lawrencesummers wrote: » The only thing to take away from all of this is that you don’t have kids, and your anger at teachers is because you sister has kids that are not getting what she views as enough. So because one school in the country isn’t doing enough for your sisters kids your ripping into every teacher.
mayo londoner wrote: » I'd argue that a sample size of approx a dozen teacher friends overall is more than a fair sample size....... For the record, my qualification is in seriously high demand as it's a legal requirement in any construction company and most workplaces, would get an average of 5 emails from recruiters per day, especially from the construction sector but the max I'd ever be able to earn would be 60k, and the stress, responsibility and workload involved don't justify the salary, even then you could be out of a job at the drop of the hat with the way the construction industry is, hence why myself and others who have qualified in the same profession have either got out or are looking to get out. So yes, the salary, qualifications/skillset etc are very relevant from that perspective when comparing
OEP wrote: » There could be a lot of bias in your sample....(statistical bias that is) Well then my point about the industry not having high enough salaries still stands. Anyway my point isn't what you should or shouldn't be earning, it's that what you're earning has nothing to do with what teachers are earning. And there seems to be an attitude, that anyone could be a teacher and thus they feel it necessary to degrade their profession and salary
mayo londoner wrote: » I'd argue that a sample size of approx a dozen teacher friends overall is more than a fair sample size.......
mayo londoner wrote: » For the record, my qualification is in seriously high demand as it's a legal requirement in any construction company
mayo londoner wrote: » Nope fully agree not everyone can be a teacher, just the same that everyone can't be a doctor, nurse, binman, IT professional etc. Wouldn't call it an 'attitude' at all, just think that the reality is that non teachers are fed up of the sense of entitlement that apparently comes with being a teacher and nobody else can get their head around it. As I said in a previous post, nobody would begrudge the salary and working conditions if they just got on with and weren't detached from reality
mayo londoner wrote: » Not that it's any of your business but Health and Safety would be the qualification, an area that requires constant upskilling. Nothing suspect about it. And good for you that you are on 50k plus, no idea what industry you are in and imagine you won't have the courtesy to inform us all but that's just not the case for the majority in the country unfortunately at this moment in time.
jam17032010 wrote: » Ya, I'd believe that. And that will be replicated across the country. Those who can keep their kids safe will keep them home. .
OEP wrote: » By the way, has the public health advice indicated that it is safe for them to go back to school - or are we expecting them to against that?
lawrencesummers wrote: » That just stinks of jealousy. Plain and simple jealous begrdugery. Your made your decisions and others made theirs. You went to college studied a supposedly in demand profession that pays well only to find out the downsides are high, while others who have gone into teaching are on the same money without the downsides you’ve experienced. Maybe you just need to learn a bit more about the downsides of being a teacher to balance your opinion and dull your envy.
jam17032010 wrote: » I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that your "qualification" is not in statistics. I'm going to guess at "Health and Safety"? Does your gf and friends know that you despise them and have zero respect for what they do? I'm starting to feel sorry for your gf at this stage tbh.
mayo londoner wrote: » Ah the 'begrudgery/bitter' term that I predicted that would be thrown out in my earlier post, as predictable as day and night. Strange how you didn't dispute anything else from the post. Downsides to every job my friend, just have to get on with it, something teachers seem to be incapable of without letting the world know.
Smacruairi wrote: » After yet another few days of leaks about the reopening of schools, it transpires that she again hadn't informed her cabinet colleagues. Why has she not been replaced? Has there ever been a minister who has been repeatedly making a bags of this and lasted this long? Like the dept of health is bad, but this is on another level it seems, particularly around communication. Do FF realise that their most public ministers are Donnelly and Foley, who surely have approvement ratings in the single digits, while FG have paschal and Coveney who are quietly keeping things moving along? Is there a plan, even a political one?!
lawrencesummers wrote: » So you have at least acknowledged your bitterness. The first step of solving a problem is admitting one.
brookers wrote: » It just sends out a message I think that she is stuck in another era. I could be wrong but I think she also has very pro life views which with her Kerry upbringing doesn't make for a good fit.
shesty wrote: » I have actually seen no public health advice about schools, other than the concerns about the "mobilisation of a million people". They have not actually said a thing really otherwise. Since they have consistently said they are concerned about a million other things, it would suggest to me that they don't actually have massive concerns about outbreaks within schools themselves between children (I don't quite agree for secondary schools myself, because I think they should be an area that needs to be considered in greater detail).
meeeeh wrote: » Education minister always get hostile reception by unions. There is nothing new there. Personally I think she is to soft and DES should run schools as dictatorship. Pit unions against parents and see how that works. It would be bruising experience but it could limit the influence unions currently have. Anyway I think Ruairi Quinn was the last minister who tried with reform and he was about as popular as Norma Foley. It's one of the more conservative professions and any change brings unions into meltdown.
lawrencesummers wrote: » She didn’t get any reception from the unions when back in January she committed their members to returning to work without as much as a phone call to consult with them, that backfired because the dogs on the street could see it wasn’t safe to go back to work, and she had to do a U turn on that. She has since tried to bring the teachers representatives on board and failed miserably in the leaving cert talks when it was clear to the union that the leaving cert had already been decided. She had to do a U turn on that then. The biggest failing is not looking far enough ahead. It pretty clear that it took until the start of February to start planning for the leaving cert. What should be getting decided now are the possible scenarios for after the summer holidays, everything up to the summer holidays should have been decided and agreed upon by all stakeholders a long time ago.
mayo londoner wrote: » Yes Health and Safety is a degree, and can go on to undertake a masters, as many have.
mayo londoner wrote: » Ah the typical condescending teacher, great to see the likes of you teaching the future generations. As stated before, myself and other non teacher friends have zero hesitation in pulling up my Gf or other friends who are teachers if they start playing the poor mouth.
jam17032010 wrote: » I never said H&S was not a degree/masters course???? Sounds like she has found a keeper.
meeeeh wrote: » Education minister always get hostile reception by unions.Personally I think she is to soft and DES should run schools as dictatorship. Pit unions against parents and see how that works. It would be bruising experience but it could limit the influence unions currently have. .
Smacruairi wrote: 1. Education ministers don't always get a hostile welcome. Hannafin was liked, McHugh got an easy run of it up until he made a horlix of the lc. Foley amd Quinn are now despised because it's clear they have their own agenda, not the welfare of students at heart.
dubrov wrote: » Hannafin was liked as she was there during a boom time with giveaway budgets and large salary rises for teachers.
Smacruairi wrote: » 1. Education ministers don't always get a hostile welcome. Hannafin was liked, McHugh got an easy run of it up until he made a horlix of the lc. Foley amd Quinn are now despised because it's clear they have their own agenda, not the welfare of students at heart. 2. Run the des as a dictatorship... Are you for real? That is literally the worst way to do anything, especially with a system involving 1 million people, with a 14yr cycle built into it for kids. Are you actually that moronic to think that one opinion is the best? That's so sad. 3. Pit unions against parents, again, how sad are you. Parents are teachers, parents have parents associations, parents are on boards of management, parents volunteer in schools. They have a much better feel of things than you do, and your warped little vendetta is not helpful in the slightest. 4. Be a bruising experience? For who? Not you obviously, so you expect teaching and learning to suffer? That is so messed up its actually incredible. Norma is one of the most incompetent ministers we have, so much so she actually has made some people agree with a teaching union lol! She has to go, plain and simple. Next thing you see her ask her : 1. Why was there no contingency planning for the lc 2. Why was there no contingency plan for schooling 3. Why did she not provide further supports back when covid was starting and not even mention additional needs until January of this year 4. Why does she feel the need to fly so many kites in the media rather than actually talk to experts 5. Why did she not release the leaving cert algorithm used last year 6. Why has she not released the health and safety risk assessment of schools during covid 7. Why did the des insist covid could only be spread by touch and not by air right up to late seor 8. Why did they not insist on masks until late Sept, and not at all for primary school 9. Why did she even bother becoming a politician if she just wanted to bulldoze through with a pr firm and not actually listen to others
Smacruairi wrote: Do you know of the positive reforms she brought in? Do you know of the impact she had, negative or positive? Or do you just want to talk about wages and salaries again? Throw in holidays too, and Pup while you're at it. Want to engage with the thread topic at all? Your appraisal of Foley?
