Star Trek Discovery Season 3 [ SPOILERS WITHIN ]

Baggly wrote: »

7

Gonna watch it tomorrow but I gave up hope after the seed episode

Baggly wrote: »

I'm done. Such bs. Tilly. TILLY.

And more Burnham unilateral decisions.

Just cut her loose and go do some missions.

SOMEONE THROW THE BOOK AT HER INSTEAD OF EMOTING AT HER.

Is this ep 6 or 7 you are talking about

I'm done. Such bs. Tilly. TILLY.

And more Burnham unilateral decisions.

Just cut her loose and go do some missions.

SOMEONE THROW THE BOOK AT HER INSTEAD OF EMOTING AT HER.

Picard showed just how cool they could be made look with a modern production team. Then gave us the greatest cock-tease of all time by blasting them all into space seconds after Seven's ascension to Borg Queen.

~Rebel~

mikhail wrote: »

Not necessarily. You could have a situation where they were successfully bottled up somehow (pocket universe? driven back to the homeworld?) but either they couldn't be destroyed, their conquerors felt it immoral to hunt them to extinction once they were no longer a threat, they were tamed, or they were kept to be somehow tortured as punishment or used as a tool. Then The Burn critically weakens their guardians/masters/etc. Or you could have the last cube's last gasp escape with a jump to the future, mirroring Discovery's, where they've had to overcome obsolescence before they can become a danger again. No contrivance is too much in pursuit of fan service!

Yeah, if they want to include them, they'll include them.

I really hope they don't though. I really don't want Discovery trying to revisit any classic Trek stuff, I've just no faith in them not getting it wrong. They've a whole new universe to explore so I'd much prefer they stick to new interesting future things.

mikhail

Deleted User wrote: »

Where were they for the last 9 centuries, suddenly discovered knitting? Nah, the Borg had to be all conquering or they evaporated. No in between for them.

Not necessarily. You could have a situation where they were successfully bottled up somehow (pocket universe? driven back to the homeworld?) but either they couldn't be destroyed, their conquerors felt it immoral to hunt them to extinction once they were no longer a threat, they were tamed, or they were kept to be somehow tortured as punishment or used as a tool. Then The Burn critically weakens their guardians/masters/etc. Or you could have the last cube's last gasp escape with a jump to the future, mirroring Discovery's, where they've had to overcome obsolescence before they can become a danger again. No contrivance is too much in pursuit of fan service!

[Deleted User]

Goodshape wrote: »

I can't imagine they're going to leave out the Borg. Must admit I'd look forward to seeing Discovery's take on them.

Where were they for the last 9 centuries, suddenly discovered knitting? Nah, the Borg had to be all conquering or they evaporated. No in between for them.

Goodshape

I can't imagine they're going to leave out the Borg. Must admit I'd look forward to seeing Discovery's take on them.

Even in Picard it wasn't clear what had become of the collective. If / when they do show up in Disco, it might be a case of digging up some old fan-service nostalgia historical records to learn more about the legendary foe which hasn't been heard from in centuries - and of course which the Discovery crew has, with the widest of eyes and most palpable anxiety, never imagined in their wildest terrors.

TheValeyard

Maybe they tried to mix dilithium and Omega.

Spear

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Romulan ships, at least the military ones like the D'Deridex class, are supposedly dilithium-free as they were powered by a quantum singularity (read: a minuature black hole running their warp core...maybe not the safest of technologies, but hey, it worked ).
.

Dilithium is not a power source, it just converts energy and can withstand the output from warp cores. So even if Romulan ships use quantum singularities, and presumably are just creaming off the Hawking radiation from it, that still doesn't rule out the use of dilithium. But I'm guessing we find out a lot more in the next episode.

I'm presuming the Borg must have been destroyed some time between the 24th and 32nd centuries. Towards the end of the 24th century, they were becoming way too powerful to simply be ignored/avoided.

Evade

I don't think it's ever been stated Romulan quantum singularity warp drives don't use dilithium.

Well the Borg have a version of the Iconian gateway by 2399 but maybe they are powered by dilithium too

H3llR4iser

silverharp wrote: »

needs more to be sure, im not sure about the Romulans, they may use Dilithium but have a different technology, a singularity or some such. Warp is possible without it though or Cochrane's initial flight wouldnt have worked. The Borg technology was different? and the Federation were beaming of people across systems.

Romulan ships, at least the military ones like the D'Deridex class, are supposedly dilithium-free as they were powered by a quantum singularity (read: a minuature black hole running their warp core...maybe not the safest of technologies, but hey, it worked

). Considering Discover has thus far implied very little evolution in terms of power sources (the Federation still using dilithium 900 years later) it makes sense Romulans, whatever form their organization has taken after the Hobus incident, would still have singularity powered ships.

And they can't be the only species coming up with different power sources.

As for the Borg, it was never clearly stated, but implied they basically use a distributed mish-mash of stuff assimilated from other cultures. So there might have been dilithium in there, but also quantum singularities and whatever else the writers can come up with. And the Borg being the Borg, it would make sense for them to quickly overcome the dilithium shortage...

It's the same basic issue that plagued Discovery since the beginning - the writing and production teams either don't know anything about Trek lore, or simply don't care. They consider it baggage that gets in the way of making their "space opera" thing.

silverharp

H3llR4iser wrote: »

The galaxy status and lack of exposition/exploration - Seriously, we could use much more exposition about what the heck is going on in the galaxy; The Orions and the Andorians formed a somewhat criminal organization, all right, but how did it come to be? What about the Kilngons and perhaps most interestingly, what happened with the ROMULANS, which DID NOT USE DILITHIUM to power their ships? And what about the Dominion, they didn't take the opportunity to invade the quadrant, now that there's no opposition? And the BORG? Anyone with a functional fleet of warp-capable ships would be able to basically take the quadrant over in a matter of weeks. Of course this can all be brushed under the carpet, but it's a huge missed opportunity.

needs more to be sure, im not sure about the Romulans, they may use Dilithium but have a different technology, a singularity or some such. Warp is possible without it though or Cochrane's initial flight wouldnt have worked. The Borg technology was different? and the Federation were beaming of people across systems.

H3llR4iser

I keep watching, stupidly, hoping something gets better.

And dare I say...at the beginning of the season...there was some promise showing. Sure, episode 1 was mildly interesting IF a bit off-colour by inferring the whole thing might have gone from attempting to ape Star Trek to just not even trying anymore, just becoming yet another "scruffy-future-space-people-collecting-space-junk-in-garbage-starships" show, but then the second episode came in - a WHOLE episode about the CREW and without a trace of Burnham in sight? Wow. Unexpected...except, by the end of that episode, it was all about Burnham again.

I'll try to make a long story short, going into positives and negatives. I won't even comment about all of the weirdly forced characterization choices - aka, I don't give a passing p1ss about what Adira and her boyfriend/girlfriend/ghost in the shell are (except yet another Wesley Crusher stand-in, but that's a story for another day!).

THE GOOD

Saru - Glad they went with making him Captain, as it continues his development arc nicely from his initial "useless wimp afraid of everything" portrayal. I wonder if it was always planned, or it's something they came up with as it became clear the show absolutely needed a proper "character evolution" story. He's showing signs of becoming a fine Captain.

Book - He's faded in the background as a minor character, but the "adventurer" vibe, plus the unexplained origin of his species, makes for an interesting character. Also, some potential there - how comes he not only looks 100% human, but even has a PET who looks and behaves, 100%, like an Earth species? Up to the writers, but if they ignore this potential, they're a bunch of overpaid idiots.

Starfleets' reasonable pragmatism - Times are hard and uncertain - some compromises on the lofty ideals of yesteryear are to be made, but up until now, it seems like the general idea is to uphold and reestablish the core Starfleet principles, albeit in an initially more pragmatic way.

Burnham's evolution, part 1 - I know, right? Something positive about Burnham! But yeah, her initial "coming back changed after an year away living off space-scrapping" impression was positive. Not only that, it looks like the actress herself is much more comfortable playing the slightly softer, more well-rounded version of the character, rather than the ridiculous cardboard cutout she was in the first two seasons. It's kinda funny/interesting how the change in the character has been basically heralded "visually" by Burnham looking more feminine.

More "standalone" episodes - The flow has been less serialized than in the past, while still falling underneath a main general premise. Hugely refreshing, and it's funny because it's something series have done forever - like, I don't know, a ship lost in a distant part of the galaxy and trying to get home, or a space station sitting at the entrance of a vital passageway with a huge interplanetary war raging...

THE NEUTRAL/JURY STILL OUT

Georgiou - She's still a frustratingly inconsistent character: sometimes ruthless, somethimes scheming, sometimes weirdly demonstrating attachment to the Discovery crew and even some form of respect for Saru's authority, then she's a scheming con-artist, then the "visions" and whatnot. There's a great potential there for a solid character story, but looks to me like they can't decide what to do with her.

Adira Tal - Walking on the line, perilously verging into Wesley Crusher territory. Yes, I know, 7 lifetimes et all. We'll need to see how she/they evolve.

The whole "burn" storyline - It could be great or it could be ridiculously idiotic. It all depends if they make it once again all about Burnham and whatever the heck she does. If the second scenario turns out to be the real one, even the name of the event is stupendously ridiculous, worthy of Saturday-morning children material.

THE BAD

Burnham's evolution, part 2 - the devolution - Long story short, didn't take long for Burnham to revert into the impulsive, arrogant, insubordinate and untrustworthy a-hole she was in season 1 and 2, once she came back aboard Discovery. One wonders if there might be something wrong with the environmental control in her quarters, pumping something into the air. And once again, she got away with murder - being re-assigned as chief science officer is basically not even a slap on the wrist. Tom Paris had the book thrown at him, multiple times, for much less

Lack of ensemble focus - Once again, the rest of the crew are fading into obscurity in the background. The first couple of episodes showed promise, but now it's been back to "The Burnham show", albeit maybe in a slightly subtler way. Considering logic dictates Lieutenant Nilsson to be named First Officer now, one would hope she'd get a bit more fleshed out as a character, unless we end up with a "cardboard number 1" who basically is a voice repeating the Captain's commands. Or Stamets gets to be First Officer (would be quite nice, although impractical with the fact he also needs to pilot the ship through the mushroom cloud).

The filler - Basically, I noticed how I tend to grow impatient around midway each episode. Feels to me like they start with a premise, develop the plot slightly, then fall into a lull of filler content, pointless conversation that goes nowhere and useless transition scenes, until the big final wrapper.

The galaxy status and lack of exposition/exploration - Seriously, we could use much more exposition about what the heck is going on in the galaxy; The Orions and the Andorians formed a somewhat criminal organization, all right, but how did it come to be? What about the Kilngons and perhaps most interestingly, what happened with the ROMULANS, which DID NOT USE DILITHIUM to power their ships? And what about the Dominion, they didn't take the opportunity to invade the quadrant, now that there's no opposition? And the BORG? Anyone with a functional fleet of warp-capable ships would be able to basically take the quadrant over in a matter of weeks. Of course this can all be brushed under the carpet, but it's a huge missed opportunity.

pixelburp

ilovesmybrick wrote: »

On a different note there's something I've been wondering. Have we ever seen the warp core or main engineering in Discovery? I know we spend a lot of time in the spore drive lab, but I don't think we've ever actually seen main engineering and the core, which is really weird for a Star Trek show.

I think the engine is in that lab, behind where the Spore Drive interface sits. Could be wrong though but I'm fairly sure I've seen a big glowy, engine looking device; IIRC we had a brief visit into the Spore ... farm? Repository? There was an area where the spore was being grown. This was possibly Season 1 so god knows what still applies with that season's noted production issues.

I'm pretty sure the warp core is the red glowing thing in the background of the same room as the spore lab.

ilovesmybrick

On a different note there's something I've been wondering. Have we ever seen the warp core or main engineering in Discovery? I know we spend a lot of time in the spore drive lab, but I don't think we've ever actually seen main engineering and the core, which is really weird for a Star Trek show.

Baggly wrote: »

She has the crewman at gun point when he first refuses to walk though.

Vulcan logic said to pull a gun on him. Thing is with Burnham she would be right and the guy would be healed miraculously

She has the crewman at gun point when he first refuses to walk though.

Rawr

Baggly wrote: »

Different when there is a third party being treated for a broken leg vs a superior officer reprimanding you, in fairness.

Indeed, that moment in Disaster was a good example of Worf showing care and leadership to a fellow crew-mate by being encouraging during a time of pain and difficulty.

Somehow I am now also imagining Michael in the same scene, but instead of an encouraging "Good, you bore that well", she'd start screaming an overly dramatic speech about never giving up.

Michael: You will NOT give into pain Crewman! I WON'T let you!

Crewman: Erm...I think the bone is still broken...should probably wait until sickbay respond...

Michael: NO! You have to believe! (In tears) I believe in you crewman! I-believe-in-YOU!

Crewman: Oh...thanks? Anyway I should keep weight off this leg for now and-

Michael: Stand up! You can walk, I KNOW you can!! Let me help you...

Crewman: Wait NO! I really shouldn't stand yet!

Michael: I-said-you can WALK!

Crewman: (Leg snaps) AHHHHHHHH!!!!

Stark wrote: »

I can actually picture it perfectly funnily enough. It helps that there's a scene where Worf says that line after resetting someone's broken leg in "Disaster".

Different when there is a third party being treated for a broken leg vs a superior officer reprimanding you, in fairness.

I can actually picture it perfectly funnily enough. It helps that there's a scene where Worf says that line after resetting someone's broken leg in "Disaster".