Home heating automation

deezell wrote: »

That post is from 2017 😁

Opp's sorry new to this :-) not sure how I did that

john_doe.

Anyone know how to set schedules for a week with variation of working shift with wiser.?

My wife works different days each week and needs the bedroom warmed up days she comes home for a shower.

Was looking at IFTTT but not sure is there a way.

Like have a calendar set a schedule

JohnDeereIE wrote: »

What heating system is already in place? With the cost of a new house if the heating system is working and in good condition I would be looking at insulation etc first if that is an issue

That post is from 2017 😁

theluke79 wrote: »

Hi everybody,
we're finally buying our first house

So I am looking at options to get as much automation as possible together with a good CH/HW system in place.

I currently have a NEST(in the house we are renting).

I plan to install a combi boiler for instant HW, combined with something like EvoHome to have zoning without needing to re run all pipes.

Do you know if EvoHome deals with combi boilers?

It has to be simple and maintenance free.

What heating system is already in place? With the cost of a new house if the heating system is working and in good condition I would be looking at insulation etc first if that is an issue

john_doe.

deezell wrote: »

Cheap multipacks from Eurogiant, Polaroid brand or other. Seriously, you can pay 5 times the price per battery for so called premium cells, with only fractional increases in lifespan.

I've been using Amazon basic brand. Was also going to try eneloops rechargables I have - but drayton àdvise again that because of voltage involved in driving the motors.

The TRVs go down fast enough.

I have the eneloops n the thermostats and last good spell.

Happy enough now with drayton kit , have 10 trvs and 4 thermostats. U can add to kit easily when yearly sales come up with great discounts. Have a spare controller as was cheaper in sales to get controller with thermostats. So Disaster recovery covered.

I think the small updates they are bringing are improvements not bugs , their simple functions on app UI , but nice to see functions added.

It doesn't seem very popular over here , but it's nice bit of kit and has evolved well.

john_doe. wrote: »

Hi

What batteries do people use in their TRVs?

On seperate note , drayton seem to be updating the app bit regularly these days. Small updates but good to see it

Cheap multipacks from Eurogiant, Polaroid brand or other. Seriously, you can pay 5 times the price per battery for so called premium cells, with only fractional increases in lifespan.

Bluefoam

john_doe. wrote: »

Hi

What batteries do people use in their TRVs?

On seperate note , drayton seem to be updating the app bit regularly these days. Small updates but good to see it

Not necessarily... Small updates sometimes mean a lack of quality control in the software development and small updates can be issued to override problems caused by the previous...

Allot of firms will collate all updates and release as one.

john_doe.

Hi

What batteries do people use in their TRVs?

On seperate note , drayton seem to be updating the app bit regularly these days. Small updates but good to see it

salnado wrote: »

For some reason I can only see the Wireless receiver as an option as a zone controller, the smart thermostat for the upstairs circuit doesn't appear as an option. I have emailed Tado for help.

There are some confusing posts in the Tado forum regarding this, on the one hand explaining assignment of TRVs to a zone stat relay, on the other hand saying you can't , saying zone switching is incompatible with TRVs. I think what they're trying to say is that TRVs should be on all rads, then zone valves are not required. Raise a support call with them. I'm certain that there are users who have TRVs switching different Tado stat relays to fire the boiler.
Here is the post in question,
https://community.tado.com/en-gb/discussion/4378/yet-another-3-channel-replacement-question

deezell wrote: »

The ext kit has two relays, one for wireless connection of the Tado thermostat, and the other for controlling the timing of HW, so you get both in the one box. The Tado thermostat on its own has a built in relay, so it can be wired directly in place of an old thermostat, and you can continue to time your HW with the older controller. If you buy the extension kit later or as part of the starter kit with HW, you can use the wireless feature optionally, but in your case it will directly replace the old controller, wired in its place. The old CH stat can be removed and replaced by the new stat wired in, or wirelessly connected. The old HW stat remains in place, the Tado only controls timing of HW, not temperature.
Rad stats (TRVs) are not that expensive, €45-60 depending on special offers, but will require the fitting of a TRV type valve body on each rad if you don't already have manual TRVs on them.

House has TRV's already installed so should be direct swap.
What would you recommend in this situation? just go for the wired kit and let the old system control the hot water?
Or go all in now
Thanks again and sorry for all the questions :-)

I was recommended Tado, I guess they are the best available at the moment on market?

deezell wrote: »

You need to associate the stat relay for the zone the TRV is in to the TRV room.
On the App,
Settings/Rooms and Devices/{TRV Room Name}/Zone Controller.
On this page, choose the stat/device which calls the correct zone for that TRV. You should have a choice of two stats, or possibly one stat and the ext kit, there have been some logical changes to this since I last looked.

Remember, a single TRV will call the entire zone when it calls for heat, so its mostly used for colder rooms which 'fall behind' the main zone stat setting, or to turn off unused rooms during a general zone call.

For some reason I can only see the Wireless receiver as an option as a zone controller, the smart thermostat for the upstairs circuit doesn't appear as an option. I have emailed Tado for help.

salnado wrote: »

That worked perfectly. Everything seems to be working as it should. Thank you for the help, it was invaluable.

I have one final question. I also bought two Tado TRVs. I installed one on a radiator on the downstairs circuit (spare bedroom) and one on the upstairs circuit (in a different room to where the thermostat is). In the Tado app I have set each of those up as individual rooms. If I want them to successfully call for heat, even if the main thermostats on those circuits aren't, what do I need to do, I can't find any setting for that in the app?

You need to associate the stat relay for the zone the TRV is in to the TRV room.
On the App,
Settings/Rooms and Devices/{TRV Room Name}/Zone Controller.
On this page, choose the stat/device which calls the correct zone for that TRV. You should have a choice of two stats, or possibly one stat and the ext kit, there have been some logical changes to this since I last looked.

Remember, a single TRV will call the entire zone when it calls for heat, so its mostly used for colder rooms which 'fall behind' the main zone stat setting, or to turn off unused rooms during a general zone call.

deezell wrote: »

Yes, remove the EPH, replace with the Tado. Lift off the EPH, there's just one small screw at the bottom holding it to its baseplate.Check the wiring coming in and out. L, N, and there should be no more than three live outs to the wall/cylinder stats, and then on to the valves, which in turn collectively though their built in relays will fire the boiler when any of them open. The ext kit will replace the EPH locally for timing of HW and CH1. CH2 is first wired in the tado to L, which is always on, but then replacing CH2 stat with a wired tado stat controls the live to the CH2 valve. The timing as well as the temperature control all take placs inside the Tado stat. This is the key difference. Traditional system has a timer controller, with these timed lives then sent to a wall stat or cylinder stat for temperature control. This is combined in the Tado stats, whither wired in, or wireless via the ext kit. Only the HW retains its mechanical stat, with the ext kit supplying the HW timed live

That worked perfectly. Everything seems to be working as it should. Thank you for the help, it was invaluable.

I have one final question. I also bought two Tado TRVs. I installed one on a radiator on the downstairs circuit (spare bedroom) and one on the upstairs circuit (in a different room to where the thermostat is). In the Tado app I have set each of those up as individual rooms. If I want them to successfully call for heat, even if the main thermostats on those circuits aren't, what do I need to do, I can't find any setting for that in the app?

Alkers

John mac wrote: »

i instaled mine last weekend , no hum from the control box , the tvr's do make quite a bit of noise though ,
connection has been rock solid ,
box is about 8 M and 1 solid wall away from router ,
took me a while to figure out i had to be on the same wireless as the router to get it set up . ( i was on 5ghz ,)
once i changed to 2.4 it was easy.

Ditto, no noise form the hub but it does click on sometimes . App very stable too

John mac

i instaled mine last weekend , no hum from the control box , the tvr's do make quite a bit of noise though ,
connection has been rock solid ,
box is about 8 M and 1 solid wall away from router ,
took me a while to figure out i had to be on the same wireless as the router to get it set up . ( i was on 5ghz ,)
once i changed to 2.4 it was easy.

antomack

Just installed a Drayton Wiser 3 channel Hub R and while everything is working fine for the most part I have 3 small issue and was wondering if other Drayton users have similar experiences.

1) I am noticing a distinct pulsing hum when the heating turns on from the hub itself, the same hum doesn't occur for the Hot Water. When I first heard it I thought it sounded like water flowing.

Anyone else with Drayton Wiser notice anything similar or have any idea if it's something to worry about?

I have seen some posts on automatedhome.co.uk with others having a similar issue but nothing pointing to it being anything more than an annoyance.

2) The Hub R seems to intermittently lose connection to the router and in some cases comes back after a few minutes in other cases I've had to power it off and on before it reconnects.

3) I've found that the app keeps kicking out while I was setting up the schedules on the two zones and the hot water, probably closed 10/12 times over 20 minutes of working through the changes.

digiman wrote: »

My tank seems to be this one, I've no idea though were you mean there are little hollow tubes were you can fit the insertion stat.

The Aquastat pocket.

digiman

deezell wrote: »

Your cylinder will have little hollow tubes already fitted in it in which to insert the stat.

My tank seems to be this one, I've no idea though were you mean there are little hollow tubes were you can fit the insertion stat.

digiman wrote: »

I managed to get the Honeywell Evohome setup to control my hot water, upstairs and downstairs myself. Very happy with it so far, 2 issues left to fix though. I need to replace the existing radiator valves so that they will be able to take the fitting for the Honeywell Thermostats. Is this a job that one could do himself, I ain't no plumber, have just watched a few youtube videos where guys have frooze the incoming water supply and seal off the flow in the other direction for long enough to swap the valve.

Have a very stupid question coming up, I've an unvented hot water tank so I need to use the insertion sensor. I'm not clear though where exactly that is supposed to go though and how do I get it inside the watertank. Do I need some other parts, obviously wondering how does one get this into the tank without flooding the house!

Stopping the flow is the easiest part. Better to just cut the head tank supply and drain. Close off all other rads at both ends to reduce drain time and venting afterwards. The freezing trick would work provided you don't end up with a stuck spigot or a riser mismatch that has you scurrying to get parts or tools or help, while your frozen plug thaws out. I suppose if you freeze the riser you only need to catch the radiator water. You might need to change the spigot into the rad as TRV type valves all seem to use compression type spigots, whereas older radiator screw valves used a 3/4" flush coupler, the type which allowed easy removal of a radiator. The spigot into the rad of these type often requires a large hex allen key inside the spigot to remove, with a lot of force and a hail mary. Another problem is that the compression nut of the riser pipe may not have the same thread or depth as the nut on the new TRV valve, so you have to remove the old nut and ring, the latter will be compressed into the riser pipe.

Your cylinder will have little hollow tubes already fitted in it in which to insert the stat.

digiman

I managed to get the Honeywell Evohome setup to control my hot water, upstairs and downstairs myself. Very happy with it so far, 2 issues left to fix though. I need to replace the existing radiator valves so that they will be able to take the fitting for the Honeywell Thermostats. Is this a job that one could do himself, I ain't no plumber, have just watched a few youtube videos where guys have frooze the incoming water supply and seal off the flow in the other direction for long enough to swap the valve.

Have a very stupid question coming up, I've an unvented hot water tank so I need to use the insertion sensor. I'm not clear though where exactly that is supposed to go though and how do I get it inside the watertank. Do I need some other parts, obviously wondering how does one get this into the tank without flooding the house!

https://www.eurosales.ie/products/eph-wireless-room-thermostat-rfr.html

DeadSkin wrote: »

I have EPH 2 Zone RF Programmer and would like to make use of the EPH app to control my heating.

From the EPH website I need a gateway and a couple of thermostats (one upstairs and one downstairs).

You can purchase complete kits (that include the controller I already have), but I cannot find any where else online to purchase thermostats separately. I found the gateway on Screwfix (for 100 Euro).

Any one come across EPH thermostats separately online?

Thanks!

DeadSkin

I have EPH 2 Zone RF Programmer and would like to make use of the EPH app to control my heating.

From the EPH website I need a gateway and a couple of thermostats (one upstairs and one downstairs).

You can purchase complete kits (that include the controller I already have), but I cannot find any where else online to purchase thermostats separately. I found the gateway on Screwfix (for 100 Euro).

Any one come across EPH thermostats separately online?

Thanks!

deezell wrote: »

Yes, remove the EPH, replace with the Tado. Lift off the EPH, there's just one small screw at the bottom holding it to its baseplate.Check the wiring coming in and out. L, N, and there should be no more than three live outs to the wall/cylinder stats, and then on to the valves, which in turn collectively though their built in relays will fire the boiler when any of them open. The ext kit will replace the EPH locally for timing of HW and CH1. CH2 is first wired in the tado to L, which is always on, but then replacing CH2 stat with a wired tado stat controls the live to the CH2 valve. The timing as well as the temperature control all take placs inside the Tado stat. This is the key difference. Traditional system has a timer controller, with these timed lives then sent to a wall stat or cylinder stat for temperature control. This is combined in the Tado stats, whither wired in, or wireless via the ext kit. Only the HW retains its mechanical stat, with the ext kit supplying the HW timed live

Thank you, that's fantastic, I understand the approach now. I will wire it up as you describe and let you know how I get on.

salnado wrote: »

From Live L of the Tado correct?

That's input L of the Tado,correct? Am I right that in all this the EPH can be removed?

This question is irrelevant if the EPH can be removed. If not then If CH2 is still going to input L of the EPH, do I need a feed to the Tado L and N?
Do i just loop off the EPH to do that?

Yes, remove the EPH, replace with the Tado. Lift off the EPH, there's just one small screw at the bottom holding it to its baseplate.Check the wiring coming in and out. L, N, and there should be no more than three live outs to the wall/cylinder stats, and then on to the valves, which in turn collectively though their built in relays will fire the boiler when any of them open. The ext kit will replace the EPH locally for timing of HW and CH1. CH2 is first wired in the tado to L, which is always on, but then replacing CH2 stat with a wired tado stat controls the live to the CH2 valve. The timing as well as the temperature control all take placs inside the Tado stat. This is the key difference. Traditional system has a timer controller, with these timed lives then sent to a wall stat or cylinder stat for temperature control. This is combined in the Tado stats, whither wired in, or wireless via the ext kit. Only the HW retains its mechanical stat, with the ext kit supplying the HW timed live

deezell wrote: »

T37 is identical to R37. 3 switched live out , HW, CH1, CH2 on terminals 3, 5 and 7.The new version of the Tado ext kit has the following terminals

Using CH1 stat wirelessly;
Connect a loop from live L to Tado CH COM and HW COM.

From Live L of the Tado correct?

deezell wrote: »

Move connections from EPH 3 to Tado HW NO. Move EPH 5 to Tado CH NO
Connect EPH 7 to the input Live L.

That's input L of the Tado,correct? Am I right that in all this the EPH can be removed?

deezell wrote: »

Install the first Tado stat wirelessly back to the ext kit. Turn the old CH1 stat up full. You should now be able to control CH1 and HW timing from the Tado. Ch2 will now be permanently on but still controlled by the old CH2 thermostat. Remove this stat and replace with the second Tado stat hard wired in place.

This question is irrelevant if the EPH can be removed. If not then If CH2 is still going to input L of the EPH, do I need a feed to the Tado L and N?
Do i just loop off the EPH to do that?

JohnDeereIE wrote: »

Thank you

I think the 1200 included the kit plus a number of rad thermostats so might not be too bad.
At the moment it has two thermostats which are connected to an old controller. It turns on/off heating and water. You can turn on one without the other if you know what I mean.

I was going to get the "tado° Wired Smart Thermostat Starter Kit V3+ - Intelligent heating control, easy DIY installation" but I don't see this starter kit with the hot ware controller. Or do I need to buy the "tado° Wireless Smart Thermostat Starter Kit V3+ with Hot Water Control "

Do I get the Wired kit and then buy the hot water separate?

Thanks again(Sorry can't post link)

The ext kit has two relays, one for wireless connection of the Tado thermostat, and the other for controlling the timing of HW, so you get both in the one box. The Tado thermostat on its own has a built in relay, so it can be wired directly in place of an old thermostat, and you can continue to time your HW with the older controller. If you buy the extension kit later or as part of the starter kit with HW, you can use the wireless feature optionally, but in your case it will directly replace the old controller, wired in its place. The old CH stat can be removed and replaced by the new stat wired in, or wirelessly connected. The old HW stat remains in place, the Tado only controls timing of HW, not temperature.
Rad stats (TRVs) are not that expensive, €45-60 depending on special offers, but will require the fitting of a TRV type valve body on each rad if you don't already have manual TRVs on them.

salnado wrote: »

Thanks Deezel. Attached is a better diagram with more detail including the EPH (which is a T37 - HW).

Also, I found an installation manual for the boiler at this link

Based on this further information, I think the existing setup is wired according to an S-plan setup. I will wait on Tado to come back to confirm what I should connect where on the Wireless Receiver.

T37 is identical to R37. 3 switched live out , HW, CH1, CH2 on terminals 3, 5 and 7.The new version of the Tado ext kit has the following terminals

Using CH1 stat wirelessly;
Connect a loop from live L to Tado CH COM and HW COM. Move connections from EPH 3 to Tado HW NO. Move EPH 5 to Tado CH NO
Connect EPH 7 to the input Live L. Install the first Tado stat wirelessly back to the ext kit. Turn the old CH1 stat up full. You should now be able to control CH1 and HW timing from the Tado. Ch2 will now be permanently on but still controlled by the old CH2 thermostat. Remove this stat and replace with the second Tado stat hard wired in place.
Both stats hard wired;
If you don't want to use the wireless connection for CH1 thermostat, just wire the EPH terminal 5 connections to permanent live, and replace the old CH1 stat with the tado stat wired in, similar to CH2. Use the ext kit for timing HW only.

deezell wrote: »

You need the Tado starter kit with HW. This has a relay box known as the extension kit for timing of HW, but you still retain your wired hw stat. It also has a relay for wireless operation of the Tado stat, but the stat can also be wired in place of the old stat, with the ext kit only used for hw timing.
You say you current system is two stats. Is there a timer also? can you heat HW only and CH only, or does HW heat when you have CH on?
€1200 is mad alright. It might be easier to leave the HW alone, on its own stat (is this on the side of a HW cylinder?), and just get the wired Tado stat kit and replace the ch stat, a DIY job.

Thank you

I think the 1200 included the kit plus a number of rad thermostats so might not be too bad.
At the moment it has two thermostats which are connected to an old controller. It turns on/off heating and water. You can turn on one without the other if you know what I mean.

I was going to get the "tado° Wired Smart Thermostat Starter Kit V3+ - Intelligent heating control, easy DIY installation" but I don't see this starter kit with the hot ware controller. Or do I need to buy the "tado° Wireless Smart Thermostat Starter Kit V3+ with Hot Water Control "

Do I get the Wired kit and then buy the hot water separate?

Thanks again(Sorry can't post link)

deezell wrote: »

your existing wiring circuit is too vague to draw any real conclusions from, but if the controller is a standard 3 zone EPH, it should be possible to simply substitute the Tado as you suggest, with the ext kit replacing the outputs of HW and CH1, and a wired back connnection from the other Tado stat to trigger CH2. Try to establish if all zones are independent, with each operating only its own motorised valve. The boiler model you listed is proving difficult to find an installation wiring diagram for, but I assume it is fired by the combination of all three valve relays, possibly volt free. I note an orange and grey wire to what must be the boiler call terminals. I have only found this boiler model on US sites, installation in the US can be strange, volt free for firing, and odd connections for external valves, but I'd take it yours is a straight 2 pipe connection with s plan valves to the 3 zones, HW in a cylinder, not direct from the boiler. Also, the model of the EPH is T37 or R37? the HW designated models can have a gravity mode switch, using the HW output to fire the boiler for all events. Again the presence of three valves should indicate proper s plan wiring, hence the need to check for zone independence.
A photo of the EPH backing plate wiring would be useful also. Its not clear from your diagram at what stage the zone thermostats are wired in series with the EPH live calls to the zone valves, but it should not make any difference, if you merely substitute the ext kit for the EPH, wiring CH 1 and HW in place of the first 2 EPH zones, then wiring EPH CH 2 to permanent live and replacing it's wired stat with the Tado. Also turn the old CH1 stat up full or else remove and cross its connections.

Thanks Deezel. Attached is a better diagram with more detail including the EPH (which is a T37 - HW).

Also, I found an installation manual for the boiler at this link

Based on this further information, I think the existing setup is wired according to an S-plan setup. I will wait on Tado to come back to confirm what I should connect where on the Wireless Receiver.