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FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

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McMurphy

Tbf - Holohan and NPHET gave fair enough warnings as to restrictions needing to be tightened, and the repercussions that would follow if they weren't.

Leo Varadkar in particular publicly attacked Holohan and NPHET on a prime time current affairs show, and basically said they were talking from their hoop.

Shock horror - Holohan and NPHETs predictions were correct, we've went to being one of the absolute worst affected places in the EU.

It's the people's fault though. :cool:

[Deleted User]

smurgen wrote: »

I wonder what would happen if a drunk driver took that stance on court? "I'm not to blame your honor, no one told me I would crash and wipe out a whole family. Someone should have pointed out how bad it could be before I broke the law."

Childish and pathetic level of debate.

smurgen

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I think you are misunderstanding my point smurg if that's the conclusion you have arrived at. Very odd. I don't even know what your second point is, NPHET make the projections.

Must bit a bit like the negative market cap scenario all over again.

I wonder what would happen if a drunk driver took that stance on court? "I'm not to blame your honor, no one told me I would crash and wipe out a whole family. Someone should have pointed out how bad it could be before I broke the law."

Bubbaclaus

smurgen wrote: »

So it's NPHET's fault government ignored them? Tell me this what we're governments own projections that supported their stance to keep things open?

I think you are misunderstanding my point smurg if that's the conclusion you have arrived at. Very odd. I don't even know what your second point is, NPHET make the projections.

Must bit a bit like the negative market cap scenario all over again.

smurgen

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Government obviously made a decision based on NPHET projections, and the situation has ended up at least 5 times worse than their worst case scenario projection.

To say that "means nothing" is just bizarre to be honest. The projections clearly failed.

So it's NPHET's fault government ignored them? Tell me this what we're governments own projections that supported their stance to keep things open?

Bubbaclaus

smurgen wrote: »

Means nothing when they still advocated level 5.

Government obviously made a decision based on NPHET projections, and the situation has ended up at least 5 times worse than their worst case scenario projection.

To say that "means nothing" is just bizarre to be honest. The projections clearly failed.

smurgen

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

You mean these warnings from the experts? Looks like the situation has ended up 5 times worse that their worst case scenario projection.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/coronavirus-cases-could-reach-1200-a-day-after-christmas-expert-warns-1046100.html

Means nothing when they still advocated level 5.

Bubbaclaus

FrancieBrady wrote: »

That is a constant through all lockdowns. Everyone from SF to the Government made the same mistakes.

It does not excuse the lack of restrictions when the experts knew and warned what would happen if they were not there Maryanne.

Please stop embarrassing yourself.

You mean these warnings from the experts? Looks like the situation has ended up 5 times worse that their worst case scenario projection.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/coronavirus-cases-could-reach-1200-a-day-after-christmas-expert-warns-1046100.html

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/gardai-break-up-house-party-22999761

Francie....... wake up.:p

The fecking government themselves were doing that during the first lockdown Brendi.

I.E. That has been going on since the start and does not explain why we have spectacularly lost control of the numbers since the government lifted/relaxed restrictions against the advice of experts.

The clue is in the sentence above.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Everyone is responsible except those with the responsibility for issuing restrictions you mean.

'Blame the people blame the people' simply will not wash here. Why have experts or lock downs at all if it's down to the people alone.

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/gardai-break-up-house-party-22999761

Francie....... wake up.:p

FrancieBrady

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

We know personally responsibility doesn't really exist in some posters heads here.

They expect the government to house people, feed them, clothe them etc etc for free.

I wouldn't even bother trying to explain that everyone is responsible for their own actions.

We know these political parties and their followers just blame the government for everything.

Everyone is responsible except those with the responsibility for issuing restrictions you mean.

'Blame the people blame the people' simply will not wash here. Why have experts or lock downs at all if it's down to the people alone.

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

Because some people are incapable of using common sense. They are so used to not having to make any decisions, because others will do so for them.

That is a constant through all lockdowns. Everyone from SF to the Government made the same mistakes.

It does not excuse the lack of restrictions when the experts knew and warned what would happen if they were not there Maryanne.

Please stop embarrassing yourself.

[Deleted User]

A fella that was in the government that caused the arse to fall out of the country (leading to crippling austerity, emigration, and suicides) a decade ago, is again reasonable for many, many, needless deaths and suffering...

I stand well and truly aghast.

That auld adage is alive and well - "You can only fall upwards in Irish politics."

I would say something about the people that cast even a single preference for Fianna Fáil but I like Boards too much and don't wish to be escorted out the door.

RandomViewer

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

We know personally responsibility doesn't really exist in some posters heads here.

They expect the government to house people, feed them, clothe them etc etc for free.

I wouldn't even bother trying to explain that everyone is responsible for their own actions.

We know these political parties and their followers just blame the government for everything.

I heard yesterday that a school bus company's drivers tested positive before Christmas but the still drove the buses, why isn't the government making examples of people like this, when there is little or no repercussions people will flout the law,

Jinglejangle69

smurgen wrote: »

So if people get covid they're to blame? People who get covid are irresponsible maybe deserve it even?

Yeah that's not what I said at all so...

Now that you mention it, of course its SOME people's fault if they catch it.

Even my 5 year old can grasp this concept.

Jinglejangle69

smurgen wrote: »

And Bloomberg

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1347873752000962566?s=19

Ah yes Italy, a country who has handled the pandemic so well ay!!

Laughable you actually think we are been frowned upon by countries who are doing worst than us.

Some great bashing your own country just to score political points going on.

Bravo.

smurgen

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

We know personally responsibility doesn't really exist in some posters heads here.

They expect the government to house people, feed them, clothe them etc etc for free.

I wouldn't even bother trying to explain that everyone is responsible for their own actions.

We know these political parties and their followers just blame the government for everything.

So if people get covid they're to blame? People who get covid are irresponsible maybe deserve it even?

Jinglejangle69

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Who else is to blame?

We know personally responsibility doesn't really exist in some posters heads here.

They expect the government to house people, feed them, clothe them etc etc for free.

I wouldn't even bother trying to explain that everyone is responsible for their own actions.

We know these political parties and their followers just blame the government for everything.

smurgen

Our grand Christmas reopening made news in italy.

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1347900374959738883?s=19

smurgen

smurgen wrote: »

Always interesting to see what international assessment is on ireland.

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1347872405373538304?s=19

And Bloomberg

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1347873752000962566?s=19

smurgen

Always interesting to see what international assessment is on ireland.

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1347872405373538304?s=19

[Deleted User]

[QUOTE=FrancieBrady;115862316]SO WHY DO WE NEED RESTRICTIONS at all Maryanne.

The restrictions have a purpose, they were lifted by a government who decided to lift them against the expert advice.

Own it, it is why we are where we are.[/QUOTE]

Because some people are incapable of using common sense. They are so used to not having to make any decisions, because others will do so for them.

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

We’re in the middle of the worst pandemic in living memory. We’re inundated with information and warnings. We all know what to do to keep ourselves and our loved ones safe. Surely to goodness we’re mature enough to do the right thing. Though, it seems not.

SO WHY DO WE NEED RESTRICTIONS at all Maryanne.

The restrictions have a purpose, they were lifted by a government who decided to lift them against the expert advice.

Own it, it is why we are where we are.

[Deleted User]

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Those with the responsibility to respond to the 'expert advice'. The experts who recognise that restrictions are necessary.

We’re in the middle of the worst pandemic in living memory. We’re inundated with information and warnings. We all know what to do to keep ourselves and our loved ones safe. Surely to goodness we’re mature enough to do the right thing. Though, it seems not.

FrancieBrady

Deleted User wrote: »

Who else is to blame?

Those with the responsibility to respond to the 'expert advice'. The experts who recognise that restrictions are necessary.

[Deleted User]

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The facts folk here are running away from fast. Blame the people, blame the people.

Who else is to blame?

FrancieBrady

Fann Linn wrote: »

Didn't Holohan advise that we could have Xmas with our families or Xmas with hospitality but we couldn't have both.
Govt thought we could.

The facts folk here are running away from fast. Blame the people, blame the people.

Fann Linn

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Martins government foolishly expected people to exercise personal responsibility. We’re now paying the price for his naivety.
Imagine, 100 teenagers having a birthday party in a shed without any responsible adult knowing of it? Mammies, daddies, teenage children going to one Nanas for Christmas dinner along with aunties, uncles and cousins, then the other Nanas for Stephens Day, again with multiple families attending.

Didn't Holohan advise that we could have Xmas with our families or Xmas with hospitality but we couldn't have both.
Govt thought we could.

[Deleted User]

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where is the sensationalism?

Martin's government relaxed restrictions against the advice, cases skyrocketed. Exactly in line with the facts. It is a sensational increase, but not sensationalist to report those facts.

Martins government foolishly expected people to exercise personal responsibility. We’re now paying the price for his naivety.
Imagine, 100 teenagers having a birthday party in a shed without any responsible adult knowing of it? Mammies, daddies, teenage children going to one Nanas for Christmas dinner along with aunties, uncles and cousins, then the other Nanas for Stephens Day, again with multiple families attending.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Sensational journalism right there. Many awards await the author.

Where is the sensationalism?

Martin's government relaxed restrictions against the advice, cases skyrocketed. Exactly in line with the facts. It is a sensational increase, but not sensationalist to report those facts.