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Murder at the Cottage | Sky

CorkGunJonny

Anyone know what channel it's on? The jim sheridan documentary about sophie toscan du plantier

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monkeybutter

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

What's wrong with the French justice system? He wasn't denied the option to defend himself, he chose not to.

no evidence and they convicted him

if he went to defend himself he would be in jail

need we say more

MoonUnit75

JimmyVik wrote: »

The whole thing has always seemed to me that people want to hang the crime on someone.
Quite early on they got a suspect and fitted the evidence around him.
Meanwhile they forgot to actually investigate the crime.
Even in this thread you see people who believe it was him, just on a gut feeling, or just selecting evidence that suits the fit.

And as for the French trial ...
Dont ever get arrested in France

What's wrong with the French justice system? He wasn't denied the option to defend himself, he chose not to.

Deeec

The gardai didnt preserve the murder scene so no forensic evidence could be obtained and made an absolute shambles of the investigation. They picked Ian Bailey as the murderer to cover up their mistakes. They could even have been under pressure from the government to make it look like they solved the crime. Remember Sophie was well connected in France and in the eyes of the French Ireland as a country didnt look good at the time of the investigation. Ian Bailey was known to be violent and a strange character that noone really liked - he was the perfect guy to frame it on. Only problem was they had no evidence. They thought they could use Marie Farrell as a witness but that didnt go to plan!

The whole thing was to cover the Gardai's failings. Meanwhile the real murderer got away. We will never know the truth of what happened this poor lady.

monkeybutter

whos bringing the horse to france?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOS1ALsW-08

monkeybutter

JimmyVik wrote: »

Maybe noone is being protected and the murderer just slipped away out of contention as the focus shifted and stayed on IB.
They had their man, now they were only going to look for evidence that fitted this man.
Any other evidence just got in the way, so was skipped over.

to strike again years later, duh duh dunnnnn

JimmyVik

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Why Famous?

If someone was being protected it's far more likely to be a local 'pillar of the community' type.

Maybe noone is being protected and the murderer just slipped away out of contention as the focus shifted and stayed on IB.
They had their man, now they were only going to look for evidence that fitted this man.
Any other evidence just got in the way, so was skipped over.

Bannasidhe

monkeybutter wrote: »

what other famous west cork native could be a suspect? would have 100% been in west cork xmass 1996

Why Famous?

If someone was being protected it's far more likely to be a local 'pillar of the community' type.

monkeybutter

what other famous west cork native could be a suspect? would have 100% been in west cork xmass 1996

JimmyVik

The whole thing has always seemed to me that people want to hang the crime on someone.
Quite early on they got a suspect and fitted the evidence around him.
Meanwhile they forgot to actually investigate the crime.
Even in this thread you see people who believe it was him, just on a gut feeling, or just selecting evidence that suits the fit.

And as for the French trial ...
Dont ever get arrested in France

monkeybutter

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

The guards drawing a picture of Baileys hands and not taking photos is one of the worst things I have ever seen in a crime doc, embarrassing.

they apparently washed the glasses as well

corcaigh07

Morzadec wrote: »

I know very little about this case other than the names Ian Bailey and Sophie de Plantier.

I saw there's this Sky doc as well as a different one on Netflix. Was considering watching one but not sure which to go for - anyone who has watched both have any opinions on which would be better?

Listen to the "West Cork" podcast.

Tipsy McSwagger

The guards drawing a picture of Baileys hands and not taking photos is one of the worst things I have ever seen in a crime doc, embarrassing.

monkeybutter

Just on the Police, they were not equipped or trained properly to deal with this.

I presume lessons have been learned, would they not have serious crime teams at a regional or national level who would be parachuted in to assist.

monkeybutter

Morzadec wrote: »

I know very little about this case other than the names Ian Bailey and Sophie de Plantier.

I saw there's this Sky doc as well as a different one on Netflix. Was considering watching one but not sure which to go for - anyone who has watched both have any opinions on which would be better?

neither

look up some articles in the Irish times etc, save yourself some times and they are less biased

Morzadec

I know very little about this case other than the names Ian Bailey and Sophie de Plantier.

I saw there's this Sky doc as well as a different one on Netflix. Was considering watching one but not sure which to go for - anyone who has watched both have any opinions on which would be better?

monkeybutter

awec wrote: »

This guy is dead.

Not sure he would be expecting the man himself to be jumping at the opportunity to be interviewed were he alive

More like, did this allegation rear its head

Sardonicat

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

It never made sense to me why she was 'under duress' when it was her who contacted the Gardai multiple times anonymously and they had to make an appeal for her to contact them again? She seems totally unreliable, but it just doesn't make sense that she would risk exposing her affair for no good reason. She went out of her way to disguise her identity at first, so she was fully aware of the risks of making a false statement about something she never actually saw.

She's a fantasist IMO, and her nonsense got her drawn into something that had her digging herself in deeper with more lies. I don't believe she ever saw anyone, anywhere or that she was out on the night or having an affair.

awec

Muahahaha wrote: »

Havent seen the Sky series yet, is there anywhere else to watch it other than Sky?

Just on Marie Farrell, iirc her claim when she eventually told 'the truth' was she was having an affair and was put under duress by the Gardai to place Bailey at this bridge at a time that fitted into the murder timeline. Is she still going with that story in the documentary and now admitting she never saw Bailey at all?

Also there was another local who had a number of convictions for cannabis possession. He claimed the Gardai had him under duress to make a statement as well to frame Bailey, iirc he also claimed the Gardai were supplying him with hash in exchange. Did he come up in the documentary at all?

This guy is dead.

Shelga

Also how can the French even have a trial with no defence presented? Doesn’t that break one of the pillars of a fair judicial process? Everything the prosecution put forward was completely uncontested.

Now, I’m not saying Bailey definitely did not do it. No one knows, or probably will ever know for sure. But there sure as hell seems to be nowhere near enough evidence to prove he did it, beyond reasonable doubt.

MoonUnit75

Muahahaha wrote: »

Havent seen the Sky series yet, is there anywhere else to watch it other than Sky?

Just on Marie Farrell, iirc her claim when she eventually told 'the truth' was she was having an affair and was put under duress by the Gardai to place Bailey at this bridge at a time that fitted into the murder timeline. Is she still going with that story in the documentary and now admitting she never saw Bailey at all?

It never made sense to me why she was 'under duress' when it was her who contacted the Gardai multiple times anonymously and they had to make an appeal for her to contact them again? She seems totally unreliable, but it just doesn't make sense that she would risk exposing her affair for no good reason. She went out of her way to disguise her identity at first, so she was fully aware of the risks of making a false statement about something she never actually saw.

Cona44

Muahahaha wrote: »

Havent seen the Sky series yet, is there anywhere else to watch it other than Sky?

Just on Marie Farrell, iirc her claim when she eventually told 'the truth' was she was having an affair and was put under duress by the Gardai to place Bailey at this bridge at a time that fitted into the murder timeline. Is she still going with that story in the documentary and now admitting she never saw Bailey at all?

Also there was another local who had a number of convictions for cannabis possession. He claimed the Gardai had him under duress to make a statement as well to frame Bailey, iirc he also claimed the Gardai were supplying him with hash in exchange. Did he come up in the documentary at all?

I actually dont know what MF story is any more. She still spoofing on about seeing a 'tanned' small man wearing a beret. What utter boll**ks...

THink they briefly mention Martin Graham in the Sky documentary but not a lot of detail. He has sadly passed away now so maybe thats why.

Cona44

The Sky documentary wasn't very thorough and seemed to just want to keep it short and to the point at a high level. Didn't really mention anything we dont already know. Kind of targetted at an audience who know nothing about the story so far.

The West Cork podcast has been the most detailed, in-depth version of events so far. Although, I wish it had dug a bit deeper seeing as they spent 3 years in total in West Cork making the show. The episode where they explore who could have done it (if not IB) was a waste of time really. They harped on about a horse and the story of Elks in Norway or something for no real reason. We know it had to be a murder due to the murder weapons, so I thought this was a bit stupid.
Also, now that I listen back to it, they let a few of the small details go without comment. This case really will revolve around the small details.

Muahahaha

Havent seen the Sky series yet, is there anywhere else to watch it other than Sky?

Just on Marie Farrell, iirc her claim when she eventually told 'the truth' was she was having an affair and was put under duress by the Gardai to place Bailey at this bridge at a time that fitted into the murder timeline. Is she still going with that story in the documentary and now admitting she never saw Bailey at all?

Also there was another local who had a number of convictions for cannabis possession. He claimed the Gardai had him under duress to make a statement as well to frame Bailey, iirc he also claimed the Gardai were supplying him with hash in exchange. Did he come up in the documentary at all?

Loafing Oaf

Shelga wrote: »

Sophie could have had a lover in Dublin, he visited, they rowed, he killed her, he left.

But without hard evidence like DNA this isn't on any firmer ground than the Bailey 'conviction'. How could it be followed up 25 years on?

Shelga

No DNA evidence whatsoever. No motive on Bailey's part. No connection from him to Sophie, apart from maybe being introduced to her once. No other evidence of any communication or relationship between them.

What exactly did the French court convict on?! Someone said Bailey had scratches on his hands, and a local attention-seeker and proven liar (being generous) says she saw a man at a bridge at 2am that wasn't even that near either the murder scene or his own house?

[Deleted User]

robwen wrote: »

This seems a pretty big lead to be investigated, I haven't heard before,

"Ms Hellen claimed that Sophie suspected that someone was getting into the house to use her water and bathroom facilities while she was away. She described how once she was at the house when Sophie had just arrived from France with Bruno Carbonnet.

He complained that the bath was not clean.

"I went upstairs to check it and straight away I saw it was used. I cleaned it on the Thursday and this was the Friday when they came, so it was used on Thursday night.

"We checked the house to see where he came in and the window of the porch was open, so this was the only place he could have got in and used the bath."

Also it's not in this article but I read or heard somewhere maybe the West Cork podcast that Sophie's housekeeper said there was a small axe usually kept at the door of the cottage but it was missing & it could of matched with some of the injuries to the back of her head

Shirley they fingerprinted bannisters and bathroom given that story? And considering very few visitors you’d imagine they’d be eager to find the owners of all fingerprints in that house

[Deleted User]

notahappycamper wrote: »

In the West Cork Podcast, it is said Alfie (Sophie’s neighbour) thought he introduced them to each other as IB was up in his house gardening the Summer before.

That is correct and Bailey denies it. Bailey says he may have seen her at a distance,possibly that day or maybe another day. Bailey denies actually meeting Sophie

mioniqa

I came across this article https://www.francetvinfo.fr/economie/emploi/metiers/art-culture-edition/video-il-faut-se-battre-pour-etre-productrice-melita-toscan-du-plantier-l-une-des-rares-femmes-a-avoir-dirige-un-festival-de-cinema_3105219.html and used google translate to read it.

Apparently the mother of Daniel Toscan du Plantier's fourth wife's was murdered by her father (Melita Nikolic's mother was murdered by her father). Weird to be connected to two murders.

notahappycamper

wawaman wrote: »

Apologies if this has already been asked and answered. But has a link between IB and Sophie ever been firmly establised? Like were they ever seen together or at least suspected of knowing each other?
The killing was overkill so it makes no sense for IB to rock up to her house out of the blue and kill her.

In the West Cork Podcast, it is said Alfie (Sophie’s neighbour) thought he introduced them to each other as IB was up in his house gardening the Summer before.

Gussie Scrotch

notahappycamper wrote: »

What a fcuking eeejit Marie Farrell was in all of this. Perverting the course of justice….

You're absolutely right.

I believe that Marie Farrell could blow this wide open if she were willing to tell everything she knows.