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Murder at the Cottage | Sky

CorkGunJonny

Anyone know what channel it's on? The jim sheridan documentary about sophie toscan du plantier

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Tandey

This may have already been discussed but is it 100% that the fella MF was out with that night wasn’t Bailey?

Yurt2

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

In fairness, Marie Farrell does have a look of Velma about her...

I'll never be able to unsee that.

Yurt2

Caquas wrote: »

The Gardai said they checked this out fully and the Frenchman had a watertight alibi - he was at a public event in Paris around the time of the murder.

I hope these two documentaries might prompt someone to come forward with fresh evidence but we are sure to get a lot of re-hashed tales which will further muddy the waters.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sophies-friend-was-twice-cleared-by-gardai-26462893.html

Different Frenchman I believe. They questioned her ex-lover who was in Nice at the time.

Loafing Oaf

Yurt! wrote: »

The entire sad saga has via atrocious policing descended into a Scooby Doo-like whodunnit with Ian Bailey boxed into the role as the spooky guy and people tugging at his face for three decades hoping the mask will come off.

In fairness, Marie Farrell does have a look of Velma about her...

Caquas

Mackwiss wrote: »

This is interesting. Sadly this was only taken 10 years after the fact but it connects with MF initial testimony:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/missing-link-man-in-sophie-case-offers-new-help-26461911.html

The Gardai said they checked this out fully and the Frenchman had a watertight alibi - he was at a public event in Paris around the time of the murder.

I hope these two documentaries might prompt someone to come forward with fresh evidence but we are sure to get a lot of re-hashed tales which will further muddy the waters.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sophies-friend-was-twice-cleared-by-gardai-26462893.html

Loafing Oaf

ShamNNspace wrote: »

The country is full of "tossers" as you say, and completely innocent one's of any wrongdoing at that, its not a crime to be a tosser,

Unless you're doing it in a school playground...

Yurt2

The entire sad saga has via atrocious policing descended into a Scooby Doo-like whodunnit with Ian Bailey boxed into the role as the spooky guy and people tugging at his face for three decades hoping the mask will come off.

ShamNNspace

Furze99 wrote: »

Apart from the small issue of confessions that he done it. Agree though that he's a complete attention seeker, a tosser who should have been sent off to France to go before their investigations and case. Any completely innocent person would be happy enough to do and bury the rumouring once and for all. No time at all for him.

The country is full of "tossers" as you say, and completely innocent one's of any wrongdoing at that, its not a crime to be a tosser, as for the "confessions" they should be taken in the context of the conversation that was taking place ... Hardly enough evidence to send a man to what amounts to a kangaroo court in France, one would need to be gone in the head to offer themselves up to such a "justice" system

odyssey06

Furze99 wrote: »

Apart from the small issue of confessions that he done it. Agree though that he's a complete attention seeker, a tosser who should have been sent off to France to go before their investigations and case. Any completely innocent person would be happy enough to do and bury the rumouring once and for all. No time at all for him.

Any 'completely' innocent person would be mad to go before the French judicial system for a crime that didn't even take place in French jurisdiction. They don't seem too concerned about such matters as due process, presumption of innocence, or even you know this isn't their ****** colony.

Yurt2

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

There’s a certain type of narcissist who would enjoy people thinking he was some kind of genius, carrying off the perfect crime and making fools of the police. He doesn’t seem to dwell on the fact that there is someone else out there responsible for this. Jim Sheridan even asks him, if I am remembering correctly, if he is angry or full of rage for what happened to her and he says he does not carry rage or anger, clearly a lie.

Sophie doesn’t seem to figure much in the story for him, it seems like it’s his case, his story and his struggle against people who think they can take him on. His obsession with press clippings and talking to people about it, it all makes me think he would not enjoy someone else being associated with this case.

This post is kind of illustrative of how justice, the pursuit of justice and investigative procedure can be corrupted by amateur psychologists and curtain twitching impulses.

Yurt2

Furze99 wrote: »

Apart from the small issue of confessions that he done it. Agree though that he's a complete attention seeker, a tosser who should have been sent off to France to go before their investigations and case. Any completely innocent person would be happy enough to do and bury the rumouring once and for all. No time at all for him.

I'd doubt that very much.

Furze99

Biker79 wrote: »

But none of that makes him a murderer. Just an annoying tool who has experienced some extreme bad luck - well beyond what you might consider as karma for his self centeredness.

Apart from the small issue of confessions that he done it. Agree though that he's a complete attention seeker, a tosser who should have been sent off to France to go before their investigations and case. Any completely innocent person would be happy enough to do and bury the rumouring once and for all. No time at all for him.

Mackinac

jimwallace197 wrote: »

I agree that no struggle or fight took place inside the house, there was zero evidence of it except for a blood stain on the doorhandle. She most likely went outside willingly & this gives weight to the theory it was a gard (or someone in a position of authority) because I doubt she would have left the security of her house if it was some randomer. This is someone who was in dispute with her neighbours over leaving the gate at the end of the road open, she knew it was a risk & she wasnt stupid.

I dont think she was chased from inside the house either because she had time to put on her boots and some clothes.

A few years ago someone tried to break in to my house at the rear patio doors. I heard them, went outside and ran up the lane after them but they got away from me. I had always thought the safest thing in that situation would be to immediately call the police instead of trying to confront them but I guess in the spur of the moment adrenaline kicked in and I went after them. I never thought I would have done such a thing but I did, just goes to show you never know how you’ll react in some situations. I’m lucky it didn’t turn out worse, I’m the last woman you’d expect to confront a burglar.

Deeec

Mackwiss wrote: »

This is interesting. Sadly this was only taken 10 years after the fact but it connects with MF initial testimony:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/missing-link-man-in-sophie-case-offers-new-help-26461911.html

Thanks for that - thats interesting. Its a pity this was never followed up.
I wonder if any records were held by the B & B/ Hotels from that time - info probably wasnt saved on computer at the time but they may have held onto guest books. The B & B could be long closed at this stage though.

Mackwiss

This is interesting. Sadly this was only taken 10 years after the fact but it connects with MF initial testimony:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/missing-link-man-in-sophie-case-offers-new-help-26461911.html

Mackwiss

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

I don’t think it would have taken too much to coax her from the house, it was in the middle of nowhere and she made a point of not having curtains. She wasn’t afraid there. All it would have taken would be for someone familiar with the place to bang on the door and say ‘Alfie has had an accident, we need to use your phone’ or even ‘it’s Alfie, I need to talk to you’.

agree, but not even this... from what we know from her personality she wasn't afraid and confrontational apparently. Her words and attitude might have triggered the reaction from the killer.

The wine bottle question is interesting. Was there a receipt proving she bought it? a Credit Card transaction? If no brings the theory someone else buying it at the airport?

Only issue with this is the car... why/how rent an old fiesta with red plates?

If she bought the wine. She sees someone at the gate (maybe is the guy that was using her house) She goes down to the gate, little axe in her belt for defense and bottle in hand, maybe to give the wine to the person to make the person go away?

Words happen, things escalate he approaches her, she picks the axe to defend herself a fight ensues and we know what happens next.

All speculation of course...

[Deleted User]

thecretinhop wrote: »

was the bottle open or unopened

unopened https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderAtTheCottage/comments/o4pjr4/an_unopened_bottle_of_wine_was_found_in_bushes/

[Deleted User]

As the nearest neighbour, was Alfie ever questioned to rule him out?

thecretinhop

was the bottle open or unopened

Biker79

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

There’s a certain type of narcissist who would enjoy people thinking he was some kind of genius, carrying off the perfect crime and making fools of the police. He doesn’t seem to dwell on the fact that there is someone else out there responsible for this. Jim Sheridan even asks him, if I am remembering correctly, if he is angry or full of rage for what happened to her and he says he does not carry rage or anger, clearly a lie.

Sophie doesn’t seem to figure much in the story for him, it seems like it’s his case, his story and his struggle against people who think they can take him on. His obsession with press clippings and talking to people about it, it all makes me think he would not enjoy someone else being associated with this case.

Exactly right.

But none of that makes him a murderer. Just an annoying tool who has experienced some extreme bad luck - well beyond what you might consider as karma for his self centeredness.

[Deleted User]

nc6000 wrote: »

She could have bought it on her way over.

true, but who threw it in the ditch? it was about 60/70 pounds worth

nc6000

SoulWriter wrote: »

The wine was not available in the local off licences but was for sale in airport duty free shops

She could have bought it on her way over.

MoonUnit75

Biker79 wrote: »

Its not an exaggeration to say things have been playing out for Bailey like some Shakespearean tragedy. Something that he seems to secretly relish...

There's something noble in the suffering of an artist.....he might announce to a weary audience after a few drinks.

Doesn't make him a killer though. Just eccentric.

I think the Brits have more regard for eccentricity than small town rural Ireland.

There’s a certain type of narcissist who would enjoy people thinking he was some kind of genius, carrying off the perfect crime and making fools of the police. He doesn’t seem to dwell on the fact that there is someone else out there responsible for this. Jim Sheridan even asks him, if I am remembering correctly, if he is angry or full of rage for what happened to her and he says he does not carry rage or anger, clearly a lie.

Sophie doesn’t seem to figure much in the story for him, it seems like it’s his case, his story and his struggle against people who think they can take him on. His obsession with press clippings and talking to people about it, it all makes me think he would not enjoy someone else being associated with this case.

MoonUnit75

jimwallace197 wrote: »

I agree that no struggle or fight took place inside the house, there was zero evidence of it except for a blood stain on the doorhandle. She most likely went outside willingly & this gives weight to the theory it was a gard (or someone in a position of authority) because I doubt she would have left the security of her house if it was some randomer. This is someone who was in dispute with her neighbours over leaving the gate at the end of the road open, she knew it was a risk & she wasnt stupid.

I dont think she was chased from inside the house either because she had time to put on her boots and some clothes.

I don’t think it would have taken too much to coax her from the house, it was in the middle of nowhere and she made a point of not having curtains. She wasn’t afraid there. All it would have taken would be for someone familiar with the place to bang on the door and say ‘Alfie has had an accident, we need to use your phone’ or even ‘it’s Alfie, I need to talk to you’.

Biker79

Its not an exaggeration to say things have been playing out for Bailey like some Shakespearean tragedy. Something that he seems to secretly relish...

There's something noble in the suffering of an artist.....he might announce to a weary audience after a few drinks.

Doesn't make him a killer though. Just eccentric.

I think the Brits have more regard for eccentricity than small town rural Ireland.

[Deleted User]

unplayable wrote: »

If it was morning which does seem plausible
From what we know? What about the bottle of wine in the bush then? Was that from another night or could the killer have stayed over with her? The morning killing theory surely brings the speeding blue car into play also.

The wine was not available in the local off licences but was for sale in airport duty free shops

MoonUnit75

autumnbelle wrote: »

Watching the sky documentary if he is innocent I really feel for him he has no life

Whether or not he killed Sophie he should have done serious time for putting his partner in hospital on more than one occasion.

Watched the rest of the series and in part 5 he is watching Claire Byrne on TV and gets annoyed. When the programme ends he barks at her repeatedly ‘TV off, TV off, TV off, TV OFF’ so he can give his ‘instant reaction’. I think his really shows that deep, deep down, right to the core, he is and was a thoroughly horrible person. Other people seem like nothing more than an extension to his own thoughts for him. At her birthday party he makes a total show of himself and gets up to sing, making her party all about him. “I knew Princess Diana, she liked me” he blurted out. Delusional, violent and narcissistic IMO.

unplayable

chooseusername wrote: »

I think she had just had breakfast , as heating had not kicked in yet she had her outdoor boots on.
The two chairs by radiator still there from night before( she usually put her feet up on 2nd chair)
The light would have been on as still dark in the house till at least 9am.
She may have heard a noise outside.
She switched off the light, picked up the poker (or small axe, depending on which report) and went to open the door.

If it was morning which does seem plausible
From what we know? What about the bottle of wine in the bush then? Was that from another night or could the killer have stayed over with her? The morning killing theory surely brings the speeding blue car into play also.

chooseusername

I think she had just had breakfast , as heating had not kicked in yet she had her outdoor boots on.
The two chairs by radiator still there from night before( she usually put her feet up on 2nd chair)
The light would have been on as still dark in the house till at least 9am.
She may have heard a noise outside.
She switched off the light, picked up the poker (or small axe, depending on which report) and went to open the door.

autumnbelle

Watching the sky documentary if he is innocent I really feel for him he has no life