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The way forward for LC2021

History Queen

I'm interested in the views of other teachers as to what should happen to assess the work of LC2021 students. With growing calls for cancellation of the exams and predicted grades, I fear we are sleep walking in to a repeat of last year's debacle.

My personal view is the exams should go ahead as scheduled but perhaps a further review of papers to allow for more choice should happen, suggestions submitted from subject associations maybe?

As regards projects/orals/practicals I can only speak to my own subjects. In History I feel the project should go ahead as planned.

What do others think?

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rainbowtrout

Mrsmum wrote: »

Can I just say, not defending the Principal at all but in the case I spoke about, the student is truly as bright as bright can be.
She is likely to do brilliantly anyway, like the rest of her family and everyone in the school probably knows it. I'm only saying that as I'm getting the impression people think total skulduggery is going on where a student is being looked after for reasons totally unrelated to their work.

It shouldn't matter whether everyone knows she's bright or not. Every student deserves to be treated equally and to have their teacher grade them honestly. If this student is as good as you say, then there's no need whatsoever for the principal to say anything to her parents.

am_zarathustra

What is Stephen Donnelly on about? Very cautious......does that mean?

Newbie20

Do people think we will be actually be back Monday with LCs? I feel like the unions might be against it and Donnelly seemed to allude to it tonight on Claire Byrne. I wouldn’t mind going back at this stage to be honest.

wirelessdude01

Newbie20 wrote: »

Do people think we will be actually be back Monday with LCs? I feel like the unions might be against it and Donnelly seemed to allude to it tonight on Claire Byrne. I wouldn’t mind going back at this stage to be honest.

Seems to be an issue with Norma trying to add 1st and 2nd class onto the list. Goes against what they've been advised is okay to proceed with for the moment.

alroley

Newbie20 wrote: »

Do people think we will be actually be back Monday with LCs? I feel like the unions might be against it and Donnelly seemed to allude to it tonight on Claire Byrne. I wouldn’t mind going back at this stage to be honest.

I think it's INTO and 1st and 2nd class that is the issue. TUI were willing to tell members to go back this week, so I'd say 6th years are back no matter what!

carr62

What would happen with CG in the case of a teacher on maternity leave, I wonder? Sons teacher has just gone on leave but the replacement teacher wouldn't know the class at all!

Treppen

carr62 wrote: »

What would happen with CG in the case of a teacher on maternity leave, I wonder? Sons teacher has just gone on leave but the replacement teacher wouldn't know the class at all!

It'll have to be on good faith that the teacher out will discuss with the sub. That's the only solution.
But tell the son to keep shoulder to the mill, it's not over yet.

am_zarathustra

carr62 wrote: »

What would happen with CG in the case of a teacher on maternity leave, I wonder? Sons teacher has just gone on leave but the replacement teacher wouldn't know the class at all!

We had situations similar last year and all teachers involved were happy to help and be involved. No teacher wants to see the kids not get what they deserve and the vast majority I know would be delighted to help. I'd hate to think my year and a half with a class wouldn't make up part of the PG. Tell him not to worry, but no harm shwoign the new teacher he's a hard worker!!

Random sample

alroley wrote: »

I think it's INTO and 1st and 2nd class that is the issue. TUI were willing to tell members to go back this week, so I'd say 6th years are back no matter what!

TUI were adding subject to public health advice to that, so it’s not no matter what.

Rosita

Random sample wrote: »

TUI were adding subject to public health advice to that, so it’s not no matter what.

Hopefully. "No matter what" sounds crazy.

Barbeapapa

It's mad really that 6th years and ??? And their teachers could be back at work, after c.10 weeks off, in 5 days time.....but we dont actually know this for a fact!

That seems a bit of a chaotic approach. Surely there'll be teachers who have to have childcare organised, students who need to sort out travel to and from school. Mad lack of leadership here.

rainbowtrout

Barbeapapa wrote: »

It's mad really that 6th years and ??? And their teachers could be back at work, after c.10 weeks off, in 5 days time.....but we dont actually know this for a fact!

That seems a bit of a chaotic approach. Surely there'll be teachers who have to have childcare organised, students who need to sort out travel to and from school. Mad lack of leadership here.

We are not ‘back at work after 10 weeks off’. We have been working from home and continue to do so.

Barbeapapa

Sorry, I do know that and appreciate the fantastic work my children teachers have done (primary and secondary) I suppose I meant back in the classroom. Bad phrasing = morning brain.

Newbie20

Got an update from ASTI there.
The survey showed that teachers want to cooperate but don’t have faith in the departments plans. Also said that teachers feel that it’s very difficult to predict grades this year with a lack of data. Some teachers said they felt they were “damned if they do and damned if they don’t”

From talking to other teachers though, it seems that loads didn’t receive this survey so Im not sure they can draw conclusions from it.

They say with regards to schools reopening that the ASTI has “major concerns”

shesty

Barbeapapa wrote: »

That seems a bit of a chaotic approach. Surely there'll be teachers who have to have childcare organised, students who need to sort out travel to and from school. Mad lack of leadership here.

It's crazy. From the same Government - indeed, the same leader if I remember correctly - that promised schools they would have a good 2 week's notice ahead of reopening, only a couple of weeks ago. How can we believe a single thing they say???

I am all for schools to be back, and I will be only too delighted if my Senior Infant IS in fact returning on Monday, but today's announcement taken as part of a bigger picture shows an abysmal lack of leadership on all fronts.

Wombatman

If LCs and teachers are back on Monday how are remote classes going to be delivered for the rest?

Rosita

Wombatman wrote: »

If LCs and teachers are back on Monday how are remote classes going to be delivered for the rest?

It'll differ from person to person presumably. But I'll be going in for that 40 minutes and going home again to teach from home. It'll mean putting recorded classes/work up for the class before when required. This piecemeal return is a pain in the rear for me anyway.

amacca

Wombatman wrote: »

If LCs and teachers are back on Monday how are remote classes going to be delivered for the rest?

For secondary I'd assume (and I'm aware of the possible consequences of assuming

)

From school if timetabled directly after...and school have adequate broadband (assuming not all staff need to go live from school at dame time)

From home when you can get home have time to do so

I'm assuming that's the shape of it

Doable if its not a long commute or school has broadband up to task

Not doable if you have a long commute to work and school internet not up to it.

Jane98

Our Principal has stated that if LCs are back Monday then she will organise a new timetable which will allow for block teaching so that any 6th Year teacher should only need to be in 2 days of the week. A good solution, I believe.

Teach30

Wombatman wrote: »

If LCs and teachers are back on Monday how are remote classes going to be delivered for the rest?

I’ll be going in and staying in school for the day. Not worth my while try and get home in between classes and easier for me to take them for lives rather than pre record work.

Looking forward to a break out and seeing others!

jimmytwotimes 2013

Jane98 wrote: »

Our Principal has stated that if LCs are back Monday then she will organise a new timetable which will allow for block teaching so that any 6th Year teacher should only need to be in 2 days of the week. A good solution, I believe.

Accommodating.

We've been told to follow timetable which would involve moving from room to room even if doing an online class from the school

Moody_mona

Jane98 wrote: »

Our Principal has stated that if LCs are back Monday then she will organise a new timetable which will allow for block teaching so that any 6th Year teacher should only need to be in 2 days of the week. A good solution, I believe.

We've had very good engagement with the other groups, I'm not sure I could justify messing up their timetables in our case.

TheValeyard

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Accommodating.

We've been told to follow timetable which would involve moving from room to room even if doing an online class from the school

Same. If you can make it home to teach your next class that's fine. If not, you must go from room to room as if the students were actually there.

Comer1

Has there been any indication on what's happening with project work such as DCG for students who go for accredited grades only? In DCG, most should have their DCG almost, if not completely, finished by now as the deadline was seven days after Christmas return. Last I heard was that they were to be given the seven days remaining, to complete it, once we returned to school. Will all students have to complete it in those seven days or just the ones sitting the LC and those opting for accredited grades leaving it and teachers having to predict a grade for their project as well as their exam?

History Queen

Comer1 wrote: »

Has there been any indication on what's happening with project work such as DCG for students who go for accredited grades only? In DCG, most should have their DCG almost, if not completely, finished by now as the deadline was seven days after Christmas return. Last I heard was that they were to be given the seven days remaining, to complete it, once we returned to school. Will all students have to complete it in those seven days or just the ones sitting the LC and those opting for accredited grades leaving it and teachers having to predict a grade for their project as well as their exam?

Not sure in realtion to DCG specifically but this is what was said in relation to coursework, which makes me think students choose:

"The Minister’s strongly held view is that students must be afforded the choice as to whether to sit the examinations, including the oral and coursework components, as it would be entirely unfair to students to require them to participate in these elements, given the disruption in learning which has occurred. The oral and coursework components of the examinations will not form part of the Accredited Grade process.

Further details and guidance on both processes will be provided to schools and students and publicised widely over the coming weeks, as these become available."

In the same release it also says:
"Coursework will proceed in subjects where these form a normal part of the examination. Additional time will be provided by the SEC for completion of this work. "

Soooo... that's about as clear as mud.

Full text available here:
https://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2021-press-releases/PR21-02-17.html

rainbowtrout

amacca wrote: »

For secondary I'd assume (and I'm aware of the possible consequences of assuming )

From school if timetabled directly after...and school have adequate broadband (assuming not all staff need to go live from school at dame time)

From home when you can get home have time to do so

I'm assuming that's the shape of it

Doable if its not a long commute or school has broadband up to task

Not doable if you have a long commute to work and school internet not up to it.

And if you have two LC groups (I do), for some teachers they will have to hang around and teach online from school because it's not worth them going home to come back again. I live in the same town that I teach in, so it's not a problem for me specifically. But I do have classes with other year groups that are straight after LC, so in practical terms it makes sense to stay in my classroom and work from there for those classes.

Rosita

"The Minister’s strongly held view is that students must be afforded the choice as to whether to sit the examinations, including the oral and coursework components, as it would be entirely unfair to students to require them to participate in these elements, given the disruption in learning which has occurred. The oral and coursework components of the examinations will not form part of the Accredited Grade process.

I don't understand this. Logically this is saying that an Irish teacher in arriving at an Accredited Grade/predicted grade should estimate the student's prospects based on only the written part (50% if you exclude the listening). How is this equitable if the idea is that Accredited Grades are exactly the same as the actual exam?

noplacehere

Rosita wrote: »

"The Minister’s strongly held view is that students must be afforded the choice as to whether to sit the examinations, including the oral and coursework components, as it would be entirely unfair to students to require them to participate in these elements, given the disruption in learning which has occurred. The oral and coursework components of the examinations will not form part of the Accredited Grade process.

I don't understand this. Logically this is saying that an Irish teacher in arriving at an Accredited Grade/predicted grade should estimate the student's prospects based on only the written part (50% if you exclude the listening). How is this equitable if the idea is that Accredited Grades are exactly the same as the actual exam?

Exactly. Not one of my music students will take accredited grades if we can’t include an assessment on the performance at all as part of the calculation

Hopontop

Wombatman wrote: »

If LCs and teachers are back on Monday how are remote classes going to be delivered for the rest?

I’ve actually been going into school to teach (school has excellent broadband and we have none at home). I have a great setup at the moment using one of the science labs (I don’t have my own room), using a desktop and laptop with a coffee machine in the prep room beside it!

Now I’ve just realized I’ll have to go back to moving rooms (and hope that the teachers whose rooms they are, are not planning on basing themselves there)
Not the end of the world but another headache on top of everything else

Purefrank128

noplacehere wrote: »

Exactly. Not one of my music students will take accredited grades if we can’t include an assessment on the performance at all as part of the calculation

The statement says that the (external) examination of the coursework or oral component does not form part of the Accredited Grade. It does not say that a teacher's estimation of a student's ability at that component does not form part of a (properly weighted) predicted mark.