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Forced to work from home

Padre_Pio

Just got word today that work is downsizing their offices and the COVID work from home policy is going to be a near-permanent WHF policy.

Basically, the new office will only have hot desks, maybe half as many as there are staff. Employees have to book a desk in advance if they need to come into the office, but your permanent desk is expected to be in your own home.

There's uproar from certain people, but the response is basically put up and shut up.
Personally, there's no mention of home working in my contract. I was looking forward to getting back into the office and I barely have the space for a desk where I'm living at the moment, never mind a full setup.

Anyone have any experience of this? Places like Google and Facebook have said they're looking at similar policies. Any ideas how that went down with staff?

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[Deleted User]

Padre_Pio wrote: »

Not my problem if you have issues with comprehension.
Read it again.

Denied.
In our opinion
No go.

Don't accuse me of misrepresentation because you cannot write a post clearly.

[Deleted User]

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Yes that right but your contract has to state a place of assignment. Yes you can be reassigned but the distance has to be reasonable and it cannot be continuously changing on a daily, weekly, or even monthly basis without compensation

It states that I am assigned to a Department. Location is not specified.

I don't know what else you want me to tell you.

[Deleted User]

irelandrover wrote: »

THats not what he said.

At the end of the sentence it said it was a no go.

A no go from the point of view of the employees.

Not the employer.

Anyway, we now know from further posts that the situation is not as black and white and presented and is still under development.

The OP should wait and see how things develop.

Bass Reeves

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A no go from the point of view of the employees.

Not the employer.

Anyway, we now know from further posts that the situation is not as black and white and presented and is still under development.

The OP should wait and see how things develop.

How long ago was the contract put in place

GreeBo

Deleted User wrote: »

Or there will be an option to book a hotdesk.

Either way, it is not the totally black and white scenario of permanent WFH that you are trying to paint.

There are more people than hotdesks, I dont know how else to explain how this means not everyone can get a desk.

GreeBo

namloc1980 wrote: »

? Statutory redundancy is what you may get in that situation.

Thats exactly the bloody point of this thread!
You dont get told to move or quit.

Christy42

GreeBo wrote: »

There are more people than hotdesks, I dont know how else to explain how this means not everyone can get a desk.

How many want a desk is a big question. Every survey I have seen has people wanting to work from home more so it might be possible to work from the office the vast majority of the time.

GreeBo

oisinog wrote: »

How do you seperate your work life from your personal life? Do you stop talking to your "friends" when you move jobs to a new social circle?

Its quite trivial, when I am talking to people about work then its work related, when I am not then its not.
I talk to my wife about work yet I dont work with her.

If they are my friends then no I dont stop talking to them?

[Deleted User]

The issue is not my contract.

The issue is that posters are claiming that employers can not change their employees work location without agreement first, when they actually can. It happens all the time. When staff are reassigned, or when leases on buildings end etc.

Contracts aren't continuously being rewritten every time someone moves desk, though some would like the think so!

GreeBo

oisinog wrote: »

your now being obtuse.

I understand that being stuck at home is having a social impact on people, I also know a number of people who are struggling with their mental healt working at home. I would gladly give up my desk at work for people in this situation.

If you look at something in a negative light no matter what it is you will only see the downsides and vice versa for only looking at the positive.

You need to find a balance no matter where you work be it at home or in the office I have just happend to embrace the positives of work from home as this has given me a better work life balance.

Again you twist my words I have never called anyone negative I have said if you only look at the negativity of it that is all you will see.

You insist that everyone look at the positive yet have an issue when some people look at the negatives, thats a large contradiction.

There are far more downsides to WFH than mental health, which again you refuse to accept.
The positives that you mention simply dont exist for many people, not because they dont deem them positive, but because the negative never existed for them. There are thousands of people who dont spend hours commuting, who dont spend hundreds on coffees.

GreeBo

Deleted User wrote: »

The issue is not my contract.

The issue is that posters are claiming that employers can not change their employees work location without agreement first, when they actually can. It happens all the time. When staff are reassigned, or when leases on buildings end etc.

Contracts aren't continuously being rewritten every time someone moves desk, though some would like the think so!

The terms are changing from the company providing the work env to the employee providing it. No one is suggesting what you are arguing.

[Deleted User]

GreeBo wrote: »

The terms are changing from the company providing the work env to the employee providing it. No one is suggesting what you are arguing.

The employer will still be providing 100 desks for staff use.

GreeBo

oisinog wrote: »

I'm not disputing anything you have said, and I agree that wfh does not suit everyone.

What I keep trying to say is its not all the doom and gloom some people here are making it out to be if they make a few changes in how they look at wfh that may change their outlook.

It looks like it will be here to stay for the foreseeable future and we need to embrace it not fight it.

For the people who dont currently have any of the negatives of working in an office it is all negatives!

GreeBo

Deleted User wrote: »

The employer will still be providing 100 desks for staff use.

And how many staff are there?

[Deleted User]

I suppose people will look at it any way they like and suit themselves.

Lifes very short to be paying too much attention to the POV of anyone who wants to find all the negatives, but let them away off to do so if they prefer

bridest

Being forced to work from home has been the most positive experience of my working life. I got to get away from Dublin, away from a 7km commute that took me just over an hour to walk or the same time on a bus! Got away from paying stupid high rent for a sub standard apartment. Got away from the overpriced coffee shops. Got back to the country and couldn't be happier. Now dreading potentially having to go back to it sooner rather than later. If I could work remotely forever I'd jump on the chance. It's each to their own

oisinog

GreeBo wrote: »

You insist that everyone look at the positive yet have an issue when some people look at the negatives, thats a large contradiction.

There are far more downsides to WFH than mental health, which again you refuse to accept.
The positives that you mention simply dont exist for many people, not because they dont deem them positive, but because the negative never existed for them. There are thousands of people who dont spend hours commuting, who dont spend hundreds on coffees.

Always looking at the negativity of somthing and not weighing up both sides of an argument is not a great outlook in life.

You tell me then what do you see as the downsides to working from home?

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The issue is not my contract.

The issue is that posters are claiming that employers can not change their employees work location without agreement first, when they actually can. It happens all the time. When staff are reassigned, or when leases on buildings end etc.

Contracts aren't continuously being rewritten every time someone moves desk, though some would like the think so!

My contract never even was the place of my work when it was signed. The address is the registered company address in Ireland....not my office address. So yes, the location is an irrelevance

Mrs OBumble

bridest wrote: »

Being forced to work from home has been the most positive experience of my working life. I got to get away from Dublin, away from a 7km commute that took me just over an hour to walk or the same time on a bus! Got away from paying stupid high rent for a sub standard apartment. Got away from the overpriced coffee shops. Got back to the country and couldn't be happier. Now dreading potentially having to go back to it sooner rather than later. If I could work remotely forever I'd jump on the chance. It's each to their own

So look for a job located close to where you want to live.

ineedeuro

bridest wrote: »

Being forced to work from home has been the most positive experience of my working life. I got to get away from Dublin, away from a 7km commute that took me just over an hour to walk or the same time on a bus! Got away from paying stupid high rent for a sub standard apartment. Got away from the overpriced coffee shops. Got back to the country and couldn't be happier. Now dreading potentially having to go back to it sooner rather than later. If I could work remotely forever I'd jump on the chance. It's each to their own

I would go and ask company, if you can show productivity hasn't fallen during lockdown I cant see anyone forcing you back in, maybe a hybrid with 1-2 days but still gives you a couple of days at home......

[Deleted User]

GreeBo wrote: »

And how many staff are there?

Plenty who will be happy to work from home, leaving enough empty desks available for those who don't.

This is the type of attitude I am getting from some of those who are trying to argue against WFH.

They will try to argue that they have no issue with those who are happy to WFH, but at the same time, they seem to expect that every workplace should revert to exactly how they were before COVID, instead of accepting that for the vast, vast majority of people, WFH before COVID was a pipe dream that is now being realised.

Instead, they want to go backwards, back to 2019, and drag everyone else backwards with them, with all kinds of makey up excuses about contracts and how WFH doesn't work.

Mark my words, in 10-15 years time, all those 20-somethings who now live for the office and the social life that comes with it, will be the very ones looking to buy houses and starting families and then they will be grateful for the option to work from home and to those of us who have the foresight now to make sure this opportunity is not missed and that workplaces never go back to how they were before COVID.

Enjoy your afternoon.

GreeBo

oisinog wrote: »

Always looking at the negativity of somthing and not weighing up both sides of an argument is not a great outlook in life.

You tell me then what do you see as the downsides to working from home?

This is unreal.
For many people working in an office is a positive and has no negatives.
moving that to WFH has many negatives for them, multiple examples have been given on the thread already.

You simply fail to accept that these people have weighed up both sides, but for them working in an office has no negatives!

GreeBo

Deleted User wrote: »

Plenty who will be happy to work from home, leaving enough empty desks available for those who don't.

This is the type of attitude I am getting from some of those who are trying to argue against WFH.

They will try to argue that they have no issue with those who are happy to WFH, but at the same time, they seem to expect that workplaces should revert to exactly how they were before COVID, instead of accepting that for the vast, vast majority of people, WFH before COVID was a dream that is now being realised.

Instead, they want to go backwards, instead of forwards, and drag everyone else backwards with them, with all kinds of makey up excuses about contracts and how WFH doesn't work.

Mark my words, in 10-15 years time, all those 20-somethings who now live for the office and the social life that comes with it, will be the very ones looking to buy houses and starting families and then they will be grateful for the option to work from home and to those of us who have the foresight now to make sure this opportunity is not missed and that workplaces never go back to how they were before COVID.

Enjoy your afternoon.

In summary, you have no idea how many staff there are, how many will want desks and what contention there will be.

Thanks for clarifying.

oisinog

GreeBo wrote: »

This is unreal.
For many people working in an office is a positive and has no negatives.
moving that to WFH has many negatives for them, multiple examples have been given on the thread already.

You simply fail to accept that these people have weighed up both sides, but for them working in an office has no negatives!

You deflected the question I asked you what do you see as the downsides from working from home?

You seem to be here for an argument and have avoided answering questions directly.

ineedeuro

oisinog wrote: »

You deflected the question I asked you what do you see as the downsides from working from home?

You seem to be here for an argument and have avoided answering questions directly.

I figured that out quickly yesterday.

[Deleted User]

GreeBo wrote: »

In summary, you have no idea how many staff there are, how many will want desks and what contention there will be.

Thanks for clarifying.

I know exactly how many staff the OP stated there are and how many desks his employer intended to provide, and its been quoted multiple times.

You just want an argument for the sake of it.

Time to apply the ignore button.

oisinog

ineedeuro wrote: »

I figured that out quickly yesterday.

I'm trying not to look at the negativity of their posts

floorpie

Apple in the US are pulling everyone back to office in September. They're allowing 2 weeks remote per year, and WFH on Wednesdays and Fridays for some. The decision to define remote days and split them in the week is interesting.

I think this is the type of rhetoric you can expect over the next year (corporate-speak trigger warning):

“For all that we’ve been able to achieve while many of us have been separated, the truth is that there has been something essential missing from this past year: each other,” he said. “Video conference calling has narrowed the distance between us, to be sure, but there are things it simply cannot replicate.”

https://www.theverge.com/2021/6/2/22465846/apple-employees-return-office-three-days-week-september

irelandrover

oisinog wrote: »

You deflected the question I asked you what do you see as the downsides from working from home?

You seem to be here for an argument and have avoided answering questions directly.

I'll also answer this. These are my benefits to working in the office.

I liked my colleagues. Work was also a social aspect,, not my only social aspect.

It was a 12 minute cycle or a 25 minute run so no travel expenses. In fact I got paid 19cent a kilometer so I lose money by not commuting.

Once A month we had a company meeting with beer provided afterwards and we were paid for this.

Air Conditioned office during the summer months. Don't have to heat my house during winter months.

Much easier to train new staff as they could shadow rather than me having to take time to call them.

Free tea and coffee at the office.

Quite often I'd overhear something from another project that I'd already dealt with so problems were avoided instead of solved after the fact.

I got 2 hours paid to visit the doctor or dentist.

Easier switch off from work when I close laptop and walk out the door.

Easier to work on my wife's day off with our child as she couldn't just knock on my office door.

Didnt have to dedicate a room in my house to a home office.

Benefits to working from home,
I'm home to accept packages

I can occasionally finish early without people knowing

[Deleted User]

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

So look for a job located close to where you want to live.

So move to a bigger house that you can fit a desk in.