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Nvidia RTX Discussion

K.O.Kiki

A new era in 3D graphics stands before us.

First-gen Raytracing GPUs:

Nvidia "Turing" - Quadro RTX 5000 / 6000 / 8000 (US$ 2'300 / 6'300 / 10'000)

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13214/nvidia-reveals-next-gen-turing-gpu-architecture
https://www.anandtech.com/show/13217/nvidia-announces-turing-powered-quadro-rtx-family

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harmless

Are Nvidia actually going ahead and exasperating the shortage issue by disabling gaming on some of the cards they produce?
Or have they once again been forced to change course?

Aodhan5000

buzzerxx wrote: »

If the mining bubble bursts could there be a glut of used high end gpus for sale at less than rrp ?

Just depends on how many are out there. Plenty of people willing to buy an ex mining gpu for a bit over MSRP. There would have to be a lot flooding the second hand market to get em below msrp

buzzerxx

If the mining bubble bursts could there be a glut of used high end gpus for sale at less than rrp ?

harmless

BloodBath wrote: »

They will just follow the money without cutting their nose off and burning bridges with their old customers. The gaming market is always there.

That's exactly how i see it too.

BloodBath wrote: »

Hopefully asics replace gpu's for mining Etherium and things might go back to normal. It's terribly energy wasteful using millions of gpu's for that but some would say the same about gaming I guess.

Not going to happen like that, the asic mining resistance is what allows the little guy to get involved. If someone beats the current asic resistance I can see a hard fork of ETH canceling it out.
However ETH is moving from POW to POS, which should be the end of mining on that currency at least. It's a 2 - 3 year plan though, any sudden changes would devalue the currency.

It's a temperary problem but not as temporary as the majority of gamers are happy with. Which is understandable but what can you do?

BloodBath

harmless wrote: »

True you pay a massive premium for the validated drivers and bios on those workstation cards. And for the people that need these it's worth the price.
It's essential that workstation cards have plenty of error checking, incorrect calculations are very costly.

Mining is different though it's not essential that the rig is 100% stable and if a few shares are corrupt, no big deal. If these 3060 cards can be hacked they will be and they will mine just as well as the so called dedicated mining cards Nvidia have announced.

Can they really segment this market? If they can then it will increase profits for them.
However to me it just looks like another marking move from Nvidia to make it seem like they care about gaming.
They have already made it clear with their last major PR blunder that if you are a gamer Bryan Del Rizzo and his team are not on your side.

They will just follow the money without cutting their nose off and burning bridges with their old customers. The gaming market is always there. This crypto mining is not going to go away but hopefully it get's more specialized hardware and some of the other fabs start competing with TSMC again.

Hopefully asics replace gpu's for mining Etherium and things might go back to normal. It's terribly energy wasteful using millions of gpu's for that but some would say the same about gaming I guess.

harmless

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

i have a 4k monitor, but im going to jump to 1440p ultrawide which hopefully wont be as demanding.

About 67% fewer pixels but be sure that the aspect ratio is optimal for you main use case.
I mostly play FPS online so 2 1440p monitors works best for me. (one high refresh and one 60hz)

If I played more story driven games I'd go for the single ultra wide.

Icyseanfitz

Dcully wrote: »

Im keeping mine, theres not a game out there i cant run at 100+ fps 1440P [well i lie i cant on MSFS 2020 in huge cities :P then again no PC can] but everything else including resource hogs like full field of 50+ ai in demanding racing simulators @ ultra settings.
Ive no interest in raytracing or 4K so for me its a no brainer to keep my 1080TI.

i have a 4k monitor, but im going to jump to 1440p ultrawide which hopefully wont be as demanding.

Mr Crispy

EoinHef wrote: »

Is it not only the 3060 getting this mining nerf though?

Seems to me that there saying if you pay us enough money we won't nerf your mining ie buy a 3070/3080. That still doesn't help a bunch of people who want a GPU above the 3060.

Good PR but not really that effective if the aim is to get GPUs into the hands of gamers. Maybe that one GPU but the rest of your line no.

The rumour is that there will be a refresh of the existing cards with the new nerfed hash rate feature. There's no point in updating cards already sold/in the wild.

harmless

BloodBath wrote: »

Of course it is. Dedicated workstation cards exist that aren't that different hardware wise, most of the difference is in the drivers and you pay a premium for them.

If you're buying a gpu to make a profit off of it either through professional work or lazy ass mining they can and will segment it to make more profit.

True you pay a massive premium for the validated drivers and bios on those workstation cards. And for the people that need these it's worth the price.
It's essential that workstation cards have plenty of error checking, incorrect calculations are very costly.

Mining is different though it's not essential that the rig is 100% stable and if a few shares are corrupt, no big deal. If these 3060 cards can be hacked they will be and they will mine just as well as the so called dedicated mining cards Nvidia have announced.

Can they really segment this market? If they can then it will increase profits for them.
However to me it just looks like another marking move from Nvidia to make it seem like they care about gaming.
They have already made it clear with their last major PR blunder that if you are a gamer Bryan Del Rizzo and his team are not on your side.

AlmightyCushion

EoinHef wrote: »

Is it not only the 3060 getting this mining nerf though?

Seems to me that there saying if you pay us enough money we won't nerf your mining ie buy a 3070/3080. That still doesn't help a bunch of people who want a GPU above the 3060.

Good PR but not really that effective if the aim is to get GPUs into the hands of gamers. Maybe that one GPU but the rest of your line no.

Even with the 3060 it might help availability but not pricing. The higher end cards will still be over priced due to mining so the 3060 price will increase as a result.

BloodBath

Cordell wrote: »

I hate the miners for the GPU shortage as much as anyone else and I wish the worst upon them but it's not acceptable to have Nvidia deicide what you can and cannot do with your GPU.

Of course it is. Dedicated workstation cards exist that aren't that different hardware wise, most of the difference is in the drivers and you pay a premium for them.

If you're buying a gpu to make a profit off of it either through professional work or lazy ass mining they can and will segment it to make more profit.

Revoker88

Is it not only the 3060 getting this mining nerf though?

Seems to me that there saying if you pay us enough money we won't nerf your mining ie buy a 3070/3080. That still doesn't help a bunch of people who want a GPU above the 3060.

Good PR but not really that effective if the aim is to get GPUs into the hands of gamers. Maybe that one GPU but the rest of your line no.

AlmightyCushion

Also, it means they can make dedicated mining cards and charge more for them.

Cuddlesworth

Lumen wrote: »

, but once gamers switch to consoles they're a lost market.

For Nvidia it's worse than that. The current AMD cards are not great for mining in comparison to the Nvidia cards. As more stock comes in for AMD, more people will be tempted to switch due to availability. A switch in general means that person is more likely to pick up a AMD card next time as well. It's not a lost customer, it's possibly a lost customer for life. Mindshare is a important part of Nvidias market control.

Lumen

I can see why Nvidia want to fix this. They're not profiting from the redirection of cards to the miners, it's a PR disaster, and it's bad for the PC gaming market which they dominate. Mining demand comes and goes, but once gamers switch to consoles they're a lost market.

Ampere isn't much (any?) more efficient in terms of performance per watt than previous generation, they've basically thrown a load of silicon at the problem, offered cards at very reasonable RRPs (for the performance) in order to keep Nvidia-powered PC gaming popular in the face of new, heavily discounted AMD-powered console hardware, and their efforts are largely for nought.

Mr Crispy

More on this supposed hash rate limiter (Del Rizzo is the head of GeForce's global PR;

https://twitter.com/bdelrizzo/status/1362619264423747590?s=20

And now there's now talk that the entire Ampere line-up will be re-launched with new Device IDs. Grain of salt and all that.

[Deleted User]

At least they're trying something I guess. They're not under any obligation to try limit their GPUs.

Cordell

harmless wrote: »

I dislike mining too but it's free money, I can't help myself.....

I assume you got the GPU for gaming, so you're ok

harmless wrote: »

The more people mining the faster the dificulty goes up so it has to come to a head at some stage so I guess I'm just doing my part.

Riiiiight

Redfox25

Mr Crispy wrote: »

Sure, Nvidia.

There are a few thousand folks reading that announcment saying "Challenge accepted"

Mr Crispy

Sure, Nvidia.

Nvidia says its cryptocurrency mining limiter 'cannot be hacked'

harmless

EoinHef wrote: »

So on this seen as I've seen you mention me by name in the thread.

What I said was the cards could be made and sold close msrp for a profit,as launch prices showed. So if your gonna mention me by name please get it right.

Correct but not at the margins that Nvidia have sold to AIB's for the 3000 series, hence the FE card prices.
It was thanks to you that I actually stuck with it and got a 3080 for RRP so I genuinely do appreciate that.
Not the Nvidia RRP but the AIB RRP which is still a good deal.

Revoker88

harmless wrote: »

You also have to remember that Nvidia's RRP was never realistic outside of the FE cards.3000 seires FE card's will probably not be available in Ireland ever again.

So on this seen as I've seen you mention me by name in the thread.

What I said was the cards could be made and sold close msrp for a profit,as launch prices showed. So if your gonna mention me by name please get it right.

harmless

Cordell wrote: »

I hate the miners for the GPU shortage as much as anyone else and I wish the worst upon them but it's not acceptable to have Nvidia deicide what you can and cannot do with your GPU.

I dislike mining too but it's free money, I can't help myself.....

The more people mining the faster the dificulty goes up so it has to come to a head at some stage so I guess I'm just doing my part.

Cordell

Mr Crispy wrote: »

So Nvidia are launching dedicated mining cards and nerfing the hash rate on the upcoming 3060 (AnandTech).

I hate the miners for the GPU shortage as much as anyone else and I wish the worst upon them

but it's not acceptable to have Nvidia deicide what you can and cannot do with your GPU.

ShadowHearth

frozenfrozen wrote: »

I think nvidia would be better off auctioning cards on their website. At least if people are going to pay over the odds the money is not lost through scalpers

Or do Japan style when it comes to new consoles and items hard to get: raffle/lottery style every few days they get stock. If you win, you can buy it. One ticket per CC and person. At least this way you would have a chance to get one and not beaten to the curb by scalper and miner bots.

harmless

frozenfrozen wrote: »

I think nvidia would be better off auctioning cards on their website. At least if people are going to pay over the odds the money is not lost through scalpers

If they did that no one would get a 3080 card for under €1400.
At least the way it is now a small number of genuine gamers are getting them at the inflated RRP which is still sub €1000

You also have to remember that Nvidia's RRP was never realistic outside of the FE cards.3000 seires FE card's will probably not be available in Ireland ever again.

frozenfrozen

I think nvidia would be better off auctioning cards on their website. At least if people are going to pay over the odds the money is not lost through scalpers

harmless

ShadowHearth wrote: »

It's only software solution with drivers to 3060, so basically... No solution. Those who do mining already know what they are doing and it won't take long to "fix it".

Very true, probably as easy as flashing the bios on the card.

Ethereum is moving from POW to POS, that's the real solution but it will be a slow transition over a number years.

MidlanderMan

Retr0gamer wrote: »

But if you hit those framerates what have you got left to blame on a bad round?

Server lag obviously.

Redfox25

ShadowHearth wrote: »

It's only software solution with drivers to 3060, so basically... No solution. Those who do mining already know what they are doing and it won't take long to "fix it".

Its somewhat bad as well in that if you bought the card to game and wanted to mine on your not gaming hours then it wont do it efficiently. Your paying for the card so you should expect it to do all its roles or potential roles and not be hobbled by its own software which as ShadowHearth pointed out will be bypassed by miners but maybe not so easily for the casual miner.