Following on from
this thread
Please remain civil or posting privileges will be removed
I think you will find nearly every job in every country gets some sort of subsidy. Just the level differs depending on the jobs.
Isn't that why all the people are complaining about the MNC that they get too much of a subsidy to stay in Ireland? If you cut every subsidy in Ireland then nobody would have a job, even the farmers would go bankrupt.
Not necessarily. For example, Ireland has the second highest minimum wage in the EU, therefore the cost to a business of a baker or a restaurant worker are higher, and therefore they need to charge more to break even/make a profit.
There are a number of reasons why prices of many things in Ireland are higher, our peripheral position in Europe requiring goods to travel further and by sea or air, our distributed population with not enough apartment blocks meaning that utility costs are higher, our high minimum wage meaning labour inputs are higher, etc.
Incorrect, all over Europe different countries have different cost of living etc. Even in Germany the cost of living between some cities is hugely different.
Have a look at France, live up the North and then try live down the South on the same wages and it is completely different. Been a member of Europe and bringing in the Euro was never supposed to balance the cost/price of everything across all of Europe. Not sure how you came up with that one.
Nobody is ridiculing anyone for being on PUP. That is a strawman argument.
It's a few times posters have fired out this "talking down to XYZ". I have seen none of that on this thread and nobody I know or work with would ever do anything of the sort. Maybe you have seen it with the people you mix with but I don't think you should be constantly trying to tar everyone with the same brush.
Dublin has 5th highest i bedroom rentals in Europe.
Dublin is the fifth most expensive place in Europe.
Need to weigh up a number of things. Simply pointing to welfare rates, (which are based on need) is ignoring the big picture.
You do know Dublin is one city in Ireland.
Dublin has high rent and is expensive but it also has high wages. Hence why you have loads of people travelling into Dublin so they can avail of "Dublin wages"
Hopefully with the introduction of work from home more people can live outside Dublin while working for Dublin companies.
The problem there is the Irish culture of wanting a three-bedroom house with a garden big enough for a trampoline, five minutes away from the mammy. Until we start building up like in Europe, which is something this government is trying to do (but being opposed tooth and nail by the largest opposition party), we will be stuck with high rents.
It is a debating tactic to deflect from the arguments being made.
You can have immense sympathy for every single person on the PUP, but still argue that the rate is too high or that students shouldn't have qualified or some other objection.
From my point of view, PUP was introduced, it did its job. It's job is now over, especially when you see the numbers who have first & second jab, so PUP should be put away and everyone should hope it never has to return. Hopefully we are finally out of this pandemic and I think everyone can agree the sooner the better
IMO, claiming people are on it to avoid work is ridiculing them.
Claiming people are swarming to soup kitchens to save their money for drink and smokes is looking down. Claiming people on PUP are avoiding work, (every one of them being employed pre Covid) is looking down on them.
You should both look over the last few pages before making such claims.
That might be what FF/FG/Greens tell themselves when trying to go to sleep at night.
I'd agree, some peoples attitudes are the problem. Hopefully they'll be out of government soon enough.
No point in supporting not fit for purpose leased apartments IMO.
Some deal for the developer though, wouldn't think he'd to stump up a single cent, assuming its the former Regency carpark ,
FGers don't believe people should have lives outside of work anymore, work long hours, sleep, come back to work, anything that's not for profit isn't wanted in the FG regime,
And yet its below a living wage?
There are other ways of bridging the gap.
For example, providing school books, school uniforms and school dinners to all children is one way of reducing the amount required for the living wage, bringing it down closer to the minimum wage. Similarly, introducing the French system of GPs where everybody pays a small amount - €10 - for a GP visit brings down the amount required for a living wage. Improving services in that way to reduce the amount required for a living wage doesn't hit businesses as hard.
I understand full how the world works...yous are one burying head in sand demanding no living wage be paid....despite the government wanting to push on witb it
The living wage is cited as whats needed for single adult to live above poverty level....drooling on about drink/gambling isnt going to gloss over fact min wage is a poverty wqge ànd noone should live in poverty in ireland
Why not do both??
A better baseline wage is better for all workers,i have no issue introducing free healthcare for all,it should be a human right alongside housing,education and water imo
Its long since time we elected people to run country for benefit of its citizens....the refusal to pay a living wage,played a large part in the mass outbreaks in factories during covid as people couldnt afford to take a day off
We badly need paid sick leave too
Free healthcare for all is a mythical objective. There isn't a single country in the world that can deliver it. Very low cost healthcare, with some demand management, is a realistic objective.
Similarly, free housing for all is an impossible objective, especially when the Irish won't settle for anything other than a three-bedroomed house with a garden big enough for a trampoline, five minutes away from Mammy.
Its really not.....surely existance of nhs is an example of it?.....it should be a human right and gross as fcuk that someones healthcare access is decided by depth of their wallet
People are free to demand these houses,and can pay for em if they so wish,but the option of free basic housing should be available to all.....people sneer at soviet russia,when in reality a grim housing block is many multiples better than expecting families to be raised in hotel rooms or the national scandel that is direct provision
All this econmic growth is worth fcuk all,if we cant lift all our people out of poverty.....why bother with it?
The NHS? Seriously?
Have a read of this article on the ineffectiveness of the NHS. Look at what is happening today up in the North where the hospitals can't cope because of Covid.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jun/29/nhs-wields-the-axe-on-17-unnecessary-procedures
Look at this list of excluded common procedures.
As for economic growth, we are not living like 16th century peasants, with a hovel of sticks, routine hunger and disease and a life expectancy of 35. Economic growth has meant that average living standards in Ireland are the highest ever. You also should remember that people in Ireland, even those at the bottom, live far far better than the people of countries like Lebanon, Syria or Afghanistan and many many more. The average Irish person is in the top 5% in the world for living standards.
And why dont we push on and lift the last people here living in poverty out of it....noone should live in poverty here,its pure wrong to argue otherwise....anyone who could look upon the halting site at sixcrossroads and deem it opulance are deluded
Healthcare should be a human right,its incomprehensible that people demand ot not be free and the obvious outworking of that being the poor should have lower quality healthcare.....free healthcare,would lead to diseases and sickness like cancer/diabetes etc being picked up sooner and being treated easier....leading to massive savings to offset the cost of it
You goys make it too easy
https://www.google.com/amp/s/extra.ie/2021/05/03/news/irish-news/student-pup-loophole-125m/amp
Please quote the posts where posters have posted what you have claimed.
You posted an article which has a comment but with no Ministers name on it. Which party is the Minister from?
Unfortunately your opinion is incorrect and as I pointed out nobody is ridiculing them.
In regards to the claim about people swarming to soup kitchens I never seen anything of the sort but maybe I missed so if you could quote. Very shocking if someone actually said something like that. If not then very strange you would make something so awful up
Let’s face it there is a good few wasters still claiming the PUP. Overheard one talking about it today standing outside the bookies smoking as I walked by
Im not joking either.
I did hear that loads of students who had part-time jobs pre-Covid and were claiming PUP have gone abroad in June. They are living it up in cheap rented accommodation in the Med while getting PUP into their bank account every week. Happy days.
You quoted my post and were involved in this discussion yesterday, from the comments I'm referring to. I'll not go round in circles every other day. Here's a sample below:
You mean you disagree. Talking about people swarming soup kitchens looking for hand outs and people on PUP being work shy, is just that.
So we've people swarming soup kitchens looking for a handout. People not wanting to spend their own money on food. People using soup kitchens so they can keep their money for the pub. You can add to that tales of work shy PUP recipients. All pretty reprehensible IMO.
Like with other issues and a tool often used to mask racism, saying 'not all' or 'some' and then spending 99% of the time slating people is a poor disclaimer and not a credible defence.
Victim blaming. Making the victims the problem to dismiss the causes. Party loyalty has a lot to answer for.
Likely YFG.
If true that could have been very easily been prevented. But it's the government of piss poor planning and blaming the results on everyone else.
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