riclad wrote: » northern ireland is ruled by the british government, if you live there you pay taxs to the uk government, its part of the united kingdom, britain and northern ireland. in the troubles the british army was on the streets. yes the nfa means you can claim to be irish or british of course brexit has been a disaster ,companys are leaving the uk in order to get acess to the eu market and avoid been drowned in paperwork. if you live there you are ruled by the uk government , what has happened is some young people are protesting because loyalists feel ignored or reduced in status due to the effects of brexit. brexit can only harm the uk economy in a time where international trade is more important than ever. i think protestants would indentify as british . biden identifys as irish-american, eg he has relatives in ireland. like some people indentify as chinese american all though they have never visited china. if someone gets robbed in newry do they call the gardai, no they call the local police psni . if at some point there is a vote and the majority vote to do so northern ireland could leave the uk, it might happen in 50 years maybe. if people decide its better to be a member of the eu, in a united ireland. since ireland is in the eu, uk is not, there will have to some kind of border control, to comply with eu regulations on vat, import duty etc whether you like it or not ni is ruled by the british government, most non catholics there would consider themselves british.
downcow wrote: » I don’t think the royals have quite the same arrogance and self-sense of importance as the shinners, so I suspect they will show more restraint
riclad wrote: » most non catholics there would consider themselves british.
steddyeddy wrote: » I do say they put no effort into Scotland or Wales. English people as a nation have a proud misunderstanding of their own history and even geography. I don't want to think of the amount of times I had to explain to people in England that a lot of people in Northern Ireland consider themselves British.
riclad wrote: » if at some point there is a vote and the majority vote to do so northern ireland could leave the uk, it might happen in 50 years maybe. if people decide its better to be a member of the eu, in a united ireland. since ireland is in the eu, uk is not, there will have to some kind of border control, to comply with eu regulations on vat, import duty etc .
Hamsterchops wrote: » Too much room to play with the terms Brits & West Brits for my liking, always used in a derogatory way to make a negative point. I also hear Britishness is complicated, as a growing number of Scots can testify to as being Scottish but not British, < this even thoughg they are born on the island of Britain :cool: Same in Wales where a growing number of the population are claiming to be Welsh (and not British). Then in Northern Ireland obviously a majority of the population would have been British right up until recently, and maybe still are? There is no argument to be had re the Britishness or the NI population, that is their right to do so. This recent thing about telling them that they are NOT BRITISH is all part of a greening process and the coming together if Green & Green (with the Orange left out).
RobMc59 wrote: » We all see our own country and its history differently to how we're viewed around the world. (Irish people do this too imo)British people are generally proud of their country's identity and history although many are aware there have been some shameful episodes in that history.This is probably the same for all countries that had a colonial past.
RandomViewer wrote: » Arlene's ancesters were Irish Catholic, how can she even claim Britishness
Sunny Disposition wrote: » Unionists do feel they are British, that's how it is, it's a funny kind of identity really, many of them accept that. They are well aware they are on the island of Ireland but are loyal to Britain for ancestral reasons, even though they don't feel much kinship with 'the mainland' especially with the English. I suppose all identity is a bit funny really. I don't see any problem with British identity in the north now anyway, it was different years ago when it was placed above Irish identity, but that's more of a legacy issue now. We still have streets and emblems named after monarchs, their emblems and statues up in Belfast but none of ours, but it's not like it used to be. One huge gripe among most nationalists is the absence of the Acht Gaeilge, the unionist opposition is a big part of what has made this so significant. We have a right to have our language recognised and supported, after centuries of it being downgraded. People who have lived in the South all along might see it as a small issue, some Unionists might also, but it really isn't.
Fr D Maugire wrote: » But historically, this idea of being British has less to do with being loyal to Britain than it had to do with not being associated with anything considered Catholic. The idea of Britishness over Irishness only really increased as Catholics in Ireland started to gain equal rights. That is why Unionism is built on nothing more than religious bigotry and intolerance and the OO has played a huge part in pushing that agenda.
Fr D Maugire wrote: » Well here is the thing, some 200+ years ago the ancestors of many of the modern British in NI saw themselves first and foremost as Irish. In fact it was they who recognised the mismanagement and corruption of the COI Parliament in Dublin who were answerable to London. They recognised that they would never be more than a secondary class nation as long as they were ultimately answerable to London and that is something that modern Unionist's don't seem to have to cottoned on to. It was the ancestors of the modern British in NI who first pushed for a Republic separate from Britain, the first to use Green as their colour, yet so much of that history has been simply ignored for the current 'we are British' only mythology. John Hume described the GFA as 'Sunningdale for Slow learners' which was aimed primarily at Unionists. The current situation of being screwed over by London is hardly surprising when they never learned the lessons from their ancestors of over 200 years ago. Slow learners indeed.
downcow wrote: » Why do you think our people changed their position on eg home rule? Sunningdale was very different than gfa so I’m not sure who the slow learner was
McMurphy wrote: » What double talk You say your British, I agree you're British, and have never once (since you asked me this morning) denied your Britishness, or the right of yourself or anyone else to identify themselves as British. Here it is this morning where you asked me and I recognised your Britishness. I'm still saying you've as much right to identify as British now as I was then. Are you just trying to be contrary for the sake of it
McMurphy wrote: » Anytime you're ready down cow..cheers.
downcow wrote: » I certainly do feel kinship with the mainland and English people I recently spent a holiday in Torquay and felt much more at home than a recent trip to Dublin. And I have found England to be the only set of supporters who 100% integrate with our supporters around internationals. Tbh I don’t remember playing the scots but games I have been at in Cardiff and Dublin have been tricky at times on the streets and pubs, no such issues when we have traveled to England.
Zebra3 wrote: » Cardiff is one violent kip. And not just football related, but in general. Very ropey place for a night out.
JohnMcm1 wrote: » A united Ireland..are you joking? The Loyalists would start a civil war over it. Personally i'd rather release the North into the sea, well clear of us.
downcow wrote: » ???
downcow wrote: » I couldn’t care less what you think I am. I am challenging your double talk. The reality is the opposite. You can refer to me as whatever you like, even irish. The fact is that I am legally british
downcow wrote: » Great observation. The problem is that posters like McM are using the term to goad my community by implying we are not brits McMurphy wrote: » Someone can identify as an Uzbek for all I care downcow, that's a lazy assumption on your part. You've as much right to identify as being British as Biden has to identify himself as Irish. It still doesn't take away from the fact the British Government couldn't give a dam about you and your loyalist and unionist neighbours, and the uncomfortable fact they did throw you under the bus at the first given opportunity, exactly as was forewarned to unionists from everyone and their dogs would happen. Take it up with them, not the Irish people who actually argued against Brexit and the predicament you now find yourselves in.
downcow wrote: » Great observation. The problem is that posters like McM are using the term to goad my community by implying we are not brits
McMurphy wrote: » Someone can identify as an Uzbek for all I care downcow, that's a lazy assumption on your part. You've as much right to identify as being British as Biden has to identify himself as Irish. It still doesn't take away from the fact the British Government couldn't give a dam about you and your loyalist and unionist neighbours, and the uncomfortable fact they did throw you under the bus at the first given opportunity, exactly as was forewarned to unionists from everyone and their dogs would happen. Take it up with them, not the Irish people who actually argued against Brexit and the predicament you now find yourselves in.
RobMc59 wrote: » The Unionism you refer to is only one branch of Unionism.A person's religious persuasion is becoming less important to all of us. I have noticed there are many schools in Ireland now listed as 'multi denomination'.
![Photo of [Deleted User]](https://wa.vanillicon.com/v2/a60d925045ba5eba03f4a5f3c3d31c8b.svg)
![Photo of [Deleted User]](https://we.vanillicon.com/v2/e050b53be62f0ae2404c620976170938.svg)
