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Forced to work from home

Padre_Pio

Just got word today that work is downsizing their offices and the COVID work from home policy is going to be a near-permanent WHF policy.

Basically, the new office will only have hot desks, maybe half as many as there are staff. Employees have to book a desk in advance if they need to come into the office, but your permanent desk is expected to be in your own home.

There's uproar from certain people, but the response is basically put up and shut up.
Personally, there's no mention of home working in my contract. I was looking forward to getting back into the office and I barely have the space for a desk where I'm living at the moment, never mind a full setup.

Anyone have any experience of this? Places like Google and Facebook have said they're looking at similar policies. Any ideas how that went down with staff?

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Padre_Pio

ineedeuro wrote: »

Any chance you asked your manager or HR if you could get a desk? :P

You asked this twice before. I answered twice already.
Post 25.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Aww you got more thanks than me.

i liked your post, you're winning now.

ineedeuro

Padre_Pio wrote: »

This thread is gas. Almost every conversation is like:
"My employer is forcing me to give over part of my bedroom as an office space! What can I do?"

"Move somewhere larger or buy a house"

"But I don't want to, I like going into the office"

"What? You freak. Working from home is great! You don't have to do the standard 3 hour commute we all have to do"

"But I don't have a commute. Like a sensible person I live near where I work. Besides, I miss face to face interactions with my colleagues".

"What? Colleagues are d*ckheads. Your only friends should be ones you specifically choose through predetermined common interests. Anyone who has any social interactions at work is bad at their job and socially inept".

"Ok, this isn't answering my specific question though, is there anything I can do to improve my situation".

"No. Suck is up buttercup, working from home is here to stay. It's the future. It's also the past. You're saving so much money from your non-existent commute, and that childcare you don't have. Anyone who likes working face to face with other people is a loser and a dinosaur."

Any chance you asked your manager or HR if you could get a desk? :P

[Deleted User]

Padre_Pio wrote: »

This thread is gas. Almost every conversation is like:
"My employer is forcing me to give over part of my bedroom as an office space! What can I do?"

"Move somewhere larger or buy a house"

"But I don't want to, I like going into the office"

"What? You freak. Working from home is great! You don't have to do the standard 3 hour commute we all have to do"

"But I don't have a commute. Like a sensible person I live near where I work. Besides, I miss face to face interactions with my colleagues".

"What? Colleagues are d*ckheads. Your only friends should be ones you specifically choose through predetermined common interests. Anyone who has any social interactions at work is bad at their job and socially inept".

"Ok, this isn't answering my specific question though, is there anything I can do to improve my situation".

"No. Suck is up buttercup, working from home is here to stay. It's the future. It's also the past. You're saving so much money from your non-existent commute, and that childcare you don't have. Anyone who likes working face to face with other people is a loser and a dinosaur."

Aww you got more thanks than me.

Padre_Pio

Deleted User wrote: »

This thread is gas. Almost every conversation is like:
:rolleyes:

This thread is gas. Almost every conversation is like:
"My employer is forcing me to give over part of my bedroom as an office space! What can I do?"

"Move somewhere larger or buy a house"

"But I don't want to, I like going into the office"

"What? You freak. Working from home is great! You don't have to do the standard 3 hour commute we all have to do"

"But I don't have a commute. Like a sensible person I live near where I work. Besides, I miss face to face interactions with my colleagues".

"What? Colleagues are d*ckheads. Your only friends should be ones you specifically choose through predetermined common interests. Anyone who has any social interactions at work is bad at their job and socially inept".

"Ok, this isn't answering my specific question though, is there anything I can do to improve my situation".

"No. Suck is up buttercup, working from home is here to stay. It's the future. It's also the past. You're saving so much money from your non-existent commute, and that childcare you don't have. Anyone who likes working face to face with other people is a loser and a dinosaur."

[Deleted User]

jakiah wrote: »

Business itself is a social activity. Business is predicated on relationship building - sales, customer relations, customer service, conferences & industry events and networking have been central for years. People are talking about the loss of this stuff when everyone is WFH, not your need to talk about the latest TV show in the office. If you lose the ability to go to a customer site and do a workshop, or a sales presentation and take the customer out to lunch afterwards there is no difference between you and a whole planet full of competitors on zoom calls.

I bet lots of customers would prefer zoom calls in future because their employees won’t all be in the office. More call for expertise and less for smarm.

[Deleted User]

BonnieSituation wrote: »

All that just to say "like it or lump it!"

As soon as we start to reopen fully towards the end of the year, this zeitgeist love in for WFH will wear thin for most.

What’s a Zeitgeist love in?

Plenty of people don’t want to commute. Others like the office. Companies will handle both.

[Deleted User]

newuser99999 wrote: »

You could’ve found a work from home or hybrid role before the pandemic. Nothing was “forced” upon you.

Good point. I guess the same applies to you now. Go find a job where there's no WFH if you don't like it.

[Deleted User]

This thread is gas. Almost every conversation is like:

"I think a hybrid model will be good"

"That's all well and good for people who like working 100% WFH, but I want to be in the office."

"No, a hybrid model is both office and home based."

"That's fine for you anti social WFH types, but I want to see my colleagues"

"But you can see your colleagues in the hybrid model, since you still attend the office"

"Oh, you 100% WFH types just working at home and never going out. I want to see the office. We're being forced to work at home 100% of the time."

"No, you can still attend the office and in many cases you'll have mandatory attendance in the office, depending on the rota."

"Nope, I'll never accept 100% WFH"

:rolleyes:

BonnieSituation

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I disagree with your opinion that you stated as fact.

Good for you I guess?

newuser99999

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No need to be so inflexible. I'm merely advocating a solution where all parties get a bit of what they want. Or would you rather your preference forced upon me, like we had before March 2020?

You could’ve found a work from home or hybrid role before the pandemic. Nothing was “forced” upon you.

[Deleted User]

BonnieSituation wrote: »

All that just to say "like it or lump it!"

As soon as we start to reopen fully towards the end of the year, this zeitgeist love in for WFH will wear thin for most.

I disagree with your opinion that you stated as fact.

BonnieSituation

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The shift towards a hybrid model had already begun before Covid. The pandemic just accelerated this process. It's a brilliant innovation and one that will improve the lives of millions of workers in Europe.

It's happening whether you like it or not, so why not embrace it?

Since some of you love the office so much, you're probably fans of empty inspirational quotes that litter your antiquated workspace. So here is one for you.

Improvise. Adapt. Overcome.

All that just to say "like it or lump it!"

As soon as we start to reopen fully towards the end of the year, this zeitgeist love in for WFH will wear thin for most.

[Deleted User]

The shift towards a hybrid model had already begun before Covid. The pandemic just accelerated this process. It's a brilliant innovation and one that will improve the lives of millions of workers in Europe.

It's happening whether you like it or not, so why not embrace it?

Since some of you love the office so much, you're probably fans of empty inspirational quotes that litter your antiquated workspace. So here is one for you.

Improvise. Adapt. Overcome.

[Deleted User]

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's very much your employer's business: if they have an employee who lives in France, for example, then they (the employer) has to comply with the French tax and employment laws for that person. So they automatically have to give you more annual leave, etc .

Only if the employee registers as a French worker. Otherwise how would tax authorities know. Of course some companies may worry about it but it’s probably not something that the average joe has to worry about.

The Irish revenue doesn’t want to investigate Irish taxpayers who might have stayed in France a bit too long, and the French authorities would hardly know about it. You don’t have to tell them you are there for 3 months anyway.

There’s also the idea of domicile. If you don’t stay anywhere for 180 days in a year the tax authorities in countries where you have a house, are from, have family in, were born in will determine domicile. That works for the op.

[Deleted User]

JustAThought wrote: »

I’ve just walked into someones garden and found them crying over the birds eating the worms that came up in the rain. They should be WFH but are obviously derailed a bit. People like other peoples company and go a bit loola when left too long alone or left looking at their own dark walls by themselves for too many hours/weeks/months. WFM might suit some but a balance or office only suits others. No need for people to be so scathing & cruel about it all.

No need to be so inflexible. I'm merely advocating a solution where all parties get a bit of what they want. Or would you rather your preference forced upon me, like we had before March 2020?

Padre_Pio

ineedeuro wrote: »

People should have a clear work life and a personal life.

Says who?
People should have whatever life they choose.

ineedeuro

JustAThought wrote: »

I’ve just walked into someones garden and found them crying over the birds eating the worms that came up in the rain. They should be WFH but are obviously derailed a bit. People like other peoples company and go a bit loola when left too long alone or left looking at their own dark walls by themselves for too many hours/weeks/months. WFM might suit some but a balance or office only suits others. No need for people to be so scathing & cruel about it all.

Nobody is been cruel. It's a discussion forum

Plus if that story is true then WFH or not that person has bigger issues.

People should have a clear work life and a personal life.

a_squirrelman

JustAThought wrote: »

I’ve just walked into someones garden and found them crying over the birds eating the worms that came up in the rain. They should be WFH but are obviously derailed a bit. People like other peoples company and go a bit loola when left too long alone or left looking at their own dark walls by themselves for too many hours/weeks/months. WFM might suit some but a balance or office only suits others. No need for people to be so scathing & cruel about it all.

Cruel? :eek: But who is being cruel?

It's been said a million times on here and other threads. Those of us who want to work from home DON'T CARE if those who want to work in the office go to the office.

Mic 1972

newuser99999 wrote: »

If you are in Ireland for 183 days or more you need to pay tax here.

It depends on the country that you move to. Some have agreements with Ireland, some you’d have to pay double taxation.

Double taxation is another thing. If you live in a foreign country for more than 6 months regardless of the tax agreement you can't be employed by an Irish based company

JustAThought

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I've already experienced both, so I know how it will turn out. I can't wait.

I’ve just walked into someones garden and found them crying over the birds eating the worms that came up in the rain. They should be WFH but are obviously derailed a bit. People like other peoples company and go a bit loola when left too long alone or left looking at their own dark walls by themselves for too many hours/weeks/months. WFM might suit some but a balance or office only suits others. No need for people to be so scathing & cruel about it all.

[Deleted User]

Padre_Pio wrote: »

As I said before, you can get the best of both worlds, or just as easily get the worst of both worlds.

I've already experienced both, so I know how it will turn out. I can't wait.

Padre_Pio

Deleted User wrote: »

It sounds like hybrid is the best case for all then. Everyone gets a bit of what they want.

As I said before, you can get the best of both worlds, or just as easily get the worst of both worlds.

[Deleted User]

Padre_Pio wrote: »

I don't think people should be treated like Luddites for wanting to work in an office and meet people, collaborate face to face, socialise, go for lunch and interact like humans should interact.

I get that WFH is preferable for people, who based on responses in this thread, own a home with adequate space, have families, have long commutes, seem to dislike their co-workers, have enough of a social circle that they don't want/need more friends.

It sounds like hybrid is the best case for all then. Everyone gets a bit of what they want.

Padre_Pio

VG31 wrote: »

I'm fully in favour of flexibility and personal choice when it comes to WFH, but there's a cohort of 100% WFH posters here who are condescending and dismissive to people who actually don't want full time WFH. There's an impression some give of regarding them as wasters or losers.

I don't think people should be treated like Luddites for wanting to work in an office and meet people, collaborate face to face, socialise, go for lunch and interact like humans should interact.

I get that WFH is preferable for people, who based on responses in this thread, own a home with adequate space, have families, have long commutes, seem to dislike their co-workers, have enough of a social circle that they don't want/need more friends.

VG31

I'm fully in favour of flexibility and personal choice when it comes to WFH, but there's a cohort of 100% WFH posters here who are condescending and dismissive to people who actually don't want full time WFH. There's an impression some give of regarding them as wasters or losers.

VG31

KaneToad wrote: »

I have zero interest in the social aspects of work/learning. I interact socially with people of my choosing not with people I am randomly thrown together with in a work environment.

I find this a bit ridiculous to be honest. You could make the exact same argument with school and college. You're obviously not going to get along with everyone but assuming you have at least some interest in the area you work in you're bound to have common interests or at least get along with some people.

Like many people, most of my friends are from school or college where I was just "randomly thrown together" with them. Remote working and learning in particular is fine when you have well established friendships but before then how to you expect people to actually meet others? Do you only want to socialise with people with through sports teams, clubs or other specific interest groups?

jakiah

Business itself is a social activity. Business is predicated on relationship building - sales, customer relations, customer service, conferences & industry events and networking have been central for years. People are talking about the loss of this stuff when everyone is WFH, not your need to talk about the latest TV show in the office. If you lose the ability to go to a customer site and do a workshop, or a sales presentation and take the customer out to lunch afterwards there is no difference between you and a whole planet full of competitors on zoom calls.

Padre_Pio

ineedeuro wrote: »

People keep talking about office as a social place.
A huge amount of issues for companies comes from relationships in offices. The office bully taking a dislike to someone and spreading rumours etc.
I would expect a lot of HR departments are cheering that some people are now locked at home and nowhere near the rest of the employees

I don't know where you worked before, but I've never worked anywhere that colleagues didn't socialise outside work, go for pints on Fridays, have sports groups and fantasy leagues, organise team-building exercises that were an excuse for a piss-up.
There's a good amount of people who've gotten married to colleagues too.

I miss all of that.

floorpie

ineedeuro wrote: »

People keep talking about office as a social place.
A huge amount of issues for companies comes from relationships in offices. The office bully taking a dislike to someone and spreading rumours etc.
I would expect a lot of HR departments are cheering that some people are now locked at home and nowhere near the rest of the employees

It isn't talked about as a social place, it is one, whether people here like it or not. You spend a big portion of your life there and in the urban centres that 100s thousands ppl also go to every day.

On the other hand, working at home alone for a big portion of your life is a social aberration and will likely have other ramifications for HR depts (check how many mails your HR dept have sent out about "wellbeing" this year).

ineedeuro

People keep talking about office as a social place.
A huge amount of issues for companies comes from relationships in offices. The office bully taking a dislike to someone and spreading rumours etc.
I would expect a lot of HR departments are cheering that some people are now locked at home and nowhere near the rest of the employees