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Murder at the Cottage | Sky

CorkGunJonny

Anyone know what channel it's on? The jim sheridan documentary about sophie toscan du plantier

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jimwallace197

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Because as I said my belief is and always has been that he is guilty and I would honestly be shocked to find that he is not.

Thank god your not on any jury or god forbid the accused if you are? Guilty of murder because you dont like him & think hes a bad man.

No hard evidence. Plenty of evidence of a garda cover up and set up. No motive, no witnesses, but yes hes guilty because you dont like him.

oceanman

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Because as I said my belief is and always has been that he is guilty and I would honestly be shocked to find that he is not.

fair enough, i would be shocked if he was guilty at this stage after everything i have seen and read but each to their own opinion i guess.

AudreyHepburn

oceanman wrote: »

why do you use the the word "remote" ?

Because as I said my belief is and always has been that he is guilty and I would honestly be shocked to find that he is not.

oceanman

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I have always believed that Ian Bailey is guilty as charged but if by some remote chance he’s innocent he has don’t absolutely nothing to help his case. He’s a thoroughly unlikeable character. And we know him to be a violent man with a quick temper and a total narcissist.

I just find hard to believe an innocent man would act the way he did.

And yes I know the Gardai made a serious mess of the case but that does not make Bailey innocent.

why do you use the the word "remote" ?

AudreyHepburn

Xander10 wrote: »

because you find him unlikeable does not amount to evidence that he carried out a murder.

I never said it did to be fair.

The combination of evidence (albeit circumstantial), witness statements and his behaviour after the fact are what make me believe him to be guilty.

What I said was that if he is innocent his behaviour and actions after Sophie’s death have not in any way, shape or form helped him.

[Deleted User]

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I have always believed that Ian Bailey is guilty as charged but if by some remote chance he’s innocent he has don’t absolutely nothing to help his case. He’s a thoroughly unlikeable character. And we know him to be a violent man with a quick temper.

And yes I know the Gardai made a serious mess of the case but that does not make Bailey innocent.

because you find him unlikeable does not amount to evidence that he carried out a murder.

CoBo55

JimmyVik wrote: »

Well as a professional hitman I can tell you its not the done think.
You go and you set up the murder the way you want it to look.
You go to your cleanup location and clean up. You never approach the body or the scene of the crime a second time.
More interactions, more evidence left.
I learned this on day one of hitman college.
Then on my work experience I lost marks for moving a body after the job was done.
Only for that i would have got a first.

Villanelle....

AudreyHepburn

I have always believed that Ian Bailey is guilty as charged but if by some remote chance he’s innocent he has don’t absolutely nothing to help his case. He’s a thoroughly unlikeable character. And we know him to be a violent man with a quick temper and a total narcissist.

I just find hard to believe an innocent man would act the way he did.

And yes I know the Gardai made a serious mess of the case but that does not make Bailey innocent.

chooseusername

Biker79 wrote: »

Also more euphemistically known as " going along to get along "

Having the pint was better than the transfer.
Shur you wouldn't know where you'd end up.

Biker79

Also more euphemistically known as " going along to get along "

thecretinhop

i have been in court where outright lies were told.
certain cohorts of society church guards politicans co councils are like a cult. even if they know your inmocent whistleblower etc there aim is to destroy you and cover up the real crime culprit. why? in there sick heads a few innocents jailed killed no bother. its for the greater good. scary people out there i can tell ye.

jimwallace197

nc6000 wrote: »

I started off thinking the Gardai carry-on and later interviews were cringe worthy but now I actually think it's scary.

The incompetence shown in this investigation is staggering and to think of the power these guys have to ruin a person is genuinely worrying.

Its high time people started looking at our so called police force in a different way. An absolute law onto themselves and one of the reasons why I feel a senior local gard who has since passed away should have been the chief suspect instead of Bailey.

As I understand it, this case was either indirectly or directly linked to Martin Callinans (former garda commissioner) resignation. With the recording of telephone calls from garda stations.

The more you look into this case, the murkier it gets and says a lot about those with authority in our country.

nc6000

I started off thinking the Gardai carry-on and later interviews were cringe worthy but now I actually think it's scary.

The incompetence shown in this investigation is staggering and to think of the power these guys have to ruin a person is genuinely worrying.

jimwallace197

nc6000 wrote: »

Yeah and I should have mentioned how they shared their original interviews with the French for use in the trial in France. They still included the interviews with Marie Farrell even though she has since disowned them and claims the Gardai pressured her into making them.

There is basically zero evidence that Bailey killed her and also zero evidence that can be used to prove anyone else did either.

Didnt realise that, what an absolute disgrace, even after all those years, they still were trying to maliciously convict him. Probably trying to curry favour with the french authorities, what a bunch of absolute cretins and cowards considering they knew full well Marie Farrell is one of the most unreliable witnesses out there.

Yurt2

jimwallace197 wrote: »

[/B]

Nail on the head. If what they did to bailey was not the very definition of doing someone, well I dread to think what they feel really doing someone is. Especially considering they had no real evidence on Bailey

That guy was a picture book old school Garda. I also had a good laugh at his mopey shoegazing comments that it was awful altogether that Bailey was allowed to go to the media to defend himself when it looked like he was subject to a ham-fisted fit-up which included members of the force briefing against their favoured suspect.

nc6000

jimwallace197 wrote: »

[/B]

Nail on the head. If what they did to bailey was not the very definition of doing someone, well I dread to think what they feel really doing someone is. Especially considering they had no real evidence on Bailey

Yeah and I should have mentioned how they shared their original interviews with the French for use in the trial in France. They still included the interviews with Marie Farrell even though she has since disowned them and claims the Gardai pressured her into making them.

There is basically zero evidence that Bailey killed her and also zero evidence that can be used to prove anyone else did either.

jimwallace197

nc6000 wrote: »

The conduct of the Gardai was a disgrace and they didn't just make a mess of the initial investigation but some of the comments they make in their interviews for the series are remarkable. In episode 4 one of the Gardai (Dermot Dwyer) says you might have to interview a witness up to 10 times before you get the full story. 10 times!? I wouldn't have that was normal.

He also complains about how Ian Bailey was able to be interviewed on TV and make what Dwyer thought were unfair comments about how the Gardai "were doing him" and how a certain percentage of the public will believe this. That's unfair but it's OK for the Gardai to leak stuff about Bailey to the media?

Nail on the head. If what they did to bailey was not the very definition of doing someone, well I dread to think what they feel really doing someone is. Especially considering they had no real evidence on Bailey

chooseusername

BailMeOut wrote: »

At night time and especially on clear calm nights you hear cars for miles.

You'd see the headlights in Castletown Bearhaven.

Yurt2

monkeybutter wrote: »

Do you travel to all your murders in a vehicle with a handy number on the back identifying you?

Do you start up your car in the middle of the night in an attempt to wake you wife before you do?

I had it that the allegation all along was that he stumbled there and back pished and committed the murder in between? It just doesn't seem plausible to me given the distance or that no one else would spot him over the some 8km total route, even taking the time of night into account.

monkeybutter

nc6000 wrote: »

The conduct of the Gardai was a disgrace and they didn't just make a mess of the initial investigation but some of the comments they make in their interviews for the series are remarkable. In episode 4 one of the Gardai (Dermot Dwyer) says you might have to interview a witness up to 10 times before you get the full story. 10 times!? I wouldn't have that was normal.

He also complains about how Ian Bailey was able to be interviewed on TV and make what Dwyer thought were unfair comments about how the Gardai "were doing him" and how a certain percentage of the public will believe this. That's unfair but it's OK for the Gardai to leak stuff about Bailey to the media?

Have you watched the savage eye? Not far from the truth is it

nc6000

The conduct of the Gardai was a disgrace and they didn't just make a mess of the initial investigation but some of the comments they make in their interviews for the series are remarkable. In episode 4 one of the Gardai (Dermot Dwyer) says you might have to interview a witness up to 10 times before you get the full story. 10 times!? I wouldn't have that was normal.

He also complains about how Ian Bailey was able to be interviewed on TV and make what Dwyer thought were unfair comments about how the Gardai "were doing him" and how a certain percentage of the public will believe this. That's unfair but it's OK for the Gardai to leak stuff about Bailey to the media?

monkeybutter

Yurt! wrote: »

Looking at that route, I think it's fanciful in the extreme that he would have got up in the middle of the night in the depths of winter and walked an hour each way when a vehicle was at his disposal.

Do you travel to all your murders in a vehicle with a handy number on the back identifying you?

Do you start up your car in the middle of the night in an attempt to wake you wife before you do?

Yurt2

chooseusername wrote: »

here you go;

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/51.5298354,-9.6773175/The+Prairie+Cottage,+Lissacaha+(North),+Schull,+County+Cork,+Ireland/@51.5355733,-9.6728691,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m9!4m8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x48459b7e5e290ae5:0x1bb8f59382d8d091!2m2!1d-9.6338833!2d51.5387125!3e2

Looking at that route, I think it's fanciful in the extreme that he would have got up in the middle of the night in the depths of winter and walked an hour each way when a vehicle was at his disposal.

BailMeOut

chooseusername wrote: »

And the Kealfada bridge where he was spotted "near" Sophie's house;

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/51.5298354,-9.6773175/The+Prairie+Cottage,+Lissacaha+(North),+Schull,+County+Cork,+Ireland/51.5168672,-9.6671773/51.529809,-9.6771554/@51.5206073,-9.6773048,5266m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m11!4m10!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x48459b7e5e290ae5:0x1bb8f59382d8d091!2m2!1d-9.6338833!2d51.5387125!1m0!1m0!3e2

At night time and especially on clear calm nights you hear cars for miles.

chooseusername

BailMeOut wrote: »

Interesting. So he would have had to have driven.

And the Kealfada bridge where he was spotted "near" Sophie's house;

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/51.5298354,-9.6773175/The+Prairie+Cottage,+Lissacaha+(North),+Schull,+County+Cork,+Ireland/51.5168672,-9.6671773/51.529809,-9.6771554/@51.5206073,-9.6773048,5266m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m11!4m10!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x48459b7e5e290ae5:0x1bb8f59382d8d091!2m2!1d-9.6338833!2d51.5387125!1m0!1m0!3e2

BailMeOut

chooseusername wrote: »

here you go;

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/51.5298354,-9.6773175/The+Prairie+Cottage,+Lissacaha+(North),+Schull,+County+Cork,+Ireland/@51.5355733,-9.6728691,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m9!4m8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x48459b7e5e290ae5:0x1bb8f59382d8d091!2m2!1d-9.6338833!2d51.5387125!3e2

Interesting. So he would have had to have driven.

chooseusername

BailMeOut wrote: »

Sorry if already been asked but how far is Sophie's house to where Ian Bailey lived? Was this walkable or would he have needed to drive if he did visit her house that night?

here you go;

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/51.5298354,-9.6773175/The+Prairie+Cottage,+Lissacaha+(North),+Schull,+County+Cork,+Ireland/@51.5355733,-9.6728691,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m9!4m8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x48459b7e5e290ae5:0x1bb8f59382d8d091!2m2!1d-9.6338833!2d51.5387125!3e2

BailMeOut

Sorry if already been asked but how far is Sophie's house to where Ian Bailey lived? Was this walkable or would he have needed to drive if he did visit her house that night?

milehip

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

TBH, a lot of the speculation about Sophie Toscan Du Plantier's personal life in this thread seems to be echoing that stereotype.

I was paraphrasing Jermerys' statement issued about girls in the 70's, I think it was in relation to William Roche \Ken Barlow allegations.

jimwallace197

JimmyVik wrote: »

Can you not understand that perhaps there could have been someone not from the area but who knew how to get there. Maybe even some roving criminals who might have been spotted parked up at the gate. Sophie went down and ...

The fact its remote doesnt make it certain that it was a local who did it.

Only a year or two ago there was a farmer in a rural area of Dublin who walked down to his gate when he saw 2 lads from his bedroom window at it and asked them what they were doing. Looking for our dog they said. Another came from the direction of his house behind him and hit him on the back of the head. They beat him to within an inch of his life and left him there. Never caught.
People were saying oh, they must be locals or they never would have found that house. When he woke up he said he had never seen them before.

This kind of thing happens. Somehow criminals always find their way to where they commit their crime.

I wouldn't agree, its already been established she was in dispute with her neighbors over leaving the gate open. This could only be down to security concerns. She would hardly head down there (a woman in a foreign country on her own) and confront some fella(s) in the middle of the night about what he or they were up to.

Also as for Alfie being an actual drug dealer, i dont think thats even been established yet and stoners dont tend to be the type of people going around murdering people. His wife being a retired teacher and then he starts dealing drugs out of his house, i dont know.