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Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VIII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

ancapailldorcha

This thread is a continuation of the megathreads for discussing the presidency of Donald Trump and any matters which relate to this.

Please keep discussion civil and constructive and bear the charter in mind before posting.

Update 23/9/20:

Threadbanned users:

Outlaw Pete
everlast75
mcmoustache
lawrencesummers
RIGOLO

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dogbert27

aloyisious wrote: »

Reported statement from Trump "there will be an orderly transition of power on the 20th". Thing is, how long will it be before he issues a reversal announcement? He's made anything he says unbelievable except to the believers.

Is it direct statement from Trump or Trump's office?

kilns

He is just trying to save his ass from the 25th amendment, so that he will be able to run again

Dohnjoe

dogbert27 wrote: »

Is it direct statement from Trump or Trump's office?

From his media aide Scavino

"Even though I totally disagree with the outcome of the election, and the facts bear me out, nevertheless there will be an orderly transition on January 20th. I have always said we would continue our fight to ensure that only legal votes were counted. While this represents the end of the greatest first term in presidential history, it’s only the beginning of our fight to Make America Great Again!”

dogbert27

kilns wrote: »

He is just trying to save his ass from the 25th amendment, so that he will be able to run again

Dohnjoe wrote: »

From his media aide Scavino

"Even though I totally disagree with the outcome of the election, and the facts bear me out, nevertheless there will be an orderly transition on January 20th. I have always said we would continue our fight to ensure that only legal votes were counted. While this represents the end of the greatest first term in presidential history, it’s only the beginning of our fight to Make America Great Again!”

His statement is still showing he's living in a fantasy and would give support to the 25th amendment

check_six

Detritus70 wrote: »

The FBI is looking for photos, videos and any kind of leads on the breach of the Capitol, so I am hoping that there will be some consequences to their actions.

https://twitter.com/FBIWFO/status/1347047483541749762?s=20

The FBI are looking for instigators of violence? Really?

I've got a hot tip for them about a ringleader fellow currently living in 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue in a big house that's painted white. I can't see why he isn't chained up right now. He declared that he would lead them up to the Captiol Building in his rally. Naturally, his innate cowardice prompted him to slink away before they rolled up there. I think the time for protocol or tradition is past. Yesterday was the culmination of years of outrageous and illegal behaviour and he needs to be taken into custody to put a halt to his gallop.

Hurrache

Kiith wrote: »

or at least he said he'd have an orderly handover of power. stop that.

That ship has long sailed and sunk.

listermint

So took a screen grab of what is clearly a semi-automatic weapon in the style of an MP5 or similar. This shot is from around the 5.55 mark in the ITV report from inside the capital building last night.

The camera is outside the chamber where the female rioter was shot and killed. These guns are on the outside of the chamber so it appears the cops inside **** out for obvious reasons. The guy pictured appear also the carrying some brown hold all on his back.

And there is republican shams claiming this was BLM or antifa. This is the MO of the proud buys . Terrorists .

https://mobile.twitter.com/itvnews/status/1346952339886923786
https://twitter.com/itvnews/status/1346952339886923786

Image

seamus

An orderly transition of power is supposed to start when it's clear who the winner is.

He's saying that to avoid going completely over the line into sedition. In effect that he personally won't do anything to prevent transition of power. I expect a conflicting statement to his supporters though.

It was Gavan Reilly or Richard Chambers who succintly pointed out; If they couldn't defend the inside of Capitol Hill yesterday, how do they expect to defend an inauguration outside in two weeks?

I'm guessing they'll opt for something more low-key, both for Covid reasons and security reasons. JFK's successor was inaugurated on AF1 so it doesn't have to be a big public event.

Hermy

kilns wrote: »

It was obvious to the dog on the street that Trump was going to whip them up and then something was going to happen and yet they were not prepared with required number of police.

Even if Trump were the epitome of diplomacy it still beggars belief that the US parliament is (or was yesterday) so porous.

steddyeddy

Do you know what amazes me. I used to work in Los Alamos, a government lab famous for building the atomic bomb. There was an incident a few years back where some protestors climbed the fence and ran towards an administration building. They encountered two armed security guards who chased and eventually caught them. Those guards were fired for not shooting these protestors on site. It was felt that Los Alamos was shown to be a extremely weak security and therefore, an attractive target for America's enemies.

These cops have done exactly that. To them and most of the American public the worst thing they have done is shown bias towards the red neck side of America. In reality they've demonstrated that if you dress and look a certain way then access to government buildings would be relatively straightforward. America's many enemies are looking at this and laughing.

abff

As has happened many times over the past four years, I’m totally appalled by yesterday’s events, but not at all surprised. I don’t know whether to be more dismayed by Trump’s behaviour or by the stupidity of the MAGA wearing brigade or the behaviour of those Republicans (in particular Ted Cruz) who decided to jump on the bandwagon despite knowing that there is absolutely no substance to Trump’s allegations.

I think each and every one of them is a f*cking disgrace.

Leroy42

Man that lied for two months and roused his supporters to attack and occupy government buildings issues statement that he has decided that he will transition peacefully!

And people are actually giving this any actual attention?

He had plenty of opportunities to do what was best for the country, but he chose not to.

Yesterday will be his legacy. When anyone talks about Trump, people storming the Capital building will be what is talked about.

The man that stated his presidency by claiming that US cities were in carnage, has managed to bring that carnage to the capital itself.

PropJoe10

seamus wrote: »

An orderly transition of power is supposed to start when it's clear who the winner is.

He's saying that to avoid going completely over the line into sedition. In effect that he personally won't do anything to prevent transition of power. I expect a conflicting statement to his supporters though.

It was Gavan Reilly or Richard Chambers who succintly pointed out; If they couldn't defend the inside of Capitol Hill yesterday, how do they expect to defend an inauguration outside in two weeks?

I'm guessing they'll opt for something more low-key, both for Covid reasons and security reasons. JFK's successor was inaugurated on AF1 so it doesn't have to be a big public event.

In my view, he crossed that line weeks ago. He has been purposely undermining the validity of a legitimate election to serve his own interests. That is a total betrayal of the oath that he took as President.

Nothing that he can say or do can change that fact now. He should've come out weeks ago, acknowledged that his lawsuits had failed and accepted the will of the people. He's nothing but an absolute disgrace to his office.

FreudianSlippers

kilns wrote: »

Serious questions need to be asked about how they easily got in to the capital building.

It was obvious to the dog on the street that Trump was going to whip them up and then something was going to happen and yet they were not prepared with required number of police.

As many ave said previously, if that was BLM protest and they did the same thing, you would have seen Troops on the ground and many many deaths

Something really stinks

They were let in. There are videos of them opening the barriers for them and Capitol Hill Police took selfies with them inside the building.

Kiith

Leroy42 wrote: »

Man that lied for two months and roused his supporters to attack and occupy government buildings issues statement that he has decided that he will transition peacefully!

Ah here...been a lot longer then that

aloyisious

If Trump says he has no responsibility for yesterday attack by his supporters, he cant walk back his "We'll walk to the Capitol" part of his speech to his people who then went on to the Capitol and wrecked it. Really he sank any claim of legitimacy there might have been in the "stolen election" claims he's made to his supporters by those five words that he was going to stand with them all the way to the Capitol. Those are the words to put at the top of any charge sheet laid against him in respect of incitement to sedition and riot against the republic, to prove intended complicity on his part in the attack on the Capitol. He then went on to betray even those followers of his by scuttling off back to his rooms in the White House to watch the unfolding attack on, secure in the knowledge that federal forces were outside the rooms to protect him from attack by a like-minded mob.

kowloon

I have to wonder what kind of forbidden loot was taken by the mob. Given all the sensitive documents lying about it's probably for the best that none of them can read.

Hurrache

kowloon wrote: »

I have to wonder what kind of forbidden loot was taken by the mob. Given all the sensitive documents lying about it's probably for the best that none of them can read.

All the computers in that place with easily accessible USB ports, it's a nightmare for the NSA.

VinLieger

Hurrache wrote: »

All the computers in that place with easily accessible USB ports, it's a nightmare for the NSA.

Yup also consider the 2 pipe bombs left at each parties headquarters, imagine then having to comb the entire capitol building for similar possibilities hidden literally anywhere.

Capt'n Midnight

rosser44 wrote: »

Theres no way they leave him in power for thew next 2 weeks. He's shown he'll go all the way and can't be controlled

If he is removed from office then Pence will become president and will pardon him.

And he'll then play the "stabbed in the back" card, as was done in Germany after WWI.

Leave him there. Insist on written orders. Query the orders with Attorney General and anyone else you can think of, then Query them with him again. Ask congress for additional funds to carry out the orders.

Just run the clock down on him.

strandroad

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If he is removed from office then Pence will become president and will pardon him.

Why would Pence pardon him after what transpired?

Tchaikovsky

strandroad wrote: »

Why would Pence pardon him after what transpired?

Yeah I think that bridge has been burned.

Itssoeasy

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If he is removed from office then Pence will become president and will pardon him.

And he'll then play the "stabbed in the back" card, as was done in Germany after WWI.

Leave him there. Insist on written orders. Query the orders with Attorney General and anyone else you can think of, then Query them with him again. Ask congress for additional funds to carry out the orders.

Just run the clock down on him.

Before yesterday I’d have said pence would have pardoned him but pence several broke with trump last night(this morning our time) and yes it should have happened way earlier but I doubt pence would do it now.

I stayed up till 1am just to see what the senate would say when it resumed and pence wasn’t messing around. I find it interesting that pence and other senior offficials went over trumps head to get the area secured.

John O.Groats

With less than 2 weeks to go until Biden is inaugurated I can`t see Pence formally taking over from Trump but I think any orders that Trump may give from now on will be ignored.

Sparko

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I stayed up till 1am just to see what the senate would say when it resumed and pence wasn’t messing around. I find it interesting that pence and other senior offficials went over trumps head to get the area secured.

I'm curious about this element, Pence being the one to authorize deploying the National Guard. Is that a power the VP has, or did Trump have to give some sort of approval? Or did Pence just plow ahead regardless? Absolutely the right decision but I'm just wondering legally speaking did he have right to do it.

FreudianSlippers

Hurrache wrote: »

All the computers in that place with easily accessible USB ports, it's a nightmare for the NSA.

I'd be fairly confident that one cannot just walk up to a computer in the Capitol Building and just stick a USB key in and download/upload whatever you want.

Hurrache

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'd be fairly confident that one cannot just walk up to a computer in the Capital Building and just stick a USB key in and download/upload whatever you want.

Yesterday you would have been fairly confident one cannot just walk into the Capitol Building and put your feet up at Pelosi's desk.

I never said you could just download/upload whatever you want, I said it was a security risk.

FreudianSlippers

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If he is removed from office then Pence will become president and will pardon him.

And he'll then play the "stabbed in the back" card, as was done in Germany after WWI.

Leave him there. Insist on written orders. Query the orders with Attorney General and anyone else you can think of, then Query them with him again. Ask congress for additional funds to carry out the orders.

Just run the clock down on him.

I agree with this, plus I don't think there is enough support for 25A even if Pence wanted to (and there's no real signs other than pure speculation that he does). I don't see any reason at all not to impeach him first thing today though. Gaetz and others were all for impeaching Obama retrospectively, so I don't see any good reason that logic cannot be followed in trying Trump after he leaves office pursuant to Art II S4 and disqualifying him from holding and enjoying any office of the United States.

FreudianSlippers

Hurrache wrote: »

Yesterday you would have been fairly confident one cannot just walk into the Capitol Building and put your feet up at Pelosi's desk.

I never said you could just download/upload whatever you want, I said it was a security risk.

Depends on the qualifying question: are the CH police going to open the gates for you and let you right in?

Christy42

Hurrache wrote: »

Yesterday you would have been fairly confident one cannot just walk into the Capitol Building and put your feet up at Pelosi's desk.

I never said you could just download/upload whatever you want, I said it was a security risk.

I mean it seems likely that anyone who got a foreign operative into the crowd would have a fair shot at getting something. Documents were available, some computers were left unlocked. I would bet on someone who knew what they were about getting something they shouldn't.

Not saying it happened or indeed that they would get something critical but the US just left itself far, far more vulnerable than it should have