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Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

ancapailldorcha

This thread is a continuation of the megathreads for discussing the presidency of Donald Trump and any matters which relate to this.

Please keep discussion civil and constructive and bear the charter in mind before posting.

Update 23/9/20:

Threadbanned users:

Outlaw Pete
everlast75
mcmoustache
lawrencesummers
RIGOLO

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Blowfish

Akrasia wrote: »

They also have very little to gain from supporting Trump this time, he's a lame duck, just days away from the end of his term.

Unless they plan trying to become 'the next Trump' by appealing to the Trump base for the next election cycle, they will be harming their prospects by standing up for a man who called for an insurrection against the elected government

I think that's the beauty of impeaching him again. Practically it isn't going to make a whole lot of difference as it'll happen after Biden's inauguration, but politically this vote is going to be remembered and dems and even their own primary candidates will keep refering to it for years.

Each and every senator will have to make the decision, do they go all in on Trump and lose the moderate vote or do they reject him and lose his base. Yes, his base is 74 million, but when you look at the demographics and that the 18-29 bracket voted almost 2-1 for Biden, long term alignment with Trump is a dangerous game.

Impeachment puts the GOP between a rock and a hard place, right where they deserve to be for enabling him.

Shelga

I'd love to see Ted Cruz do a live lie detector test on TV on whether he believes the election was stolen.

Akrasia

prawnsambo wrote: »

That's a definite possibility for some. That 74 million votes has to go somewhere.

I think there will be a few people who will try to fill this void, Cruz for example has been agitating very heavily over the past few months, but of those 74 million voters, only a small percentage of the are of the hardcore insurrectionist variety

About a third would be my guestimate based on some of the polls I have seen. A third of republican voters is very shaky ground if you face a primary challenge at the next election, which you almost certainly will, if you are the guy who supported storming the Capitol building

I actually wouldn't be surprised if every GOP candidate faced a primary challenge from some extremist winnuts at the next mid terms, and even the likes of Cruz could face a primary challenge if he is not ideologically pure enough for the Qanon types

looksee

Rachel Maddow argued that any ambivalent GOP-ers could deal with it by simply not turning up for the vote. It has to have 60(?)% of the Senators present, it doesn't specify how many have to be there as a quorum.

prawnsambo

Akrasia wrote: »

In the last impeachment, the reasons given for not voting for impeachment were that
1. The charges were 'trumped up'
2. He was already exonerated by the Mueller investigation
3. The charges he was accused of do not add up to 'High crimes and misdemeanours'

How would those reasons hold up the 2nd time?

Any republican who votes to not impeach Trump this time has no hiding place, they will be standing side by side with the insurrectionists

They also have very little to gain from supporting Trump this time, he's a lame duck, just days away from the end of his term.

Unless they plan trying to become 'the next Trump' by appealing to the Trump base for the next election cycle, they will be harming their prospects by standing up for a man who called for an insurrection against the elected government

The charge sheet could be a mile long, although for the sake of brevity, I'd say Pelosi will focus on that phone call with the Georgia Governor where trump tried to get him to commit electoral fraud, and the events leading up to and including the 6th of January's assault on the Capitol building while the senate was in session.

That's a definite possibility for some. That 74 million votes has to go somewhere.

Quin_Dub

Igotadose wrote: »

Some will vote to impeach - Romney, Murkowski, Toomey maybe. That's 3. Maybe as many as 10. But you need 66 which is 17(?) if all the Democratic senators vote to impeach.

But they won't kick him out. Still, the impeachment needs to go forward and their names recorded for history.

The Democrat 50 are a lock , not a chance any of them don't vote for it.

Romney , Murkowski , Toomey at least - Collins I think has to vote for it as well given her "He's learned his lesson" tripe the last time.

My prediction is them getting to the upper fifties in the Senate - 57/58 something like that.

The telling vote for the future of the GOP is McConnell.

If he votes to remove then the party are serious about breaking from Trump.

Having said that - the RNC just unanimously supported Trump at their convention and not a single one of them felt that Trump had anything to apologies for in relation to the Riots. so probably not.

aloyisious

Igotadose wrote: »

Some will vote to impeach - Romney, Murkowski, Toomey maybe. That's 3. Maybe as many as 10. But you need 66 which is 17(?) if all the Democratic senators vote to impeach.

But they won't kick him out. Still, the impeachment needs to go forward and their names recorded for history.

It'll be interesting to see what angle McConnell takes on impeachment moves against Trump, he is on an even stickier wicket now after the Capitol event, with anti-Trump republicans saying they'll give it their vote support on the floor. He can't say the Dems are making the impeachment move purely on partisan grounds as the totally anti-congress event is what gave birth to impeachment 2, not the other way round.

If enough vigour is applied to McConnells arm indicating he'll raise it in an AYE vote [which is what CNN are doing now with the regular run of video-photo images of the insurgents in action - a mirror-image to Fox News] "persuading" the public to believe in Trumps guilt before any trial and increasing the pressure on him to throw Trump under the bus, even if its by resignation. Its exactly what Trump and friends have been doing for years now, using the media to turn things for him.

Akrasia

Igotadose wrote: »

Some will vote to impeach - Romney, Murkowski, Toomey maybe. That's 3. Maybe as many as 10. But you need 66 which is 17(?) if all the Democratic senators vote to impeach.

But they won't kick him out. Still, the impeachment needs to go forward and their names recorded for history.

In the last impeachment, the reasons given for not voting for impeachment were that
1. The charges were 'trumped up'
2. He was already exonerated by the Mueller investigation
3. The charges he was accused of do not add up to 'High crimes and misdemeanours'

How would those reasons hold up the 2nd time?

Any republican who votes to not impeach Trump this time has no hiding place, they will be standing side by side with the insurrectionists

They also have very little to gain from supporting Trump this time, he's a lame duck, just days away from the end of his term.

Unless they plan trying to become 'the next Trump' by appealing to the Trump base for the next election cycle, they will be harming their prospects by standing up for a man who called for an insurrection against the elected government

The charge sheet could be a mile long, although for the sake of brevity, I'd say Pelosi will focus on that phone call with the Georgia Governor where trump tried to get him to commit electoral fraud, and the events leading up to and including the 6th of January's assault on the Capitol building while the senate was in session.

prawnsambo

Igotadose wrote: »

Some will vote to impeach - Romney, Murkowski, Toomey maybe. That's 3. Maybe as many as 10. But you need 66 which is 17(?) if all the Democratic senators vote to impeach.

But they won't kick him out. Still, the impeachment needs to go forward and their names recorded for history.

It's a big dilemma for them. Between a rock and a hard place. There are 20 Republicans up for re-election in 2022 afaik. They might find it the most difficult. But what comes out in the next two years could well vindicate an impeachment vote. Toomey is retiring and Murkowski is facing re-election in 2022. Also Rubio

.

Also retiring are Richard Burr (NC) and it's probably unlikely that Grassley will run again, but he hasn't said.

Igotadose

Windmill100000 wrote: »

What is the likelihood Republicans will vote to impeach him? I think they will let him off, personally, even they know his actions warrant it. I hope I'm wrong and they do the right thing.

Some will vote to impeach - Romney, Murkowski, Toomey maybe. That's 3. Maybe as many as 10. But you need 66 which is 17(?) if all the Democratic senators vote to impeach.

But they won't kick him out. Still, the impeachment needs to go forward and their names recorded for history.

Windmill100000

What is the likelihood Republicans will vote to impeach him? I think they will let him off, personally, even they know his actions warrant it. I hope I'm wrong and they do the right thing.

Akrasia

Thargor wrote: »

Amazon switching Parler off tomorrow night:

https://www.mediaite.com/online/amazon-kicks-parler-off-their-web-hosting-service-platform-expected-to-go-offline-sunday-one-minute-before-midnight/

I hope they also forward copies of the database to the FBI to aid them with their investigations into right wing militia and insurgent groups possible intentions going forward

looksee

Itssoeasy wrote: »

So the Arizona gop have decided to censure cindy McCain the wife of the late senator John McCain and they made some very serious claims. They allege she has had drug problems in the past and also they allege they senator McCain was invoked in wrong doing in both his military and political careers. It’s nuts and one of the “sins” is not supporting Donald trump.

Not quite apparently - https://eu.azcentral.com/story/news/politics/arizona/2021/01/09/maricopa-county-republican-committee-votes-censure-cindy-mccain/6609185002/
It seems there was a suggestion from a group within a county GOP to add an amendment to another censure, but it was not voted on.

I imagine Cindy McCain would take it as a compliment that a bunch of people more concerned with censuring people than addressing the chaos in the country at the moment would take exception to her stand.

looksee

It says a lot about Trump that he would ask (persuade? insist? threaten?) Graham to go out and make that pathetic little weasel request 'lets just forget all the fuss and I'll be good'. The lack of self awareness, or dignity is breathtaking. And then to add the dig about cowardice on the part of Biden - any tiny amount of sympathy the grovelling might have achieved was lost in that last sentence.

Itssoeasy

So the Arizona gop have decided to censure cindy McCain the wife of the late senator John McCain and they made some very serious claims. They allege she has had drug problems in the past and also they allege they senator McCain was invoked in wrong doing in both his military and political careers. It’s nuts and one of the “sins” is not supporting Donald trump.

listermint

Tell me how wrote: »

Saw a quote from the Parler founder that they have several host companies 'bidding' to win Parlers business.

I seriously doubt it somehow.

Companies don't but for business such as this . It's a small forum website. He might have some ad-hoc server farms wanting to take their account. But it won't be the likes of Azure or Google , Big Blue.

Usual spoofing.

weisses

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Apparently impeachment is still being pushed

https://twitter.com/funder/status/1347990414817681408?s=19

Vote on Wednesday

Tell me how

VinLieger wrote: »

The cries of censorship from the same group of people who rabidly supported a cake shop to be able to refuse to make a gay cake is a beautiful thing to watch.

Also they could still host on a non US service if they really wanted to but the irony of that might indeed break reality.

Saw a quote from the Parler founder that they have several host companies 'bidding' to win Parlers business.

I seriously doubt it somehow.

VinLieger

Thargor wrote: »

Amazon switching Parler off tomorrow night:

https://www.mediaite.com/online/amazon-kicks-parler-off-their-web-hosting-service-platform-expected-to-go-offline-sunday-one-minute-before-midnight/

The cries of censorship from the same group of people who rabidly supported a cake shop to be able to refuse to make a gay cake is a beautiful thing to watch.

Also they could still host on a non US service if they really wanted to but the irony of that might indeed break reality.

Windmill100000

Not sure if this video link has been posted of some the scenes at the Capitol. Some are very disturbing, so be warned.

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/chris-99178053752

Thargor

Amazon switching Parler off tomorrow night:

https://www.mediaite.com/online/amazon-kicks-parler-off-their-web-hosting-service-platform-expected-to-go-offline-sunday-one-minute-before-midnight/

aloyisious

It'll take a conviction in both chambers to get rid of Trump off the political stage. The Public know their president is a criminal. The net platforms have dumped him. The only social media still available to him is Fox News if he goes to them and they open the door to him [which is likely] to broadcast to the nation.

His personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, is as culpable for the criminal actions of the insurgents as Trump. The senate and McConnell can't allow him stand in it's chamber and let him defend Trump as he urged the insurgents to go into [edit] TRIAL BY COMBAT at the Capitol before they stormed the senate while it's members were in session.

Rudy meant the insurgents to do harm to the senators and as they made clear in their own statements in the Capitol, they wanted to hang Pence, the V/P when they got their hands on him.

The present members of the senate are now at more severe risk from those members of Trumps insurgent army still on the loose due to the failure of the Capitol take-over bid. The insurgents now have nothing left to lose as the identified ones not in custody are on the run from the police.

Thargor

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Oh this just gets better and better.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/randalllane/2021/01/07/a-truth-reckoning-why-were-holding-those-who-lied-for-trump-accountable/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Thats a great article.

prawnsambo

Windmill100000 wrote: »

I don't think it's being glossed over at all. I think Monday will reveal a lot, as has been widely reported in the media.

Yeah. More and more information is coming out. And of course pieces of the jigsaw that were in place beforehand are now making sense. A lot of nervous people in high places right now. They have the numbers to start impeachment on Monday. I see no let up on that front.

Timberrrrrrrr

Water John wrote: »

It cannot be left go. Yes the Senate vote on impeachment will be done by the next session after the inauguration.
It's important to remember lives were lost and Trump wouldn't agree to mobilising against the mob. Pence in consultation with McConnell and Pelosi did that. In a way Pence did a coup.

Apparently impeachment is still being pushed

https://twitter.com/funder/status/1347990414817681408?s=19

Water John

It cannot be left go. Yes the Senate vote on impeachment will be done by the next session after the inauguration.
It's important to remember lives were lost and Trump wouldn't agree to mobilising against the mob. Pence in consultation with McConnell and Pelosi did that. In a way Pence did a coup.

Windmill100000

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

There is not enough outrage about this coming from US. That is the problem. Doesn't matter what we think.

Think about it and the effect on Trump. Not much really, just a waiting game until the 20th January, with talk about impeachment.

Was an outrageous thing, totally unreal. But it seems to be glossed over in the hope that 20/1 will happen and Trump will be silenced. Somehow I doubt that.

I don't think it's being glossed over at all. I think Monday will reveal a lot, as has been widely reported in the media.

Spanish Eyes

There is not enough outrage about this coming from US. That is the problem. Doesn't matter what we think.

Think about it and the effect on Trump. Not much really, just a waiting game until the 20th January, with talk about impeachment.

Was an outrageous thing, totally unreal. But it seems to be glossed over in the hope that 20/1 will happen and Trump will be silenced. Somehow I doubt that.

Windmill100000

Graham is calling for Biden to "do it" so Trump's vigilantes will be even more rageful towards him.

Biden won't fall for that.

And no wonder he's shaking if he spent most of the day with Trump. Can only imagine what that would do to you ðŸ€£

prawnsambo

jill_valentine wrote: »

I wonder how much we're going to learn about the cause of Graham's loyalty in a few weeks time.

It's intriguing. I really do hope so. He's absolutely terrified of Trump.