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The Dominance of Dublin GAA Mod warning post#1

seligehgit

Discussion of all matters relating to this contentious subject is welcome and the potential implications of same.This thread is solely for this purpose.

There appears to be a perception that the moderators are attempting to shut down discussion of this topic and direct same off to a low traffic stickied thread.Nothing could be further from the truth.Our sole motive was to confine discussion to a single thread and prevent cross thread posting which was adversely affecting the enjoyment of fellow posters.

Can we please keep posts civil and constructive in nature.

The Changes in the GAA-super thread is now for discussion of all other suggested reforms not relating to Dublin GAA.

Extra Mod Warning:
Right, a separate warning to both sides in this debate:
Firstly, any more mentioning of "financial doping" or any intimation that rules have been broken by Dublin or that Dublin have cheated are banned from now on. You can debate the issue of the funding that Dublin have received without resorting to that. There is zero evidence of it and posting about it will be considered trolling from here on in.

Secondly, this topic is, like it or not, a big talking point in gaelic football at the moment. You are more than welcome to argue your point, but posting in this thread to simply mock those on the other side or complaining about the topic is known as thread spoiling and is specifically banned in the charter (see point 8 here). No one is forcing you to click on this thread and no one is forcing you to post in it. If you don't like the topic, then don't post. It's as simple as that.

This thread is here so that all the discussion is in one place and it won't filter into other threads. This makes it easier to ignore for posters who don't really want to be involved in it. As a result, we haven't really been moderating it as severely as other threads. However, a number of posts recently from both sides are sailing too close to the wind and getting borderline personal. So please take a minute before you hit submit to ensure that your post won't fall foul of the rules. We'll have no hesitation in issuing cards and/or threadbans to posters who fail to heed this warning.

Please report any posts that you feel break the rules.

Any questions, please feel free to PM the mods.

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[Deleted User]

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but on the Official Program for the match the list of people in the Dublin "backroom" comes to 29.

The list of people in the Mayo "backroom" comes to 18, and some of them are double jobs like coach/selector.

So straight away you can see that Dublin have a much bigger staff for the same job, running an intercounty team of 30 odd players.

Why don't Mayo get another 11 people you ask.

Simple answer, they can't afford it.

And that's the dominance of Dublin in a nutshell.

The Lost Sheep

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but on the Official Program for the match the list of people in the Dublin "backroom" comes to 29.

The list of people in the Mayo "backroom" comes to 18, and some of them are double jobs like coach/selector.

So straight away you can see that Dublin have a much bigger staff for the same job, running an intercounty team of 30 odd players.

Why don't Mayo get another 11 people you ask.

Simple answer, they can't afford it.

And that's the dominance of Dublin in a nutshell.

Many of the hurling sides have as big a backroom team as Dublins footballers so you cant say its not possible for more counties to have bigger back room teams if they want to.

tritium

lawred2 wrote: »

It's a non event because most clubs don't prioritize football. They play hurling.

Football in Cork is predominately played on one peninsula.

Kerry's domination of Munster and their success at AI level is historic and not a recent phenomena. And certainly not something that could possibly be linked to the focused and direct application of central funding..

No, funding had nothing to do with Kerry’s success. Nothing at all. Sure don’t they donate the sponsorship money from Kerry group to charity for the last 3 decades. And Mickos backhanders from Adidas were used to light candles in a church in Killarney.

No no, nothing to see here at all....

I don’t see why any county would prioritise football in Munster when the Munster council are happy to seed the draw to make sure their two cash cows come out on top- or even parachute them directly into the final. Tipp this year showed there’s potential for football in Munster but don’t worry, it will choked out soon rather than nurtured

Like Chelsea whining about other teams having money......

tritium

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

dublin hadn't won an all ireland since 95, and 82 (?) before that. was there a huge drive, financially in excess of all other counties, to accelerate dublin to meet their counterparts at that time? being around the late 00's

Equally was there an issue with the level of funding dublin had received prior to that? Does anyone have an historic allocation of GAA funds? Certainly growing up I remember many friends anecdotally felt Dublin got a raw deal from the GAA- basically use them as a revenue stream but not actually care about the fairly unique problems they faced

tritium

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

sport wise, none of the big ones. being soccer, rugby, cricket. all those sports are amongst a select 10 maybe.
but is there 1 dominating the rest? absolutely not. money is distributed fairly to keep the competition and grow the game.

i think i answered my own question there, there aint no growing the game internationally so make hay while they sun shines shall be by cynical view

All blacks in rugby with be comparable or better- they’ve a win rate of something like 80% over a hundred years or so

Here’s a good article
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/tremlettonsport.wordpress.com/2020/11/07/7-most-dominant-sports-teams/amp/

ooter

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but on the Official Program for the match the list of people in the Dublin "backroom" comes to 29.

The list of people in the Mayo "backroom" comes to 18, and some of them are double jobs like coach/selector.

So straight away you can see that Dublin have a much bigger staff for the same job, running an intercounty team of 30 odd players.

Why don't Mayo get another 11 people you ask.

Simple answer, they can't afford it.

And that's the dominance of Dublin in a nutshell.

Maybe if the Dublin senior hurlers ever get to an all ireland final we might find out in the programme how big their backroom team is.

lawred2

tritium wrote: »

No, funding had nothing to do with Kerry’s success. Nothing at all. Sure don’t they donate the sponsorship money from Kerry group to charity for the last 3 decades. And Mickos backhanders from Adidas were used to light candles in a church in Killarney.

No no, nothing to see here at all....

I don’t see why any county would prioritise football in Munster when the Munster council are happy to seed the draw to make sure their two cash cows come out on top- or even parachute them directly into the final. Tipp this year showed there’s potential for football in Munster but don’t worry, it will choked out soon rather than nurtured

Like Chelsea whining about other teams having money......

right...

and what about central funding?

your point about Chelsea is puerile - a real equivalent would be the premier league disproportionately disbursing central funds to one single football club.

tritium

lawred2 wrote: »

right...

and what about central funding?

your point about Chelsea is puerile - a real equivalent would be the premier league disproportionately disbursing central funds to one single football club.

Do they pay central funding in a different currency or something?

Kerry have decades of financial doping behind them but suddenly money is an issue because they’re not the only cat in town. All the while Micko going misty eyed about the shkill in their blood- pure horse ****

Again do you have the historic funding allocation to see if Dublin traditionally got a fair allocation or had it been neglected?

While we’re at it, why don’t you tell us what a fair allocation actually is in your view? Per capita? Per player? Per club? Would it be fair if a club with 100 players had a dedicated GPO and a club with 1000 players also had a single GPO for example?

What about population? -Cork has half a million people but is in many ways a GAA basket case. Why hasn’t population pushed them to the top of the pile? Is cork too big to be fair to everyone else? Population wise we see comparable relative differences to at least the first 6or 7 counties in many sports with no issue

[Deleted User]

tritium wrote: »

Kerry have decades of financial doping behind them but suddenly money is an issue because they’re not the only cat in town. All the while Micko going misty eyed about the shkill in their blood- pure horse ****

Yes, Kerry play all their games at home while receiving millions extra a year from central funding, but no one in the MSM has the guts to say it!

kilns

RoyalCelt wrote: »

That project is a token gesture and isn't anywhere near enough to save an leinster county from an annual annihilation. No leinster team will beat Dublin in championship again ever. Its no longer possible.

Token gesture by increasing the funding of Meath and Kildare by 30%

You can't have things both ways, complain about Dublins funding and yet when your county gets an increase in funding and Dublin don't, you dismiss it as it's not going to make a difference anyway.

kilns

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but on the Official Program for the match the list of people in the Dublin "backroom" comes to 29.

The list of people in the Mayo "backroom" comes to 18, and some of them are double jobs like coach/selector.

So straight away you can see that Dublin have a much bigger staff for the same job, running an intercounty team of 30 odd players.

Why don't Mayo get another 11 people you ask.

Simple answer, they can't afford it.

And that's the dominance of Dublin in a nutshell.

Can't afford it? How many of that backroom staffs get paid? Don't make statements that are not factual ly true

[Deleted User]

kilns wrote: »

Token gesture by increasing the funding of Meath and Kildare by 30%

In this context this does constitute a token gesture I'm afraid.

kilns

[Deleted User] wrote: »

In this context this does constitute a token gesture I'm afraid.

Ridiculous! but it seems some people will never change their minds and will never be satisfied

tritium

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes, Kerry play all their games at home while receiving millions extra a year from central funding, but no one in the MSM has the guts to say it!

Everything I’m mentioning is public record. It’s not really my fault if Kerry’s historical record is a bit asterisked by it as some on here are fond of implying about Dublins achievements

Strumms

Did you smash it wrote: »

There is no point continuing a competition where it has been perpetually decided one team is better than all the others.

The reason for a competition is to find out which are the best.

Dublin are the best. End or ignore the competition because it us pointless.

That’s not the reason for competition.

If that was the case, with Tiger Woods at his peak, they could have cancelled all golf competitions and tournaments for a decade, more.

There are plenty of examples in sport of lesser fancied teams beating the sure fire favorites.

In 1995, Everton who finished 15th in the league beat Manchester United in the FA Cup final. United finished 38 points ahead of Everton in the league. Were one point off winning it, one goal in fact.

In the Everton squad 6 out of 14 players had been capped Internationally, United squad 12 out of 14...

Oxford Languages Definition:
Competition : “the activity or condition of striving to gain or win something by defeating or establishing superiority over others”. It’s not to ‘find out’ anything.

jimmytwotimes 2013

tritium wrote: »

Kerry have decades of financial doping behind them but suddenly money is an issue because they’re not the only cat in town. All the while Micko going misty eyed about the shkill in their blood- pure horse ****

Ur right you know

Kerry team with the bendix washing machine, proof of money laundering.

JeffKenna

Strumms wrote: »

That’s not the reason for competition.

If that was the case, with Tiger Woods at his peak, they could have cancelled all golf competitions and tournaments for a decade, more.

There are plenty of examples in sport of lesser fancied teams beating the sure fire favorites.

In 1995, Everton who finished 15th in the league beat Manchester United in the FA Cup final. United finished 38 points ahead of Everton in the league. Were one point off winning it, one goal in fact.

In the Everton squad 6 out of 14 players had been capped Internationally, United squad 12 out of 14...

Oxford Languages Definition:
Competition : “the activity or condition of striving to gain or win something by defeating or establishing superiority over others”. It’s not to ‘find out’ anything.

Blackburn won the premiership that year. Thank god for Walkers millions!

tritium

kilns wrote: »

Token gesture by increasing the funding of Meath and Kildare by 30%

You can't have things both ways, complain about Dublins funding and yet when your county gets an increase in funding and Dublin don't, you dismiss it as it's not going to make a difference anyway.

Tbh with the population available to them Meath and Kildare hugely underachieving, in a similar way to how Dublin did in the 80s and 90s. I’d genuinely love them to use the extra funding to develop into one of the top 5 or 6 teams

tritium

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Ur right you know

Kerry team with the bendix washing machine, proof of money laundering.

I laughed to be fair

crossman47

lawred2 wrote: »

Munster is hurling country

And very competitive hurling country.

Completely erroneous to compare Munster to Leinster.

I agree. Cork usually give Kerry a game but most people in Cork don't care. Their worry is the hurlers and that's a big worry at present.

tobefrank321

The sport currently is beyond redemption for about 8 reasons.
1. No one wants to split or amalgamate.
2. Dublin will always have a significant population advantage over rivals.
3. The money will always be there in Dublin.
4. Always have home advantage.
5. Always have collective training advantage as well as economic advantage for jobs and opportunities.
6. Free centres of excellence whereas others have to mostly fund their own
7. A free stadium whereas others mostly have to fund their own
8. No costs involved with travelling to matches or overnight stays in the championship etc

Looking at that list its very hard to see which ones can be taken away.

In other words there isnt a hope in hell of other counties competing. And looking at those advantages you have to hand it to Mayo and Kerry for occassionally putting it up to Dublin in the last 10 years.

And its easy to see why the championship has no future as a competitive sport. Everyone accepts its a farce at this stage. Which is a pity.

tritium

JeffKenna wrote: »

Blackburn won the premiership that year. Thank god for Walkers millions!

United weren’t exactly poor, they’d several players who’d cost at the time British record sums

ooter

tobefrank321 wrote: »

The sport currently is beyond redemption for about 8 reasons.
1. No one wants to split or amalgamate.
2. Dublin will always have a significant population advantage over rivals.
3. The money will always be there in Dublin.
4. Always have home advantage.
5. Always have collective training advantage as well as economic advantage for jobs and opportunities.
6. Free centres of excellence whereas others have to mostly fund their own
7. A free stadium whereas others mostly have to fund their own
8. No costs involved with travelling to matches or overnight stays in the championship etc

Looking at that list its very hard to see which ones can be taken away.

In other words there isnt a hope in hell of other counties competing. And looking at those advantages you have to hand it to Mayo and Kerry for occassionally putting it up to Dublin in the last 10 years.

And its easy to see why the championship has no future as a competitive sport. Everyone accepts its a farce at this stage. Which is a pity.

The senior hurlers have all those advantages too but amazingly they've won nothing, who would've thunk it.

Strumms

tritium wrote: »

United weren’t exactly poor, they’d several players who’d cost at the time British record sums

Won the double the following year if my memory is correct.

Strumms

ooter wrote: »

The senior hurlers have all those advantages too but amazingly they've won nothing, who would've thunk it.

That’s what I call an inconvenient truth.;)

The Lost Sheep

tobefrank321 wrote: »

The sport currently is beyond redemption for about 8 reasons.
1. No one wants to split or amalgamate.
2. Dublin will always have a significant population advantage over rivals.
3. The money will always be there in Dublin.
4. Always have home advantage.
5. Always have collective training advantage as well as economic advantage for jobs and opportunities.
6. Free centres of excellence whereas others have to mostly fund their own
7. A free stadium whereas others mostly have to fund their own
8. No costs involved with travelling to matches or overnight stays in the championship etc

Looking at that list its very hard to see which ones can be taken away.

In other words there isnt a hope in hell of other counties competing. And looking at those advantages you have to hand it to Mayo and Kerry for occassionally putting it up to Dublin in the last 10 years.

And its easy to see why the championship has no future as a competitive sport. Everyone accepts its a farce at this stage. Which is a pity.

Splitting/Amalgamation shouldnt be answer.
Dublin always have had a significant population advantage over other counties and for years it did nothing to their chances and they won little for years.
Dublin do need to play outside Croke Park more but how many games do you move them to play outside. Counties in Leinster have power to get more dublin games outside Croke Park but choose not to.
Dublin dont have a free centre of excellence. They still have to pay a lot to rent facilities which costs more in long term...

Jizique

Strumms wrote: »

That’s what I call an inconvenient truth.;)

Skill will always play a bigger role in hurling

Achebe

People bringing up Dublin hurling is, and always has been, a bad faith argument. They started from a lower base and have in fact shown improvement. Also, half of their best players are on the football team.

[Deleted User]

crossman47 wrote: »

I agree. Cork usually give Kerry a game but most people in Cork don't care. Their worry is the hurlers and that's a big worry at present.

Except when they win, eh?

Deathknell

Congrats to Dublin - 6 in a row is some achievement - even if it comes at a huge damage to the reputation of the competition.

Kildare and Meath, to a lesser extent Wicklow and Louth, are all counties with similar populations to Mayo, Donegal and Kerry. How they haven't put it up to Dublin, not even once in over 10 years - seems a damning indictment to their CB 'organisation' - a monument to their uselessness.

There's blame to go - all round - The GAA have created the monster - but for the surrounding counties - all of whom have had significant population increases due to Dublin's growth - seem to be standing back and waiting for someone to do it for them.