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Random EV thoughts.....

Old diesel

The main motors forum has the motors chat thread for the little things one would like to say but might not justify a thread.

Thought it might be an idea for here re hybrids and EV stuff.....

To kick off - i wonder if a new measurement for EVs might be assuming a start trip at 100 percent......

A how much range do you get with a 15 minute stop.

With a 350 kw charging a Porsche Tayman might do very well with getting on for 400 miles...

A Leaf 62 not so good.

Obviously where a car can do more then 50 kw charging we would need both a 50 kw and a whatever the cars top rate is figure*.

*IF chargers are available

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vicM

Dohvolle wrote: »

VRT rules for all vehicles from the UK will change on Jan 1st. They will be treated the same as importing a vehicle from any other 3rd Country (i.e the USA). So Vat on vehicle and shipping plus VRT. CoC may be required for all UK sourced vehicles also.(given that the no longer need to comply with EU emission regulations).

https://www.revenue.ie/en/customs-traders-and-agents/brexit/information-for-businesses/vrt-implications-of-trade-with-the-uk/index.aspx

That link pertains to the transition period before a deal was struck. Movement of goods between the UK and EU seems to have been left as is with more stringent checks.
My understanding is that you should be able to go to the UK and buy a good without incurring any extra penalties. Of course more details will be revealed after a more through perusal of the 1000+ page agreement document

vicM

Dohvolle wrote: »

you seem to have ignored the bit that says:

No I didnt. Maybe you are right. My opinion is when revenue put up that link in feb 2020, absolutely that was the case. Now things are a bit different and ill give it about about 2 weeks into the new year and check for an update from revenue

NIMAN

Yeah why would they use the word 'may' be subject to vrt and customs duty.

It either is it it isn't applicable.

MJohnston

Dohvolle wrote: »

you seem to have ignored the bit that says:

The problem with that quote is it essentially says “we don’t know yet, check back later”, and it’s the “later” but that the OP was asking about

MJohnston

Dohvolle wrote: »

The deal was agreed on Christmas Eve, most of the EU ambassadors have not seen it yet, let alone made a decision on it. How do you expect revenue could magically predict the outcome?

I don’t expect Revenue to have anything updated yet, but the full deal text is out there, so it’s reasonable enough for the OP to ask if anything more is now known

the_amazing_raisin

MJohnston wrote: »

I don’t expect Revenue to have anything updated yet, but the full deal text is out there, so it’s reasonable enough for the OP to ask if anything more is now known

Well I guess it's worth saying that the default outcome is still currently no deal, since both the UK and EU parliament need to approve the deal before January 1st, so the current text from revenue still applies

In terms of the text of the deal, it promises zero tariffs and quotas between the UK and EU, so customs duty shouldn't apply to used car. However the EU rules of origin still apply, so if the UK starts using imported parts in their cars then they'll be liable for customs

The big question is around VAT, whether you'll have to pay VAT on a used car import into the EU. I haven't really seen anything about it either way, hopefully the deal will allow used cars to be VAT exempt

Black_Knight

This is why you buy CCS! At cashel charging at ionity while a leaf is sitting on CHAdeMO the last 30 minutes, and an i3 on AC this last 20 minutes.

kanuseeme

Black_Knight wrote: »

This is why you buy CCS! At cashel charging at ionity while a leaf is sitting on CHAdeMO the last 30 minutes, and an i3 on AC this last 20 minutes.

How long are you sitting on CCS?

Black_Knight

Seems charge point app doesn't give you a current charging status. I started charge from the app, but seems I can't see where to stop it

Black_Knight

kanuseeme wrote: »

How long are you sitting on CCS?

15 minutes maybe

kennethsmyth

Black_Knight wrote: »

This is why you buy CCS! At cashel charging at ionity while a leaf is sitting on CHAdeMO the last 30 minutes, and an i3 on AC this last 20 minutes.

Nothing badly wrong with that so long as leaf leaves at 45 and i3 gets 11kw at ac.

Black_Knight

kennethsmyth wrote: »

Nothing badly wrong with that so long as leaf leaves at 45 and i3 gets 11kw at ac.

Perhaps they did. Leaf left, and i3 didn't switch over. Left shortly after.

the_amazing_raisin

Surely the i3 could use the CCS at Ionity as well?

McGiver

Dohvolle wrote:

VRT rules for all vehicles from the UK will change on Jan 1st. They will be treated the same as importing a vehicle from any other 3rd Country (i.e the USA). So Vat on vehicle and shipping plus VRT. CoC may be required for all UK sourced vehicles also.(given that the no longer need to comply with EU emission regulations).

Yep, CoC will be the biggest issue making imports very difficult (or costly i.e. custom agent will need to be paid to do the paperwork).

With regards to the Vat - would it be possible to buy the car VAT free in the UK? And then pay the Irish Vat to the revenue?

McGiver

Dohvolle wrote:

VRT rules for all vehicles from the UK will change on Jan 1st. They will be treated the same as importing a vehicle from any other 3rd Country (i.e the USA). So Vat on vehicle and shipping plus VRT. CoC may be required for all UK sourced vehicles also.(given that the no longer need to comply with EU emission regulations).

McGiver

vicM wrote:

My understanding is that you should be able to go to the UK and buy a good without incurring any extra penalties. Of course more details will be revealed after a more through perusal of the 1000+ page agreement document

No penalties. But you'll have to pay Irish VAT. And the biggest issue is the certificate of conformance, good luck with that.

Laviski

Black_Knight wrote: »

This is why you buy CCS! At cashel charging at ionity while a leaf is sitting on CHAdeMO the last 30 minutes, and an i3 on AC this last 20 minutes.

What is your complaint exactly??? As other have stated, provided they move on after 45 min there is nothing to see here... So why you complain?

Gripe that will continue to get worse I think is ice cars just parking in the space. Along with electric vehicles parked up and not charging cause the space is convenient. That should be putting your panties in a twist.

Already had a number of recent incidents where cars were parked and not charging, these were ccs too.

Old diesel

Surely when there's 5 k of easy money for revenue in your back pocket - they will find a way of realising that an Audi sold new in UK pre 31/12/2020 was EU rules compliant as standard.

Yeah I know it's not that simple but still.

Old diesel

Also how do the jap imports get in.

the_amazing_raisin

Old diesel wrote: »

Also how do the jap imports get in.

There's a free trade agreement between EU and Japan which covers car imports as far as I know

Old diesel

cruisey1987 wrote: »

There's a free trade agreement between EU and Japan which covers car imports as far as I know

I mean re certificate of conformity.

UK has an EU trade deal now as well

the_amazing_raisin

McGiver wrote: »

No penalties. But you'll have to pay Irish VAT. And the biggest issue is the certificate of conformance, good luck with that.

Might as well buy new in the UK in that case, I believe a dealership doesn't need to charge VAT of they provide proof of export, so at least you won't get hit with double vat payments

I'm guessing with a used car the original vat payment can't be reclaimed if the car is exported

Buying used from northern ireland is probably the only path that makes sense since they're in the EU vat zone, I could see a few importers setting up shop there to bring in UK cars via NI

the_amazing_raisin

Old diesel wrote: »

I mean re certificate of conformity.

UK has an EU trade deal now as well

Ah I get you, not sure on that front

I'm guessing only professional importers are bringing in cars from Japan, unless someone really wants to drive a car back across Asia and Europe (it'd be one hell of a road trip)

Given that's the case I assume they have the knowledge and resources to get the CoC and factor that into the price

markpb

Laviski wrote: »

What is your complaint exactly??? As other have stated, provided they move on after 45 min there is nothing to see here... So why you complain?

A quick glance at the eCars map shows apparent decent coverage. What it doesn’t show is that almost all of those are single points of failure when it comes to actually making a journey. All it takes is one car getting there just ahead of you and now your trip is at least 45 minutes longer. Two cars ahead of you and you’re adding in two hours. There’s a reason why Ionity and Tesla and every petrol station in the entire world build multi-stall sites.

Black_Knight

Laviski wrote: »

What is your complaint exactly??? As other have stated, provided they move on after 45 min there is nothing to see here... So why you complain?

Gripe that will continue to get worse I think is ice cars just parking in the space. Along with electric vehicles parked up and not charging cause the space is convenient. That should be putting your panties in a twist.

Already had a number of recent incidents where cars were parked and not charging, these were ccs too.

Was I complaining? I'll get my "panties in a twist" when I experience iceing or eving, but as yet that's never happened when I needed to charge.

Merely stating that because of ecars single unit per site I could of been waiting on that leaf and possibly the i3 if they wanted to switch to DC charging. Instead because I've CCS I went to ionity. My 20 minute stop could of been an hour if I was in a leaf.

Black_Knight

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Surely the i3 could use the CCS at Ionity as well?

Didn't know they had 11kW AC charging. Maybe that was enough for them given the price difference between ionity and ecars. Without knowing about chargepoint or maingau you'd be comparing 33c Vs 79c per kWh. When you can't benefit from the 175kW on tap at ionity is a hard sell.

I didn't care. It cost me €6+ Vs €3+ to get home after the holidays. I'll get over it.

the_amazing_raisin

Black_Knight wrote: »

Was I complaining? I'll get my "panties in a twist" when I experience iceing or eving, but as yet that's never happened when I needed to charge.

Merely stating that because of ecars single unit per site I could of been waiting on that leaf and possibly the i3 if they wanted to switch to DC charging. Instead because I've CCS I went to ionity. My 20 minute stop could of been an hour if I was in a leaf.

Nothing beats redundancy

However, it does seem the Ionity chargers in Ireland are a bit prone to failures, seen a few people complaining about the chargers waiting for power

I've been checking on the city north Ionity and noticed that there always seems to be 1 of 2 (not 4, letting the side down Ionity) chargers out of action

It feels a bit like the Ionity chargers don't have the best grid connection, almost as if the company which controls those connections was also running a competing charging network...

the_amazing_raisin

Black_Knight wrote: »

Didn't know they had 11kW AC charging. Maybe that was enough for them given the price difference between ionity and ecars. Without knowing about chargepoint or maingau you'd be comparing 33c Vs 79c per kWh. When you can't benefit from the 175kW on tap at ionity is a hard sell.

I didn't care. It cost me €6+ Vs €3+ to get home after the holidays. I'll get over it.

This is where the whole Ionity is expensive falls apart when it's still around the same price as coffee and a donut from the shop

I feel like we should modify "buy cheap, buy twice" for EV charging

"Charge cheap, wait twice as long"

liamog

Dohvolle wrote: »

Now that the UK is not part of the EU they won't be charging what we call VAT. They may call it a sales tax of some sort, but that's up to them. It won't be VAT.
But VAT will be charged at the point of entry to the EU for all goods from a 3rd Country.(i.e, the UK)
You are going to pay VAT on arrival here to Revenue.ie

VAT isn't an uniquely EU thing it's common across much of world. As far as I'm aware the UK hasn't indicated a desire to move from a VAT system to a final sales system (sales tax)

Black_Knight

cruisey1987 wrote: »

This is where the whole Ionity is expensive falls apart when it's still around the same price as coffee and a donut from the shop

I feel like we should modify "buy cheap, buy twice" for EV charging

"Charge cheap, wait twice as long"

And here I bought teas and coffees with pastries while I charged. A Mad man so I am