What are your views on Multiculturalism in Ireland? - Threadbanned User List in OP

bobbysands81 wrote: »

This is utter rubbish and it’s stuff like this that plays into people’s fears.

I worked where this was exactly the case, and you yourself boasted about the many illegals working in care homes that you know about.

Annasopra

Swindled wrote: »

So the estimates are false, and no one will ever do it again . . . lol

Your claims are false

20,000 have not been waived through
It will be a once off time limited scheme

Swindled wrote: »

It is like feck, I've seen employers hand them out like snuff at a wake if they get the smell of cheap exploitable labour, and 20,000 illegals were rubber stamped this year alone, no questions asked, no background checks done. No need of Visa's.

You just post lies.
All rubbish in this post

bobbysands81

Swindled wrote: »

It is like feck, I've seen employers hand them out like snuff at a wake if they get the smell of cheap exploitable labour, and 20,000 illegals were rubber stamped this year alone, no questions asked, no background checks done. No need of Visa's.

This is utter rubbish and it’s stuff like this that plays into people’s fears.

This post is a complete lie and lacks even the most basic understanding of immigration into the State.

bubblypop wrote: »

Wow. What sort of a shocker is this!!!
This is said like it is some kind of a bad thing. Of course refugees come from outside the EU, EU citizens have the right to move to another EU state.

refugees . . lol

Annasopra wrote: »

You really dont know what you are talking about.

A The scheme has not been implemented yet so your continuous claims 20,000 have been waived through are false
B You are now claiming this will be an ongoing annual scheme which is false

So the estimates are false, and no one will ever do it again . . . lol

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Mass immigration, no... but where are the majority of refugees coming from? Outside the EU.
.

Wow. What sort of a shocker is this!!!
This is said like it is some kind of a bad thing. Of course refugees come from outside the EU, EU citizens have the right to move to another EU state.

bobbysands81

nthclare wrote: »

Immigration suits the middle class so called liberals.
Under the guise of caring, what they're really doing is giving people jobs, with **** wage's therefore undermining the immigrant and undermining the natives because they won't work for **** pay.

So don't believe these vankers and so called woke plebs who are all for immigration etc

They exploit the vulnerable people because the Irish won't allow themselves to be exploited.

Of all the non-EU nationals that came to Ireland to work last year do people know what occupation topped the list? Anyone know what occupation came second?

Doctors topped the list.

Nurses were second.

Both added together accounted for nearly one third of all employment permits issued. ICT jobs, mostly highly paid roles, accounted for almost a further third.

Pesky highly paid foreigners coming over here and adding value to our society.

Annasopra

Swindled wrote: »

Effectively they have as that's the estimate of who will be granted it this year alone, never mind how many every year from now on once it becomes common knowledge.

You really dont know what you are talking about.

A The scheme has not been implemented yet so your continuous claims 20,000 have been waived through are false
B You are now claiming this will be an ongoing annual scheme which is false

Chips Lovell wrote: »

17,000 to 20,000 is the estimate of the number illegal migrants currently in the state, not the estimate of who'll be granted it this year.

Yeah, no one else will never dare come again once they hear that.

Annasopra

Swindled wrote: »

It is like feck, I've seen employers hand them out like snuff at a wake if they get the smell of cheap exploitable labour, and 20,000 illegals were rubber stamped this year alone, no questions asked, no background checks done. No need of Visa's.

You keep saying this but what you are referring to has not actually happened as yet and we dont actually know how many will be in the scheme.

Swindled wrote: »

Effectively they have as that's the estimate of who will be granted it this year alone, never mind how many every year from now on once it becomes common knowledge.

17,000 to 20,000 is the estimate of the number illegal migrants currently in the state, not the estimate of who'll be granted it this year.

Chips Lovell wrote: »

I'd be very surprised if it didn't happen. What I was taking issue with was the suggestion that all of the estimated 20,0000 illegals had already been granted permission to remain without any checks.

Effectively they have as that's the estimate of who will be granted it this year alone, never mind how many every year from now on once it becomes common knowledge.

I'd be very surprised if it didn't happen. What I was taking issue with was the suggestion that all of the estimated 20,0000 illegals had already been granted permission to remain without any checks.

Chips Lovell wrote: »

I have to admire the clairvoyance in knowing how many applicants will be accepted and what checks will be done, considering the scheme hasn't even been put before the cabinet, let alone be opened for applications.

They've been gathering support for it through repeated reports on RTE, and social media. Getting people used to the idea before implementing it. It's going to happen, one way or another.

As for how many will be accepted? No idea, although, I expect most of them will be, barring those with past criminal offenses.

Chips Lovell wrote: »

I have to admire the clairvoyance in knowing how many applicants will be accepted and what checks will be done, considering the scheme hasn't even been put before the cabinet, let alone be opened for applications.

yeah it'll only be a few dozen every year from now on right enough . . .lol
How stupid do you and the PR merchants take Irish people for ?

Swindled wrote: »

...and 20,000 illegals were rubber stamped this year alone, no questions asked, no background checks done. No need of Visa's.

I have to admire the clairvoyance in knowing how many applicants will be accepted and what checks will be done, considering the scheme hasn't even been put before the cabinet, let alone be opened for applications.

Justin Credible Darts

...............

Chips Lovell wrote: »

There isn't a push for mass immigration from outside the EU. As Wibbs pointed out, the vast majority of immigration is from EU countries.

Mass immigration, no... but where are the majority of refugees coming from? Outside the EU.

The issue is that the governments acceptance of refugees, and others, steps outside of the normal immigration controls. And while Ireland isn't in receipt of that many non-EU migrants, as France and other tighten their borders, that demand which switch to other EU nations such as Ireland. Since the EU isn't implementing anti-immigration policies applicable to all member states.

So, it makes sense to be prepared for it.

It's pretty hard to get a visa for someone from outside the EU and anyone who gets here outside of the work visa regime, it's very much despite of not because Irish/EU immigration policy.

Depends who is sponsoring/organising the visa applications. There have been examples in the past of NGOs getting involved in easing the application process for migrants coming from certain countries. I've no idea of the numbers involved, but when we have so many NGOs whose sole existence is based on minority groups or migrants, they have a stake in bringing more in.

It's hard for individuals seeking to come to Europe (without decent education), but organisations tend to have more resources available for such applications, besides having legal agents who know the system quite well.

jmayo

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Well Ireland has been multicultural for centuries and was built on multiculturalism. Natives, Celts, Vikings, Normans. Some more is grand.

Ehh what a coincidence those were invasions that resulted in the deaths of the natives already here.

Then again I often term those cheerleading for everyone and anyone to be allowed in come what may, as no better than quislings who hate their own.

twinytwo wrote: »

Lord above, you are either seriously deluded or delibertly ignorant... Im not sure which is worse.

Also someone who has possibly made a career out of helping those less fortunate, etc, etc, etc.

It is now some kind of SOP for the pro multicultural crowd to throw out accusations of racism once tough questions are asked about the benefits of so called multiculturalism for the hosts.
Of course that is after we are told about what new fantastic culinary delights we can enjoy with this multiculturalism.
Oh and how we need them for our future pensions and to help in the HSE.

And that leads to being told about how much they contribute to the revenue pot and all the great jobs they do when really we know that is down to the legal EU citizens or legal VISA carrying immigrants, not the chancer variety of the missing passports that travelled through multiple countries to get here.

twinytwo

Swindled wrote: »

So if we desperately need mass immigration into this country (something I don't believe we do if current Irish birth rates, among the highest in Europe, remain stable / increased, and we done more to help our young people, many of whom have to emigrate and not by choice )

Let's pretend we do, why the big push for mass immigration from outside the EU ? Are Eastern Europeans now not good enough ? (i.e. Black Enough / Muslim enough / LGBT+ enough ), what's the end goal, enclaves like Brixtons ? Rochdales ? (Balbriggan being deemed the "template for Ireland" by likes of Pat Kenny), and Gaeltacht areas as a reservation for the native Irish ?

Because there is no money to be made from EU immigration/legal immigration so you have the government listening to all the NGO's who have skin in the game rather than common sense.

Plus you have the likes of Donnelly who like to consider themselves "humanitarians" :rolleyes:

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

this thread is a complete joke, if we dare to question anything we are liable to be referred to as racists...this is what this thread has descended to.
god forbid we question that as well

Just call out those who do it. Demand specifics. They'll drop it, deflect, and then disappear for a few pages. There's no value in complaining about this, so it's best to let it go. For my own part, I've learned it's better to /ignore certain posters.

(no, mods I'm neither backseating nor directing this at anyone in particular)

The thread is here for those of us who want to discuss multiculturalism. That's enough.

Chips Lovell wrote: »

It's pretty hard to get a visa for someone from outside the EU and anyone who gets here outside of the work visa regime, it's very much despite of not because Irish/EU immigration policy.

It is like feck, I've seen employers hand them out like snuff at a wake if they get the smell of cheap exploitable labour, and 20,000 illegals were rubber stamped this year alone, no questions asked, no background checks done. No need of Visa's.

There isn't a push for mass immigration from outside the EU. As Wibbs pointed out, the vast majority of immigration is from EU countries.

It's pretty hard to get a visa for someone from outside the EU and anyone who gets here outside of the work visa regime, it's very much despite of not because Irish/EU immigration policy.

Wibbs wrote: »

*On the Left of things if one were to look at NGO media, some government missive and latterly even mainstream advertising, one would swear that Ireland has a huge percentage of Black and dark skinned people living here and half of them, the men anyway, appear to be in multiracial couples. If one looks at the Right of things, immigrants and "New Irish" are equally seen as shorthand for Black and dark skinned people. Neither are close to an accurate reflection of the makeup of actual non native Irish people living here. There are around 20-25000 Black Africans living here, but around 400,000 White Europeans living here. Around 16 times the number. Hell, alone there are more Lithuanians than Africans in Ireland. The vast majority of the New Irish are White Europeans.

So if we desperately need mass immigration into this country (something I don't believe we do if current Irish birth rates, among the highest in Europe, remain stable / increased, and we done more to help our young people, many of whom have to emigrate and not by choice )

Let's pretend we do, why the big push for mass immigration from outside the EU ? Are Eastern Europeans now not good enough ? (i.e. Black Enough / Muslim enough / LGBT+ enough ), what's the end goal, enclaves like Brixtons ? Rochdales ? (Balbriggan being deemed the "template for Ireland" by likes of Pat Kenny), and Gaeltacht areas as a reservation for the native Irish ?

Justin Credible Darts

this thread is a complete joke, if we dare to question anything we are liable to be referred to as racists...this is what this thread has descended to.
god forbid we question that as well

Ten of Swords

Thread has gone off topic

If you want to discuss moderation the Help Desk forum is the place to do so, not this thread

Wibbs

The lack of censure when someone is calling another poster a racist is interesting alright and we have seen many many examples of it. Though to be fair to the mods and moderation, of the ban and cards handed out on this very thread, the vast majority of them have been handed out to posters on the pro multicultural side. If you added in the accusations of racism you'd have few of them left standing. And as ever, report such posts. I'd bet that they rarely are. I've seen this in forums I've modded in the past. Posters complain that [insert issue here] gets a free ride, yet I saw few if any reported posts.

Mike Murdock wrote: »

The last, desperate act of those that have lost the argument.

That's been by far the biggest eye opener for me on this thread; I expected a much more robust and cogent defence of the politic, but it's been the quite remarkable lack of argument points in favour of multiculturalism that surprised me. They have boiled down to exoticism for its own sake, charity and the Irish were immigrants too. Add in some inaccurate revisionism about how Ireland was always multicultural and that's pretty much it. What has also surprised is how little it appears the subject and politic has been thought about by those that hold it as such a positive. It's been just taken as an Accepted Truth it seems, with little or no enquiry into it. Taken on faith essentially.

Now I get why it might be for some. To take the as usual simplistic American "right/left" labels I have found those who are more left tend to be more kind, more about society and more open, but more naive, the more right tend to be less kind, more selfish, more about the individual, less open to the new, but more realistic. Both are obsessed with "race", the more exotic the better, just obsessed in a different way*. So the "left" are going to more drawn to the exotic and charity and diversity isn't it just great without really questioning it too deeply.

*On the Left of things if one were to look at NGO media, some government missive and latterly even mainstream advertising, one would swear that Ireland has a huge percentage of Black and dark skinned people living here and half of them, the men anyway, appear to be in multiracial couples. If one looks at the Right of things, immigrants and "New Irish" are equally seen as shorthand for Black and dark skinned people. Neither are close to an accurate reflection of the makeup of actual non native Irish people living here. There are around 20-25000 Black Africans living here, but around 400,000 White Europeans living here. Around 16 times the number. Hell, alone there are more Lithuanians than Africans in Ireland. The vast majority of the New Irish are White Europeans.

Justin Credible Darts

bubblypop wrote: »

Not totally true of me anyway, Wibbs, I do indeed judge things. I can be very judgy!
But I tend to judge behaviour rather then cultures or people. So, individual people rather then a collective.
I believe in the law. I believe in right and wrong. And I believe the world and her problems are not black & white, but varying shades of grey.

I believe that posters issues with immigrants to this country are as a result of government policies, apart from those posters who are actually just racist. Which of course, is not everybody, but there are some.

And if course, immigrants are individuals and just like Irish people, some are work orientated and wish for a better life, and some are criminals and some are lazy.

you believe that some posters on here are racist ?

This is typical of your mindset, just throw out a blanket accusation thinking you wont be called on it.
Who are these racist posters ?....if you believe what you type and are a person of conviction you will name these posters.

I believe there are none and this is just another ploy by people when their arguments have been tore to shreds and have no other recourse.
You wont name then because they dont exist.

You think bandying about the name and making accusations will shut down people, but you are being called out to back up this claim with the names of these posters you claim are racist.

Where is your proof ?
Where is you evidence to back up this ridiculous claim ?