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ESB eCars

liamog

Details from the dail on the eCars €10,000,000 expansion programme.

The key elements include six high speed charging hubs on motorways capable of charging eight vehicles simultaneously; 16 high speed charging hubs capable of charging four vehicles simultaneously; additional high power chargers at 34 current 50 kW locations; upgrading over 50 22 kW chargers to 50 kW, and replacing up to 264 locations with 528 charge points at the pre-existing pilot grade of 22 kW to next generation high reliability models.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-01-24/10/?fbclid=IwAR1eGLQjNFuywCoaB__FJADns7gNOD09DaR9XLueHAKZ8vljfd-kL-_LpDs

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Black_Knight

peposhi wrote: »

I’ll be passing by J14 tomorrow if anyone needs more detailed pictures...

If you're willing to get up close to them, there should be some manufacturers label) plate on the back, usually the bottom. Should be able to spec them up from that and see what the units are capable of (max power, load sharing?).

ELM327

liamog wrote: »

Had to pick up some running gear at Kildare Village today, so popped down to get a photo.

https://i.imgur.com/44tgeZa.jpg

The 3 new style units are 2 x 2 CCS, 1x 1 CCS, 1 CHAdeMO
Then an Efacec with 1xCHAdeMO, 1xCCS and 1 Type 2 AC socket.

So that's potentially 6 CCS can charge at once. The only thing I would change is that last unit, I would of preferred if they'd installed another of the new units but with 1xCCS and 1xCHAdeMO.

Even the signs to specify "CCS Charging".
Love it. Finally a step in the right direction, away from Chademo. I think theyve future proofed demand for the next 3 years at that site.

liamog

ELM327 wrote: »

Even the signs to specify "CCS Charging".
Love it. Finally a step in the right direction, away from Chademo. I think theyve future proofed demand for the next 3 years at that site.

Must admit I'm impressed by the layout, it's amazing how much better an eCars site can be when it's originally designed by Ionity Engineers.

the_amazing_raisin

liamog wrote: »

Must admit I'm impressed by the layout, it's amazing how much better an eCars site can be when it's originally designed by Ionity Engineers.

Hopefully ESB will continue this trend of getting a better charging provider to do all the thinking

liamog

Hopefully the next designers have experience of the pull through charger layouts so that people can charge with a trailer.

AndyBoBandy

The lads are working on the unit’s now at J14…… mobile won’t let me upload a photo…

ELM327

Hopefully this is the first of many of what can finally be called a "hub".
Great location, at an MSA, although too close to Dublin to use for Dublin to Cork, it's definitely well placed for the cork-dublin route and would take business away from the Ionity Kill sites. Another ecars hub at Cashel would be great for the dublin to cork route. And also at Birdhill for dublin to limerick. And also at Castlebellingham and Athlone for Belfast and Galway respectively.

eagerv

Just a thought from my limited one and a third years EV driving.

Why is the Cork area so poor for charging? Only the odd single units which you may have to detour into busy traffic areas. It's crying out for a decent hub (I know SC will come eventually).
Luckily last week I could do the trip (340km) there and back without charging due to traffic and slow roads, but had it been night, or winter and could belt it a bit, would not be so convenient.

Fine for most leaving the area, but it seems like there is no encouragement to welcome people in..

AndyBoBandy

So I had a quick chat to the lads installing the chargers….

They said the fancy units were 350kW units, and will load share to 175kW when being shared……

They also said the units should be ‘live’ by the end of this week….. (now whether eCars opens them this week is another matter!! I suspect they could be free as well for the first few days/weeks…).

They said the old triple head unit will also be removed once the new units go live…

KCross

eagerv wrote: »

Why is the Cork area so poor for charging? Only the odd single units which you may have to detour into busy traffic areas. It's crying out for a decent hub (I know SC will come eventually).
...
Fine for most leaving the area, but it seems like there is no encouragement to welcome people in..

I can only agree. Its very poorly serviced. All single units and not well placed except for maybe the Frankfield one.

They are all outcomes from the original eCars rollout from 2011 with no new development since so it is not fit for purpose by a long shot.

Fermoy and Rochestown are particularly badly placed. There is a massive need for a hub somewhere easily accessible off the South Ring road and incoming from the East (maybe Eastgate retail park area).

ELM327

350kW with loadsharing is perfect! Now lets bring more!

AndyBoBandy

I think another good spot (on the M7) for a hub like this would be the Obama Plaza in Moneygall….

There should be enough of these hubs along the routes so that you can decide to stop when you want to, not when you ‘need’ to (as in we better stop here as begone here it’s a charging wilderness)..

Every motorway and national route should have a hub like this every 20-30km……

Also, once this hub at J14 goes live, surely it’ll be the death knell for the Kill Ionity sites….?

Also also, I said earlier in this thread I’ll never have to use the J14 hub with Superchargers….. but how nice is the J14 services??? Very impressive MSA….. with excellent food/snack options..

liamog

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Every motorway and national route should have a hub like this every 20-30km……

I think that's overkill, closer to every 70km/80km would be better.
I'd rather have 16 chargers every 70km than 8 chargers every 35km.

AndyBoBandy

liamog wrote: »

I think that's overkill, closer to every 70km/80km would be better.
I'd rather have 16 chargers every 70km than 8 chargers every 35km.

But we have petrol stations every 20-30km on motorways (or just off them in very close proximity)….

“If you build it, they will come”

eagerv

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

I think another good spot (on the M7) for a hub like this would be the Obama Plaza in Moneygall….

There should be enough of these hubs along the routes so that you can decide to stop when you want to, not when you ‘need’ to (as in we better stop here as begone here it’s a charging wilderness)..

Every motorway and national route should have a hub like this every 20-30km……

Also, once this hub at J14 goes live, surely it’ll be the death knell for the Kill Ionity sites….?

Also also, I said earlier in this thread I’ll never have to use the J14 hub with Superchargers….. but how nice is the J14 services??? Very impressive MSA….. with excellent food/snack options..

I hope not, what about those of us coming up on the M9?

ELM327

eagerv wrote: »

I hope not, what about those of us coming up on the M9?

Theres already an ecars 150kW on that route, I presume they would just look to add more capacity to the existing 150kW+50kW site as opposed to another new site

AndyBoBandy

Yeah, another J14 style hub in Kilcullen would be good, or even just throw in another twin CCS 150kW unit in addition to what’s already there…

ELM327

I think for current level of EV to the end of '21, a 150kW with loadsharing (2*CCS would be better but 1*CCS + 1 Chad is ok) and a co located 50kW is adequate.

What's going into J14 is Tesla/Ionity level of supply. You'd not see queuing at that site - so it could be argued with my loss mitigation hat on that it's an overspend. What should have gone in there is 1*350kW with 2*CCS and one 150kW with 1*CCS + 1*Chad, and do the groundwork for 8 stalls. The site there as I say is built now but will not meet or exceed demand for a number of years.

The case could be made that instead of that hub, 3 separate sites of 2 chargers could be built and is that a better use of resources?

eagerv

ELM327 wrote: »

Theres already an ecars 150kW on that route, I presume they would just look to add more capacity to the existing 150kW+50kW site as opposed to another new site

Yes, often stop at Kilcullen for a quick coffee but a bit of a mess atm with the parking spots, a few times would have had to wait had I needed to charge. With Ionity, just a quick 10-15 mins gives me loads to get home and never a wait..

AndyBoBandy

You get the feeling J14 will be pushed front and centre of any and all eCars propaganda from now on showing what they can do, and ‘look how great we are’…..

The issue I now have is the next 2-3 sites like this haven’t already been started yet, and going at eCars speed, it’ll be 18-36 months before we see any progress in this regard.

the_amazing_raisin

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

You get the feeling J14 will be pushed front and centre of any and all eCars propaganda from now on showing what they can do, and ‘look how great we are’…..

The issue I now have is the next 2-3 sites like this haven’t already been started yet, and going at eCars speed, it’ll be 18-36 months before we see any progress in this regard.

Absolutely, they don't just need to keep the momentum going they need to step it up

AndyBoBandy

I’d also love to see 2x Twin AC22’s located at these hub sites, for the folks that’ll be happy to spend 1-2 hours there (cheaper) AC charging as well as the non CCS Zoe drivers….

Black_Knight

KCross wrote: »

I can only agree. Its very poorly serviced. All single units and not well placed except for maybe the Frankfield one.

They are all outcomes from the original eCars rollout from 2011 with no new development since so it is not fit for purpose by a long shot.

Fermoy and Rochestown are particularly badly placed. There is a massive need for a hub somewhere easily accessible off the South Ring road and incoming from the East (maybe Eastgate retail park area).

No service station there at the moment though, no?

Black_Knight

First upgraded NI unit!

Strand Road, Derry, Derry
A WallBox eVolve Smart T 22kW AC unit

liamog

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

I’d also love to see 2x Twin AC22’s located at these hub sites, for the folks that’ll be happy to spend 1-2 hours there (cheaper) AC charging as well as the non CCS Zoe drivers….

I don't see any value in mass AC charging at motorway services, if they provide them they should be locked to a minimum 20kW so that Zoe's can be assured of an adequate on-route charge.

Black_Knight

The triple head unit has power anyways.

https://myaccount.esbecars.com/stationFacade/findStationById?stationId=2026

CHAdeMO and CCS have max power of 50kW, Type 2 has max power of 22kW

Once the `socketPrices` gets populated it tends to appear on ecars site.

EDIT. Prices are in, unit is on the site and currently charging. Expect to see it appear/disappear from time to time though while they install it.

AndyBoBandy

That ‘slower’ 50kW unit will become the primarily used CHAdeMO plug as it’s cheaper (what’s the point of paying the extra few cent for at best an additional 10kW of speed from a hyper unit?)…… so the poor old non CCS Zoe drivers will suffer..

liamog

Black_Knight wrote: »

CHAdeMO and CCS have max power of 50kW, Type 2 has max power of 22kW

It does seem a shame that they've installed a triple with a 22kW AC socket here. The only justification I could think to not install 4 of the new style chargers was to serve the 43kW AC Zoe community. But with this charger installed, I think they should of gone with a couple of AC posts somewhere else on site. Does this count as the first site to lose a 43kW AC connection?

the_amazing_raisin

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

That ‘slower’ 50kW unit will become the primarily used CHAdeMO plug as it’s cheaper (what’s the point of paying the extra few cent for at best an additional 10kW of speed from a hyper unit?)…… so the poor old non CCS Zoe drivers will suffer..

Is the old unit still in the app or something? That's showing 2 50kW chargers

peposhi

Black_Knight wrote: »

If you're willing to get up close to them, there should be some manufacturers label) plate on the back, usually the bottom. Should be able to spec them up from that and see what the units are capable of (max power, load sharing?).

Pics.
Should be all live by the end of the week.
Old unit should be removed straight after.