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Child Item

Clearing rushes

johnytwentyten

Hi,

My family have a two acre field which is totally covered in rushes, we want to clean it up and looking for some advice as I have no experience in this area,

From googling it, my plan was to strim the rushes, wait for regrowth, then spray using a mix of mortone and presto, using a quad sprayer (as this is what's recommended in the mortone instructions), I know the field would need to be drained properly to really sort the issue but just want to clean it up first,

Does this sound ok? And if so, how soon could you let animals into the field after spraying, my sister was planning on getting a few donkeys,

Thanks in advance for any replies,

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_Brian

Strumming two acres of heavy rushes is a tough job.

It would be substantially better job to get a contractor in and mulch them. This turns them into chaff and they rot quicker. This allows the grass up better to compete with the rushes.

The11Duff

Get your rushes topped or mulched. Then spray the new green fresh ones and then fire out a couple of bags of fertilizers to encourage the grass. May have to repeat next year but you will have a lot of them killed off

Hard Knocks

The11Duff wrote: »

Get your rushes topped or mulched. Then spray the new green fresh ones and then fire out a couple of bags of fertilizers to encourage the grass. May have to repeat next year but you will have a lot of them killed off

No harm 2 bags of gran lime too

MeadowMaker

I planted some alder trees to soak up the water with the added benefit that they also release nitrogen into the soil. Good for the habitat too.

Bass Reeves

Spraying rushers only hides the issues for a few years. Continuous cutting will weaken them. If you can top twice a year you will get much better control longterm. I never heard of using Presto on rushers. Presto is used on surfaces to prevent seeds germinating instead if simizine which is no longer available.

Fertility and lime. P&K is very important especially P. I get the so tested so as to see what to spread. I be using 18-6-12 or 10-10-20 rather than straight N. But you will have to keep grass grazed as well. On lime as it's only two acres I be using granlime and spread 100 kgs/ acre each year for the next 4-5 years and continue 50 kgs/ acre after that

adne

Presto is used as the sticking agent

RobinBanks

How long would ye normally wait before cutting rushes that were sprayed.

_Brian

RobinBanks wrote: »

How long would ye normally wait before cutting rushes that were sprayed.

Wouldn’t rush at all. We don’t cut till they are well dead.

Kevhog1988

Take a look at this guys youtube. He posts some great videos on reclaiming land
https://youtube.com/channel/UCbnhKennXJ-TIuHSRKWJcLg

Hard Knocks

Kevhog1988 wrote: »

Take a look at this guys youtube. He posts some great videos on reclaiming land
https://youtube.com/channel/UCbnhKennXJ-TIuHSRKWJcLg

Is he based in Leitrim?

Kevhog1988

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Is he based in Leitrim?

Yeah i think so.

johnytwentyten

Didnt have a chance to get on here for a few days but thanks for all the great advice, as mentioned the field would need to be grazed, would a few donkeys keep a field of that size tidy?

SpraySafely

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Spraying rushers only hides the issues for a few years.
Continuous cutting will weaken them.

Not sure what you are saying here?

Spraying rushes will kill them. However while there is seed in the ground another crop will follow. Spraying (or licking) is the only way to get rid of rushes. You will never really 100% get rid of them but should get it down to a very minimal amount which you can easily keep on top of. The seed can stay in the ground for a long time.

Topping is great to avoid them taking over, but won't kill them. Cutting to the butt might, have seen varying results. Topping after they have gone to seed is too late.

Best job is top, wait 2-3 weeks depending on growth rates. Let cattle eat grass off. Then spray as per instructions, or lick although probably have to wait more than 2-3 weeks for a high enough crop. Ensure to keep livestock off for as long as required.

Can do this twice a year.

Sugarbowl

How long should cattle be kept away from sprayed rushes?

SpraySafely

Sugarbowl wrote: »

How long should cattle be kept away from sprayed rushes?

This would be specified on the label of whatever product you are using.

Jb1989

SpraySafely wrote: »

This would be specified on the label of whatever product you are using.

Tight topping to kill them is useless on anyway heavy ground We topped for years with a rotary mower, skinning the ground, to no good. Took the sprayer to do the trick.

I personally have no fear of spraying mcpa based spray for rushes with cattle in the field, if the scenario arises, only snag there would be if rag weed in it, as it may turn sweet while dying.

Dock stuff and other weeds have a withholding period tho aright.

SpraySafely

Jb1989 wrote: »

I personally have no fear of spraying mcpa based spray for rushes with cattle in the field, if the scenario arises, only snag there would be if rag weed in it, as it may turn sweet while dying.

Whether or not you have "fear" or not is irrelevant.

Thankfully the majority of farmers do follow manufacturers instructions and realise they have a responsibility as food producers to ensure the safety of food produce.

A disgraceful attitude and usually common with those that complain about all "the european red tape".

Jb1989

SpraySafely wrote: »

Whether or not you have "fear" or not is irrelevant.

Thankfully the majority of farmers do follow manufacturers instructions and realise they have a responsibility as food producers to ensure the safety of food produce.

A disgraceful attitude and usually common with those that complain about all "the european red tape".

Do you mind looking at the photo I've uploaded, particularly the bit in the red circle.

SpraySafely

Jb1989 wrote: »

I personally have no fear of spraying mcpa based spray for rushes with cattle in the field

I think this speaks for itself.

Fair enough if you are using a product without a witholding period, but I don't think that applies to the actual spraying time.

Happy to be proven wrong, although I would never do it myself. I mean why bother with the mask ourselves and then just go out and spray over the cattle.

The mind boggles. Never mind the fact they would be in the way and affect output.

Jb1989

SpraySafely wrote: »

I think this speaks for itself.

Fair enough if you are using a product without a witholding period, but I don't think that applies to the actual spraying time.

Happy to be proven wrong, although I would never do it myself. I mean why bother with the mask ourselves and then just go out and spray over the cattle.

The mind boggles. Never mind the fact they would be in the way and affect output.

I commented to your last post with evidence that I'm happy with, tho you might have a counter argument, which I'm open to hearing.

When you spray on the country, there can be a lot of farmers that may want the bottom of a field done, as the top may be rush free, but doesnt suit them to move cattle there and then.

Ive evidence on the label and evidence from trial and error, havent noticed of any trouble to livestock in that period.

SpraySafely

Jb1989 wrote: »

I commented to your last post with evidence that I'm happy with, tho you might have a counter argument, which I'm open to hearing.

When you spray on the country, there can be a lot of farmers that may want the bottom of a field done, as the top may be rush free, but doesnt suit them to move cattle there and then.

Ive evidence on the label and evidence from trial and error, havent noticed of any trouble to livestock in that period.

Ok fair enough.

I've always followed a 2 week witholding period for MCPA and will continue to do so. There is a reason it is well controlled. Not sure you label is as clear as you think, but it sounds like you have your mind made up.

Jb1989

SpraySafely wrote: »

Ok fair enough.

I've always followed a 2 week witholding period for MCPA and will continue to do so. There is a reason it is well controlled. Not sure you label is as clear as you think, but it sounds like you have your mind made up.

I'm genuinely open to criticism, I'd like to know if I'm doing wrong for my sake and the livestock sake.

Can you find me evidence on the label to say where its toxic for cattle to be in the field at spraying time, for mcpa based product?

MeadowMaker

SpraySafely wrote: »

Ok fair enough.

I've always followed a 2 week witholding period for MCPA and will continue to do so. There is a reason it is well controlled. Not sure you label is as clear as you think, but it sounds like you have your mind made up.

I am a certified sprayer and he is following the label correctly.

You are guided by your ‘hunch’, he is following the label.

Jb1989

MeadowMaker wrote: »

I am a qualified sprayer and he is following the label correctly.

You are guided by your ‘hunch’, he is following the label.

I am open to correction from any person, but thanks for clarifying, meadow maker.

Hard Knocks

The best I saw is a farm I pass
They used a single chop harvester followed by fertilizer and spray
It looked a rough farm but looks great now

johnytwentyten

Hard Knocks wrote: »

The best I saw is a farm I pass
They used a single chop harvester followed by fertilizer and spray
It looked a rough farm but looks great now

Just to understand they put down fertilizer before spraying? If the fertilizer is to help the grass compete with the rushes won't the spray affect the grass as well as the rushes?

charlesodowd

As a professional user, I can confirm a 14 day witholding period is recommended when using MCPA based pesticides.

This was confirmed to me this morning by a rep from a major Irish Chemical supplier (based in Galway), as reading some of the posts here had me questioning my own information.

monseiur

Jb1989 wrote: »

I commented to your last post with evidence that I'm happy with, tho you might have a counter argument, which I'm open to hearing.

When you spray on the country, there can be a lot of farmers that may want the bottom of a field done, as the top may be rush free, but doesnt suit them to move cattle there and then.

Ive evidence on the label and evidence from trial and error, havent noticed of any trouble to livestock in that period.

When spot spraying in a field with stock the secret is to add a trace of, say, Jeys Fluid or similar to the mix, that's foul smelling to cattle. Bye the time it's washed away the area sprayed will be safe to graze again.

Bass Reeves

SpraySafely wrote: »

Not sure what you are saying here?

Spraying rushes will kill them. However while there is seed in the ground another crop will follow. Spraying (or licking) is the only way to get rid of rushes. You will never really 100% get rid of them but should get it down to a very minimal amount which you can easily keep on top of. The seed can stay in the ground for a long time.

Topping is great to avoid them taking over, but won't kill them. Cutting to the butt might, have seen varying results. Topping after they have gone to seed is too late.

Best job is top, wait 2-3 weeks depending on growth rates. Let cattle eat grass off. Then spray as per instructions, or lick although probably have to wait more than 2-3 weeks for a high enough crop. Ensure to keep livestock off for as long as required.

Can do this twice a year.

Spraying or licking will not get rid of rushers unless continually used. Cutting will weaken any weed if done often enough. Now on some very wed land that can be an issue. However on that type of ground spraying will struggle as well

Most lads only cut rushes once a year. At the he start you need to cut 3-4 times a year to weaken them. Ideally bales up the bulky first cut and dispose of it, a mulcher is not as effective as removal but it is preferable to letting tuskers just sit on the ground smothering the grass regrowth. Then cut as often as possible for rest of the year.

The later the last cut the better of you can get into the field in late September or early October in a dry Autumn great. If you get hard frost when the rush root is open and cut tight with no regrowth it really set them back.

After 2-3 years just keep them topped 2-3 times a year. When they are weak like this continually cutting keeps them weak as well cattle will eat them if they make up a small percentage of the sward and are young and soft regrowths.

There is a huge push to ban MCPA at present it may happen in the next few years so lads will need to figure out ways to control rushers without it.

Other factors to help control them.is soil fertility. There was s no point in getting rid of them if the grass has not enough nutrients to grow. Access to nutrients is controlled by PH. PH on wet ground is alway a battle. Ground lime can be hard to apply and lime loss during the winter is very high. Historically out grandparents or great grandparents used burnt lime on this type of ground. There is a product called Growmax, it a high PH granular burnt lime. It rises pH very fast. I say it would be idea on ground like this applied as early as possible in the spring it would rise the PH of the ground very fast and allow efficiency of nutrients to increase.

P&K would be critical and should be applied as early as possible in the year. For a lot of this type of land that means slurry may not be optimal unless it can be spread in April/May. Use of lighter machinery such as Quads and mane umbilical systems on tractors with wider tyres helps prevent compaction

Drainage may be a long-term solution but the above will still be needed

Hard Knocks

johnytwentyten wrote: »

Just to understand they put down fertilizer before spraying? If the fertilizer is to help the grass compete with the rushes won't the spray affect the grass as well as the rushes?

I don’t know which way the fertilizer and spray went
All I was told is you need both for the grass to get ahead of the rush