. So she must have been bleeding before she got to the gate
Her ex-lover had a receipt for a French telecoms company, he had work done on the 23rd and the technician confirmed he had been there when the work was carried out.
He would also have had to hire a car to get there, there was no record of him doing so and no car hire place reported a car being returned with blood traces inside it.
Yes, I would go along with much of this theory.
For me, the number one difficulty I have with the Bailey guilt is motive.
For all the obvious negatives of his character and behaviour, I can't see a reason for him to kill Sophie. Now, if there was some physical evidence of him being at the scene, or even if it was established that they knew each other, then perhaps motive would be less of an issue. But even the proposed motive - sexual- doesn't ring true. If the attack had been motivated by sex then one would expect there to be evidence of sexual activity or, at least, attempted sexual interference. But there was none.
I am intrigued by the stand out elements (facts) of the incident.
1) She had her walking shoes on - fully laced and tied. This to me, means that she was'nt suddenly attacked in the house and making a run for the gate to escape.
2) The sheer ferocity and extent of the attack. I agree with you. This indicates emotion and passion.
3) The discarded bottle of wine.
4) The reason for her visit - the reported purpose ( to get the heating fixed) is hard to accept. It may. however, have been the reason she gave her husband.
5) The ex lover who (it is alleged) had only a receipt to provide him with an alibi.
So here's an hypothesis for discussion:
The lover, shows up, unexpectedly, at the house, with a nice bottle of wine and the intention of trying to re-kindle the relationship. Sophie sees/hears the car at the gate, puts on her boots and walks down. She is totally unwilling listen to what he wants to say, and refuses to let him enter. Harsh words are exchanged and, not for the first time, he attacks her in a rage....the red mist descends and he batters her senseless.
Horrified at what he has done, he jumps into the car and makes his escape, discarding the wine down the road a bit.
The wine here is interesting. Either it has nothing whatsoever to do with the case, or its absolutely key.
I think it's safe to say, whoever battered Sophie to death knew where she lived.
The manner in how she met her demise is interesting. She suffered a frenzied prolonged attack, this was emotionally charged and personal (in my opinion).
Too me, it stinks of a scorned rejected lover.
The rumours doing the rounds at the time of her death, was that she was returning to her first Husband, that the romance had been reignited.. Were these stories ever follow up?
How did Husband number 2 feel about that? Was it enough to tip him over the edge? I don't think he felt to much about her, she was soon replaced with a new piece of fluff.
Did she reject another man to concentrate on hubby No.1? Did the rejection send him over the edge?? Who was the man wearing a beret hat seen around the place before the murder?
So many lines of investigation have not been thoroughly explored.. The French connection is relevant in this murder, weather that be to eliminate people of interest or to focus more on their alibi's.
The motivation being pinned on Bailey, is that he stumbled his way over to Sophie's house in the middle of a winters night (drunk), tried to throw his leg over, was rejected (amazingl!), and then lost the plot altogether, and proceeded to smash her face in... It's such a surreal allegation, that it's darkly humorous..
I'm not defending Bailey in any way, shape or form. He should never have been central to the investigation. Whilst the Gards were chasing him, the leads were growing colder by the day.
Bailey probably loved seeing himself on the news everyday, and probably kept the fires of suspicion burning towards him on purpose to bask in the media glare for longer.. He is an intelligent man, I'm sure that he saw no other outcome other than a total vindication from all aspects of this horrific crime.. That backfired on him spectacularly.
As much as Bailey is to blame for his own downfall, the book stops with the Garda investigation. The Gards should have dismissed Bailey and chased up all other leads still open to them.. They picked their man, they got it wrong. Tried to fit him up, they made a mess of it.
So here we are 20yrs later - Still at square one.
That is just one person who had trouble finding it. It does not follow everyone would
"I know someone who has lived in Lowertown all her life. She says Sophie's house is relatively easy to find once you knew where it was "
So, a local then ,
as Wizard said at the beginning of this little discussion .
Or someone with clear directions on how to find it.
They wouldn't find the house with your directions at 1 above
If I understand Deec correctly, he is challenging the point made earlier that "it had to be a local" implying that no one other than a local could possibly have been the attacker.
He is quite right on that point...it may have been a local, it may not.
The location of Sophie's house is not a factor which automatically eliminates all non-locals.
So, again, its a red herring. Not really relevant.
Was JT not taking sleeping pills as well?
She said painkillers but I never heard her say which ones. Paracetamol would not make you sleep any better. A codeine\opiate type probably would.
I don't know why you are getting your knickers in a twist about this.
I am simply stating the fact that a close friend of Alfie's, a regular visitor to the house, had difficulty finding it in August 1996 - therefore people may wish to consider this piece of information when discussing exactly how easy it was to find at the time.
But get snippy all you like. No skin off my nose.
U don't seem to understand what facts are
We dont know your friend so its hard to make a judgement on this. Some people are bad at navigation. Today some people get lost even using google maps!! We are just making the point that its a ridiculous claim to make that the killer must be local because an outsider couldnt possibly have found it.
My cousins had to visit Sophies house ( for work purposes ) - said it was very easy to find and not as remote as people preceive.
🤔 On a side note I dont know how Shirley is going to sell her and Alfies house if nobody can find it.
I agree.
I am, however, amused at the number of people who are certain it was a breeze to find what with OS maps and everything yet none of them ever set foot in the place. I am saying I was there in August 1996, and a person familiar with the house had difficulty finding it. That's it. I make no comment on locals vs visitors etc etc.
Because a person who was a very frequent visitor to Alfie's house, had been going there for a number of years, at all times of the day and in all seasons, managed to miss the turn off several times during broad daylight it means it wasn't as easey peasey as some people here claim. People who were never there I may add.
I think the debate about the ease or otherwise of locating Sophie's home is a bit of a red herring.
Whoever did it almost definitely knew her.
Even in the previously discussed and very unlikely event of it being a contract killing, the killer would certainly have ascertained his route in and out beforehand.
So because your friend missed the turn off it means the house was hard to find?
Anyone that had a reason to find Sophies house would have had no problem finding that house - even in 1996. The logic that the murderer must be local because nobody else could have found the house is complete nonsense.
Lookit. All I know is that in August 1996 I was going to Alfie and Shirley's house with a group of people, two of whom were very close friends of theirs and had been there many many times from the day Alfie bought it. They also had a house down a boreen in West Cork so were well used to finding their way around. One of those people was driving. He missed the turn off a few times. In broad daylight.
So wave maps and tell me how easy it is all you like but nonetheless a person familiar with the actual location had trouble finding it in 1996. Perhaps if he read a map he would have found it easily. Perhaps your friend who lived there all her life could find it easily. But as he was sure he knew the way the driver didn't consult a map and got lost, and your friend may be familiar with the area but has she ever been to either Alfie's or Sophie's? I note you say your friend describes it as "relatively" easy, not "very".
I'm just putting it on record that I witnessed someone who was 100% certain they could find Alfie's house without a bother become confused in August 1996 to such an extent they missed the turn off a couple of times.
Make of that what you will.
Local in ‘local house isn’t hard to find’ shocker.
Holiday makers presumably aren’t arriving in the middle of the night. Everyone involved in any documentary and article says it’s hard to find even if you have an idea where you are going.
Jules and Ian both agree he drove them home from the pub that night, he wasn’t blind drunk and would be even more sober a couple of hours later. There’s no reason to think if he wanted to go to Alfie’s house next door that night, as Jules said in her statement, that he wouldn’t have driven there too.
I know someone who has lived in Lowertown all her life. She says Sophie's house is relatively easy to find once you knew where it was and the AA road atlas of 2000 shows the boreen too. (so I assume a 1995/96 atlas would show the same). People need to stop putting modern day context into something 25 years ago.
The house was also frequently let out as a holiday let, and I would guess that the holiday makers did not find it difficult to locate
So here's a rundown of some facts
1 - The house was easily located even though it was at the end of a boreen as it was 1st boreen on left off the road from the main coast road at Kealfadda.
2 - It was almost 5km road distance from bailey's house to Sophie's house
3 - It was a mostly clear night and good moon, but still mid winter, dark & cold. (very cold with a bitter easterly wind)
4 - Bailey was drinking heavily that day, so even if he could "hold his drink" he'd have still been quite drunk
5 - due to the terrain, it would be a momentous task for a fit sober person to walk in a direct line (hilly 3km) between the 2 houses in under 2 hours.
6 - she had effectively left Daniel du Plantier and was meant to have reignited her relationship with her 1st husband
Here's the Irish Times report from 27th
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/gardai-seek-lead-in-cork-murder-case-1.119078
I also see that the west cork gardai were having a very public spat with the GRA at the time - and particularly that week and morale was low according to Irish Times reports.
Until last week the 3 cottages were incorrectly marked on Google Maps as Kealfadda.
And "Kealfadda Bridge" is actually Ballyrisode Bridge
So navigating by Google Maps is not a great idea in this case.
We’re not taking about someone who reacts to circumstances in the normal way. At the libel trial they read out excruciatingly embarrassing details of his private diaries, details and drawings of his sexual fantasies, that his partner, sitting right there, was sexually adequate but was no match intellectually and that he had beaten her so badly he made her feel that ‘death was near’. His response was that he had forgotten writing that but if he read it somewhere he thought it could have been written by the famous poet Dylan Thomas.
He gave Jim Sheridan, knowing he was making a high profile documentary about him, a video clip of himself taking out one of his teeth with what looked like a pliers.
There’s plenty of video footage of murderers talking calmly to the press, Ian Huntley on tape after killing the two small girls. Diane Downs grinned at the camera while telling the reporters about a hijacker shooting her three children when she had actually shot them herself and drove extra slowly to the hospital to be sure they were dead by the time they got there. Wayne O’Donoghue calling over to the parents of the boy he had killed earlier that same day to offer help looking for him.
Four months previously (Aug '96) it was mentioned that the house just visible from Alfie's yard belonged to a French film producer. At that point IB asked if that was Sophie. When asked if he knew Sophie he replied 'just to see'. He gave no indication he knew she lived there prior to that. He could have been lying but why? Alfie heard IB and didn't contradict him.
In terms of how easy it was to find the place - our guide was a very close friend of Alfie and Shirley's and had been there many times. He got lost. Kept missing the turn into the Boreen. And no, he wasn't using a map as he believed he knew where he was going. Except he didn't. And no, no locals were asked for directs as they weren't any locals hanging around the back of beyond on that early Sunday afternoon in August '96.
Sorry but you are wrong, I’ve lived here my whole life.
With respect to you I think you sound like a townie who has no idea of country areas. People found exactly where they needed to go in those days even in very very remote areas. From the maps Sophies house wasnt even that hard to find. Your use of the term 'cattle station' shows you have no idea of irish country areas -LOL what the hell is a cattle station. Im from a farming background - no Irish person ever calls a farm a cattle station. Im guessing you were not even in Ireland in 1996 to know what it was like.
Directions 2021 style - enter address into google maps. God knows which road it will suggest.
Directions 1996 style - go 8 miles out the coast road, it's about a mile past the Church in Toormore. Turn right just as you go through the flat part where the inlet is on both sides of the road. Take the lane on the left about 500 yards up. Its the first house you will come to near the end of the lane.
The 1996 Directions are far more dependable - I was a sales rep covering most of the western seaboard back 1989-1993 and would meet some shopkeepers in their houses and some of these were very very remote. Yet would never have an issue finding them after a quick glance at the AA Atlas of Ireland combined with their directions. The AA atlas was one of the best selling books each year. I still prefer it if going on a "let the car take us" trip
GSOC examined this and said JT’s arrest was lawful and reasonable. She had also given incorrect information about their movements that night, she said they were at the Courtyard Bar and went straight home. Then she later said they were in the Galley and stopped on the way home so IB could have a wander outside the car. It’s another element the DPP got wrong.
That part of the country is hard to navigate, even with an OS map. I don’t think people remember those days. You are talking about a night time drive by map. Each gate and boreen could be the correct turn or it might lead to a cattle station. The road had grass growing down the middle of it, if you weren’t from there it would have looked like any other private lane. I don’t think a person sent there would find it with a map in the dark.
Whatever you think about how easy it was to find, it was clearly someone who had been there before. You wouldn’t just stumble across this house while wandering. IB said he knew there was a French lady there from having her pointed to him two once over a year, maybe two years previously. He had been to Alfie’s house several times, but how did he know that she was there for those few nights in the run up to Christmas? A very lucky guess based on remembering that someone said a French woman owned a house next door, from two years previously? It’s interesting that both IB and JT say they stopped at the lookout point, and JT said IB remarked there was a light on at Alfie’s.
If you had the name of the townland the house is in it would be no problem to find. Also as another person has mentioned the person could have been a guest at the house before or could have researched the location of the house prior to that night. People are reliant on google maps and sat nav ( these are not always that helpful either )now but back then people used actual maps, took directions down etc., looked for landmarks to get to their location. It wasnt that difficult.
I lived rurally at that time - never had a problem with people not being able to find us.
It doesn't help that anything JT said when arrested would probably be inadmissible in court since the DPP felt she'd be arrested unlawfully. She'd been arrested for murder, but there was no evidence she committed it.
That's all well and good, if you had the location of the house on your map.
It's not like it's a house a stranger to the area would happen across.
Therefore it's reasonable to assume the murderer knew the house either as a local or visitor
or had directions from someone who was familiar with the location.
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