What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

iebamm2580 wrote: »

I will not answer any question from you until you answer my question, its just common courtesy to answer my question seeing as i asked first before asking your question. Yes or no, did the Muslim grooming gangs target Muslim or non Muslim girls?

Obviously you didn't read my reply, maybe go try again.

bubblypop wrote: »

Why so interested in my opinion?

The young girls who were targeted in the UK were majority British, vulnerable children, at risk and easy pickings for those abusers.
There have been many reports into these cases and others like them, if you're interested in further reading.

obviously the victims were british...

the Asian rape gangs were hardly going on rape weekends to other countries.

This is typical of your type of way of deflecting from saying the victims were predominantly white.
the rapists predominantly asian muslims.

iebamm2580

bubblypop wrote: »

Why so interested in my opinion?

The young girls who were targeted in the UK were majority British, vulnerable children, at risk and easy pickings for those abusers.
There have been many reports into these cases and others like them, if you're interested in further reading.

I will not answer any question from you until you answer my question, its just common courtesy to answer my question seeing as i asked first before asking your question. Yes or no, did the Muslim grooming gangs target Muslim or non Muslim girls?

Why so interested in my opinion?

The young girls who were targeted in the UK were majority British, vulnerable children, at risk and easy pickings for those abusers.
There have been many reports into these cases and others like them, if you're interested in further reading.

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Oh must be mistaken that you are a guard so, my apologies. I didnt see you give a yes or no answer to the above question in your posts so could you now, yes or no will suffice. Do the Muslim grooming gangs target muslim or non Muslim girls?

you wont get an answer.

Just like when he stated some posters were racist earlier in this thread, when asked who these posters were he deflected.

Walking_Wolf wrote: »

Absolutely true. I have friends living out there who say they'd leave in a heartbeat if they could. I came across this podcast of the Adrian Kennedy show where a woman living in Balbriggan rang in to tell of the horrific abuse her autistic son was receiving at the hands of kids who weren't 'locals'. She says it at the 27:50 mark onwards.
https://youtu.be/MqcuWAIXPGI

but,,,but...but we were told multiculturalism will benefit us all.

how can this be ?

iebamm2580

bubblypop wrote: »

iebamm2580 wrote: »

I have never said that.
I also replied to this question when wibbs brought it up last night, even though it had nothing to do with the conversation
Why are you so interested in my opinion?

Oh must be mistaken that you are a guard so, my apologies. I didnt see you give a yes or no answer to the above question in your posts so could you now, yes or no will suffice. Do the Muslim grooming gangs target muslim or non Muslim girls?

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Wibbs wrote: »

Do these gangs target Muslim girls and women? Simple question. Yes, or no? They apparently clearly see a fundamental difference, but you can't?

Bubblypop can you answer this yes or no question? I think you said you were a guard so you ask yes or no questions as part of your job so surely you can answer this simple question with a yes or no.

I have never said that.
I also replied to this question when wibbs brought it up last night, even though it had nothing to do with the conversation
Why are you so interested in my opinion?

iebamm2580

Wibbs wrote: »

Do these gangs target Muslim girls and women? Simple question. Yes, or no? They apparently clearly see a fundamental difference, but you can't?

Bubblypop can you answer this yes or no question? I think you said you were a guard so you ask yes or no questions as part of your job so surely you can answer this simple question with a yes or no.

DeadHand

The equation is quite simple.

Products of violently misogynistic cultures and a violently misogynistic religion (the cultures being informed by the religion) are more likely to commit violent misogyny.

Way i see it

Seems to me like most people I suspect, the muslim grooming gang are the most prolific rape grooming gangs, yet muslims are a minority of the population.

so according to my maths these muslims are more prone to raping than white people., 14 grooming gangs of muslim roots in the past decade or so
or its just a huge "coincidence" that the rapists just happened to be muslim and the UK got "unlucky" and that all the muslim rapists went solely to england".

Whats to stop this country from absorbing foreign rapists in to our country, we have enough of our own home grown rapists, and criminals without importing another countries.
The Irish government duty is to its own people who elected them in the first place,

Yellow_Fern

Sand wrote: »

You are the one pretending to be offended at the comparison between sexual violence in ethnic conflict and the sexual violence English girls suffered at the hands of non-English ethnic gangs. You're belittling the sexual violence those English girls suffered as not being serious enough to be comparable to sexual violence in other ethnic conflicts.

This is only pretended of course to suit a simplistic narrative where it is wrong to draw any conclusions about how men from foreign enclaves in European countries treat the indigenous women.

What is interesting about those cases is how elements of the media went into over up mode. There was a high-profile Guardian and Wiki piece when the cited a Home Office report in December 2020 the idea of Asian gangs is a myth.

A new Home Office report admits grooming gangs are not a ‘Muslim problem'
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/19/home-office-report-grooming-gangs-not-muslim

But if you go and download the actual report it actually says we don't know enough about who guilty of these crime to infer if they are more likely to commit.

Research has found that group-based CSE offenders are most commonly White.4 Some studies suggest an over-representation of Black and Asian offenders relative to the demographics of national populations. However, it is not possible to conclude that this is representative of all group-based CSE offending. This is due to issues such as data quality problems, the way the samples were selected in studies, and the potential for bias and inaccuracies in the way that ethnicity data is collected

Since when did absence of evidence become evidence?

It gets worse. Other stories said it was a white problem

Most child sexual abuse gangs made up of white men, Home Office report says
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/15/child-sexual-abuse-gangs-white-men-home-office-report

Digging deeper, you can see this conclusion came from the following dataset in the home office report.

CEOP (2011) 2,300 possible offenders, but approximately 1,100 were excluded from analysis due to a lack of basic information. In the remaining 1,200 cases, ethnicity data was unknown for 38% of them. Where data was available 30% of offenders were White, while 28% were Asian.

Berelowitz. 2012. 1514 perpetrators. 21% of these cases the ethnicity of the perpetrator was not provided, Where the ethnicity of perpetrators was provided, 28% white, 21% Asian, 11% black.

The Children’s Commissioner for England 2014. 42% white, 17% were Black, 14% were Asian

So actually if evidence is reliable the evidence shows Asians are massively over represented. If we were to break this down excluding, Chinese and East Asians the differences would be huge.

14 different muslim grooming gangs where the numbers convicted and sentenced to terms in prison is in the 3 figures.

and media like the BBC try to cover up the facts they were muslim.

Then what would you expect from the bbc, thesame bbc that had jimmy saville, stuart hall, rolf harris etc on their shows

DeadHand

I always felt there were echoes of rape as a weapon of war in the activities of the organised Muslim groups who target young native women and children for rape and torture in many towns and cities throughout England.

It’s one society attacking another with the aggressor attempting to assert dominance. These are crimes of ethnic and religious supremacism informed by the cultural attitudes of the rapists as well as having strong doctrinal justification from within Islam. Wars are often driven by these motivations, at least partly.

Of course, RTE or the BBC will not acknowledge these obvious aspects as they do not chime with their agendas and carefully enforced narrative.

The outrages first revealed in Rotherham are, in my opinion, the greatest incidence of calculated racial/sectarian violence in the West of this generation. Yet, they are not treated as such by a political and media establishment otherwise enthralled by a cultish race obsession.

bubblypop wrote: »

I have already stated that all sexual crimes are wrong, I would never compare one with another, I don't know why you would. They are seperate.

End of.

you mean like this quote, where again you seem to think there are different types of rape

bubblypop wrote: »

Do not try to compare rape gangs in the UK with conflict based sexual violence.

The end result is the same, be it in Bosnia, Bolton or Ballygobackwards, rape is rape.
since when did ethnicity, geography etc matter ?

the muslim rape gangs of the uk, and war monger rape gangs, all left rape victims behind then, there is nothing "separate" about it.

Its like you are trying to differentiate between levels of abuse.

Sand wrote: »

You are the one pretending to be offended at the comparison between sexual violence in ethnic conflict and the sexual violence English girls suffered at the hands of non-English ethnic gangs. You're belittling the sexual violence those English girls suffered as not being serious enough to be comparable to sexual violence in other ethnic conflicts.

This is only pretended of course to suit a simplistic narrative where it is wrong to draw any conclusions about how men from foreign enclaves in European countries treat the indigenous women.

You pick me up wrong.
And you are being argumentative.

I am not offended nor am I pretending to be offended. I have not, thankfully been the victim of rape. I do however have plenty of experience dealing with such victims.

I have already stated that all sexual crimes are wrong, I would never compare one with another, I don't know why you would. They are seperate.

You also do not understand anything about war crimes, sexual assaults and rapes within conflicts are tools, used against women and men, they are often used by the opposing forces but offenders also commit these acts on their own people. They may bring the same feelings to the victims.

Just because they are different does not make one worse or better then the other. They are both terrible crimes which leave victims devasted.

They should not be used as some kind of upper hand in an argument or debate.

End of.

bubblypop wrote: »

Nor would I even try to. I would never belittle any girl or woman's experience as a victim of sexual violence.
I don't know why you keep repeating that I do.

You are the one pretending to be offended at the comparison between sexual violence in ethnic conflict and the sexual violence English girls suffered at the hands of non-English ethnic gangs. You're belittling the sexual violence those English girls suffered as not being serious enough to be comparable to sexual violence in other ethnic conflicts.

This is only pretended of course to suit a simplistic narrative where it is wrong to draw any conclusions about how men from foreign enclaves in European countries treat the indigenous women.

Sand wrote: »

You cannot diminish or dismiss the sheer level of ethnic hatred that motivated the criminals

I would never belittle any girl or woman's experience as a victim of sexual violence.
I don't know why you keep repeating that I do.

bubblypop wrote: »

Perhaps you missed the part where I was talking about the victims of war crimes?
the gang rapes on English girls are not the same as sexual violence in conflicts.

Different conversation

My earlier reply to your post was somehow removed. I'll repeat:

A member of the Telford gang saved a victims phone numer under the "name" of blowjob2.

The Oxford gang branded a 12 year old victim with the initials of her "owner".

A member of the Newcastle gang bragged that "All white women are good for one thing, for men like me to f*** and use as trash."

These crimes were attacked by members of an ethnic group that humiliated, dehumanized and degraded their English victims. You cannot diminish or dismiss the sheer level of ethnic hatred that motivated the criminals to pretend to be offended with the comparison between these acts and those of wartime sexual violence. If you can explain how a man of one ethnic group branding a 12 year old girl of another ethnic group is not serious sexual violence between those groups in your eyes, then be my guest.

UrbanSprawl

bubblypop wrote: »

Sexual violence and rape in conflict is a war crime. It is a tool of war. I never for a second said that wars do not start because of different ethnic backgrounds.

lets not import their war happy days for a few months masks off!!

Wibbs wrote: »

Eh... I hate to break it to you and remind you of the sweep of human history, but war and war crimes are regularly based on different ethnic backgrounds in conflict. Along with resources it's the primary feature and reason for war and war crimes in the first place.

Sexual violence and rape in conflict is a war crime. It is a tool of war. I never for a second said that wars do not start because of different ethnic backgrounds.

Ten of Swords

Swindled do not post in this thread again

Wibbs

bubblypop wrote: »

Listen stop with this now.

You tried to make out that sexual violence in conflict and rapes as war crimes were somehow based on ethnic backgrounds, they are not.

Eh... I hate to break it to you and remind you of the sweep of human history, but war and war crimes are regularly based on different ethnic backgrounds in conflict. Along with resources it's the primary feature and reason for war and war crimes in the first place.

Wibbs wrote: »

Do these gangs target Muslim girls and women? Simple question. Yes, or no? They apparently clearly see a fundamental difference, but you can't?

Perhaps you missed the part where I was talking about the victims of war crimes?
the gang rapes on English girls are not the same as sexual violence in conflicts.

Different conversation

Wibbs

bubblypop wrote: »

Ethnicity of offenders and victims is an aside, this sexual violence happens no matter what the ethnicity of either.

Do these gangs target Muslim girls and women? Simple question. Yes, or no? They apparently clearly see a fundamental difference, but you can't?

I doubt you'd express nearly the same disgust at someone pointing out while most adherents were fine the Catholic Church culture and hierarchy helped enable child abuse throughout the world and especially in Ireland and that there was something fundamentally wrong within that culture and it needed adressing and stamping out. Because it did.

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Yeah, but you’re calling it whataboutery because you were trying to jam complex issues into a very narrow narrative to fulfil an agenda. So let’s say we made a Femme de la Rue documentary with hidden cameras chronicling the experience of young women in Ireland in Dublin clubs — what do you think we would see? Touching, grabbing, lewd language, lads trying to talk drunker girls into coming home with them — and perhaps things that are even more disturbing.

The inevitable debate would then unfold, with a big thread on Boards, about rape culture among men, men being perverts, should men be put under curfew etc etc etc. And then I imagine that some of the people who want to push narrow agendas when it comes to multiculturalism suddenly accuse others of pushing a narrow agenda. “Not all men are bad”, “most men are good”, “People only ever focus on the bad things that men do and never the good which gives an unfair impression”— those are all the things that would be said, right? And those would be fair statements — but replace the word “men” there with “Muslim migrants” and suddenly its happy clappy wokeism and snowflakes playing down the issues.

Oh there is much to that indeed. However there would also be some of those same "happy clappy woke snowflakes"(I hit all the buzzwords there

) viewing the Irish footage quick to rant about a "rape culture" happening in Ireland because of the "patriarchy". Hell some already do. The same cohort tend to be quick leveling accusations of racism, transphobia, homophobia, whateverphobia you're having yourself on Western societies, but are also quick to back off, even call racism when similar stuff is seen as factors in other cultures, the browner the culture the more the backing off and accusations of racism. It doesn't mean there isn't some racism involved of course, but that's confusing the issues involved too.

especially in the context where multicultural places like Europe and America remain some of the most tolerant and liberal places on Earth.

Not even some, they're pretty much it on those scores. However we have enclaves of the intolerant and illiberal within those societies among the natives. We have fully homegrown racists, homophobes chauvinists etc. We patted ourselves on the back for the "landslide victory" in the SSM and Choice referendums, only it wasn't a landslide when a third voted nope to both. And we hear about these internal failings enough and the reasons for it are aimed at the society itself. Yet enclaves of the non native intolerant and illiberal tend to get a freer ride and more excuses trotted out by the same people pointing out the splinter in our eyes. That's the issue I have.

ArthurDayne wrote: »

Yeah, and in Ireland we would absolutely NEVER tolerate the mutilation of a child’s genitals, right?

Wrong. The mutilation of a male baby’s genitals is perfectly legal and available in Ireland, and you can have their foreskin cut off — a thing that is often done for religious and / or cultural reasons. There are also some hygienic reasons for doing it, but the baby doesn’t get to wait until he’s old enough to decide for himself whether his penis gets mutilated.

But that’s the acceptable Western version of slicing a baby’s genitals, not like the foreign culture of slicing a baby’s genitals.

+1000 I'd ban that for non medical reasons in the morning if I could. And yep it demonstrates a cultural bias. No more so than in the US where the majority of baby boys have their mickeys snipped. I remember an Oprah Winfrey show where she was highlighting FGM and fair play, but on another show she was pimping some makeup product that was based on research on discarded foreskins and there was a grand oul chuckle. Oh and in before the "FGM is so much more evil, there's no comparison!!!" replies from some; would you be OK with a cultural medical procedure that removed exactly the same corresponding tissue in girls? Of course you wouldn't.

TomTomTim

bubblypop wrote: »

Sexual violence against women is recognised as a war crime and a crime against humanity.
There has always been sexual violence and rape in war and conflicts. Please do not try to make this violence against women about ethnicity. Ethnicity of offenders and victims is an aside, this sexual violence happens no matter what the ethnicity of either.
Do not try to compare rape gangs in the UK with conflict based sexual violence.

bubblypop wrote: »

No, you will make a comparison even though it is not correct.
It's disgusting to use war crimes and conflict based violence against women for your agenda.

“The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- Fyodor Dostoyevsky

Sand wrote: »

It is an entirely valid comparison. The targeting of English girls for humiliation and sexual violence by non-indigenous gangs to sexual violence in ethnic conflict is an entirely valid comparison to make. Get over it.

It's really not.
I'm assuming from your posts that you don't have any experience with war crimes victims.
Sexual violence is present in all conflict, not just 'ethnic conflict '
Rape and sexual crimes are used as a tool of war, humiliation and power, against women and men.
Please leave it

bubblypop wrote: »

No, you will make a comparison even though it is not correct.
It's disgusting to use war crimes and conflict based violence against women for your agenda.

It is an entirely valid comparison. The targeting of English girls for humiliation and sexual violence by non-indigenous gangs to sexual violence in ethnic conflict is an entirely valid comparison to make. Get over it.

Sand wrote: »

No, I think I will make the comparison even if it doesn't suit your simplistic narrative.

No, you will make a comparison even though it is not correct.
It's disgusting to use war crimes and conflict based violence against women for your agenda.