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Opinions on onlyfans and adult entertainment industry

Bubblesxoxx

I have been a dancer in Dublin for a decade started in my early 20s a lot of the girls I work with are sound and believe me it’s definitely nothing you see on tv. However Ireland seems to have this negative attitude towards women in this industry or deems us all sex addicts or easy when the woman who gets bread in her local supermarket could be doing all kinds of dirty things that’s way worse than dancing and it seems to be okay because she’s doing it for free I don’t get the mindset of some of these people we have stage names in work to protect our identity.

Part of this job comes with a lot of stigma there’s been a few girls who had people find out their day jobs and contact their boss to try and get them fired it’s normally women who rat them out and try to ruin their lives over it. There’s nothing I’d love more than to be open about my job and how it’s helped me get through some dark times in my life but I just couldn’t handle all the derogatory labels and insults and lows people will go to try and ruin your life over it. Since covid hit I don’t know how the strip club industry in Dublin is going to survive.

I want to know what your opinions are on strippers and the likes of using onlyfans to make money nothing you say is going to bother me it’s more curios why people have a begrudging attitude towards these things when they do worse things for free with their husbands boyfriend or a random Jack the lad from coppers In Dublin on a night out.

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banie01

Cui bono?
Cui bono...

6 days after this story has broken.
After claims repeated without actual verification across media channels and from our Minister for Justice.
There is still zero corroboration of this mass leak.
Indeed if one is to take the slant offered in the Sunday times article?
The leak really is more of a copyright and income protection problem, than it is about actual child and victim protection.

The Gardaí have confirmed that Onlyfans sharing isn't within their remit and that despite the leak containing social media profiles identifying "victims" their is yet to be a complaint from anyone associated with this leak?

The Victims alliance and others have been hanging the drum on this cache of thousands of vulnerable women and girls for over a week now.
This is a digital cache of the meat to the biggest current story in Ireland, yet noone outside the VA and those who broke the story on social media are even claiming to have seen it?

Really? I can't be the only one more than a little confused by that? Given how quickly every other "controversial" bit of digital media is leaked and widely available?

The legislation that McEntee is now championing?
Wasn't good enough for FG 3yrs ago?
Yet now she is under pressure for actions that could we'll see her face a vote of no confidence?
It's perfect, and a priority of her office?

The days of no smoke without fire are well and truly past us.
In the time of instant dissemination and media sharing at a click, if a story is running for a week without 3rd party corroboration?

One has to ask why?
Who is gaining?

kippy

anewme wrote: »

Looks like its bring tabled for approval tomorrow. Scope being widened.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/1123/1179844-images-legislation/

Waters well and truely muddied there then.
Will be interested to see the impact of these new laws if they get through.

anewme

Looks like its bring tabled for approval tomorrow. Scope being widened.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/1123/1179844-images-legislation/

Yurt2

This is a bizarre story and the way feminists are mobilizing around it.

Internet safety courses delivered to schools emphasize that once you put a picture or a video online, you have no way of controlling where it goes, so just don't put something online that may come back to haunt you. That grown adults are putting content of themselves naked or in various sexual scenarios are getting surprised that it has been scraped and shared elsewhere is a bit silly. If there are underage images that's a separate matter and should be cracked down upon, but the above principle still applies.

The whole thing reminds me of Metallica giving out about Napster and file sharing.

There's a good reason why I don't put pictures of my junk (besides the fact it's not the prettiest unit) online - I don't want it landing back in my whastapp someday.

anewme

Glebee wrote: »

"Hayden said her group tracked the alleged blackmailer to New Zealand and learnt he was a 16-year-old boy. She alerted his mother. Hayden believes most users on the forums with “Irish girls” images are themselves Irish, because they ask for women by town, county or even by name. One user searching for images accidentally stumbled across his cousin’s photos.

The forums included pictures of girls possibly as young as 14; videos of alleged rapes; and images taken surreptitiously as well as from Instagram and Facebook. However, Hayden said many photos were taken from OnlyFans, a website she described as a “lifesaver” for people to earn money in lockdown by sharing pictures with paid subscribers."

Sunday Times did not say it, the lady being interviewed quoted it.

That's very different than what was posted above.

Poster has adapted the words to fit their own Agenda.

Sunday Times today claiming that selling porn on onlyfans is a "lifeline" for irish women and that anyone that jeopardises their income should be met with the full force of the law.

Glebee

anewme wrote: »

Do you have a link to that article? Was that the exact language used?

"Hayden said her group tracked the alleged blackmailer to New Zealand and learnt he was a 16-year-old boy. She alerted his mother. Hayden believes most users on the forums with “Irish girls” images are themselves Irish, because they ask for women by town, county or even by name. One user searching for images accidentally stumbled across his cousin’s photos.

The forums included pictures of girls possibly as young as 14; videos of alleged rapes; and images taken surreptitiously as well as from Instagram and Facebook. However, Hayden said many photos were taken from OnlyFans, a website she described as a “lifesaver” for people to earn money in lockdown by sharing pictures with paid subscribers."

Sunday Times did not say it, the lady being interviewed quoted it.

MrMusician18

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

That doesn't make it legal.

It would be a civil matter though, not criminal.

anewme

robinbird wrote: »

Sunday Times today claiming that selling porn on onlyfans is a "lifeline" for irish women and that anyone that jeopardises their income should be met with the full force of the law.

Do you have a link to that article? Was that the exact language used?

anewme

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Fair enough then, didn't read up on it and only went by above comments. Seems to be more to it so.

That update has only come out today, to be fair.

As you said, it's very recent and will take to be investigated.

[Deleted User]

robinbird wrote: »

Sunday Times today claiming that selling porn on onlyfans is a "lifeline" for irish women and that anyone that jeopardises their income should be met with the full force of the law.

Jesus Christ..

Potential-Monke

anewme wrote: »

They have shut the server and banned 500 ppl, and will be passing the details of the 500 ppl who downloaded the images to the Gardai. That's a fair bit stronger than you are saying abov, even at the early stage.

Fair enough then, didn't read up on it and only went by above comments. Seems to be more to it so.

anewme

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Something else to keep in mind, depending on the country, the age of consent is significantly lower than Ireland. We consider anyone under 18 to be a child and any sexual videos or photos of them would be considered child porn. However, if that person was in, for example, Sweden, the age is 15. Or 12/13 in Sudan. Honduras and Brazil are 14.

List of countries by age of consent

As for the alleged leak, there does appear to be a lack of concrete evidence at the moment, but cases like this can likely take years to put together. Discord shutting the server is a typical response by companies, not proof of wrong doing. As mentioned above, it could just be a case of the person breaching Discords T&C's. Only time will tell.

* Simply possessing images/videos of persons underage is a crime and doesn't require a "victim", as long as the images/videos can be proven to be of underage. So if there are proven underage images/videos, the uploaded/owner of the server can be prosecuted anyway.

They have shut the server and banned 500 ppl, and will be passing the details of the 500 ppl who downloaded the images to the Gardai. That's a fair bit stronger than you are saying abov, even at the early stage.

Potential-Monke

Something else to keep in mind, depending on the country, the age of consent is significantly lower than Ireland. We consider anyone under 18 to be a child and any sexual videos or photos of them would be considered child porn. However, if that person was in, for example, Sweden, the age is 15. Or 12/13 in Sudan. Honduras and Brazil are 14.

List of countries by age of consent

Just food for thought there. And i'm not 100% on the different laws, so I'm not sure if the age of consent applies to personal or professional images or videos.

But I agree with some posters here:

- Images/Videos of underage as per Irish Law is wrong and should/would be prosecuted*
- Images/Videos of consenting adults shared on money making sites would be copyright if shared so not a criminal matter
- Images/Videos of consenting adults shared privately between each other subsequently shared without the consent of the sender is wrong, yes, but not illegal at the moment

The 'Revenge porn' legislation they want is a good step, but it needs to be fair to ensure someone doesn't try and stitch up an ex by saying their photos were shared when they weren't. The proof needs to be very strict imo. Don't get me wrong, it is needed, but it shouldn't be rushed in because of x in the media.

As for the alleged leak, there does appear to be a lack of concrete evidence at the moment, but cases like this can likely take years to put together. Discord shutting the server is a typical response by companies, not proof of wrong doing. As mentioned above, it could just be a case of the person breaching Discords T&C's. Only time will tell.

* Simply possessing images/videos of persons underage is a crime and doesn't require a "victim", as long as the images/videos can be proven to be of underage. So if there are proven underage images/videos, the uploaded/owner of the server can be prosecuted anyway.

Sonics2k

I mean, technically it is copyright infringement, especially if making any form of profit off of it.

Same goes for any photographer who finds their content is being used on another platform with out the owners consent.

As for the talk of those lads sharing pictures of underage girls. I hope they get strung up in the city squares and left to rot.

robinbird

Sunday Times today claiming that selling porn on onlyfans is a "lifeline" for irish women and that anyone that jeopardises their income should be met with the full force of the law.

Sonics2k

kippy wrote: »

Serious question here but are underage girls selling pictures of themselves on OnlyFans? This is a disgrace if so.

I used to work for a payment processor who handled the account for OnlyFans. Much like any other business, people who use the service to sell are required to provide ID, including photo ID. So OnlyFans, Pornhub etc are all required by law to request Proof of ID and other such tax information from their users who are going to make money.

I would personally assume that the extreme majority of men and women posting on their have provided photo ID, but there is always the outlier chance that underage people have provided fake ID's. However, the security and fraud checks that go into trying to prevent this are very high so I'd reckon they would be rare, and typically picked up on quick enough.

No platform wants to be called out for allowing child pornography on their site.

Padre_Pio

Wibbs wrote: »

Expectation/reality. Pick one

They are all good points.
The internet is constantly evolving and despite it being 30 years old, the current incarnation of social media and 24/7 access is still new.
I don't know what legislation will be enacted to control it, but it seems to me to be a Pandora's Box.

I wouldn't be surprised if the EU or US starts to impose access restrictions or online passports.

To your second point, your browser or website history never disappears. Even in incognito and no matter what privacy settings. It's still recorded, just not used for certain purposes . Unless it is, in which case good luck, you still have no rights.

Wibbs

Padre_Pio wrote: »

True, but that's the same as saying that no one forces you to go to work every day.

You go to work to benefit yourself, personally, professionally, financially.
You use the internet and social media to benefit yourself in many ways. You should have an expectation of privacy.

Just because you don't have to do something, doesn't mean you shouldn't do something.

Expectation/reality. Pick one. While it would be great if the internet was fully traceable and accountable to the law and privacy was guaranteed, it's not. Not even close. In many ways the internet sees censorship and restriction of information as a fault and routes around it. It's built into its very core.

Take your going to work example. We have a suite of solid worker's rights in Ireland, but workers in I dunno Pakistan do not. Our laws don't apply to them, just like any internet laws enacted here will mean diddly to servers in say Russia.

Plus an individual can choose to use the internet for their benefit, while retaining a lot more privacy than the average user who just clicks the I Agree terms and conditions box and ploughs on, most of the time not realising just how much of their personal data is being mined for multi billion quid corporations, or intercepted by the more nasty and criminally minded. People, particularly children need to be much better educated on this.

EG I use google, have an account with them including gmail, regularly gorge myself on youtube and this is my history:

And there's no need to go full prepper paranoid American in basement wearing tinfoil hat involved. Just a few clicks that takes but a minute. I don't facebook, but for the brief time I did I had taken the same minute or two to set my privacy preferences to feck off Zuckerberg.

[Deleted User]

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Kids don't get a pass when it comes to breaking the law, if a kid murders someone we don't just say, '' ah it's okay, they're only 14''

the age of responsibility in Ireland is 12. There is suggestions that it should be raised but I dont think it gained traction.Theres only a few exemptions and one is murder however at 14 you face the legal consequences of your actions.

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

But they seem to get a pass when they produce self made CP, and distribute it among their inner circle.

You are suggesting that a law that is there to protect children should be used against children. Common sense must apply in such cases and there is the 'Romeo & Juliet' aspect at play. 12 year old coerced by a 17 year old is not the same as a 16 year old sending an image to her 15 year old boyfriend.

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

They should bring out a law that makes it illegal for people under 18 to share such images over smartphones and internet.

What do you mean? Creating / sharing sexual images of a child (anyone under 18) is already a crime. Producing / displaying pornography to a child is also already a crime. The issue however is A, will there be a complaint / witness willing to give evidence and B, If you prosecute the reciever of an image should you also prosecute the supplier which may be in effect, the victim? Again, common sense needs to come into play.

The Gardai have certain amount of discretion with minor issues. In larger cases such as sexual offences, a file must be sent to the DPP and they in turn have a certain amount of discretion in how to proceed. The DPP is the director of PUBLIC prosecutions only and not private ones therefore their decisions are based on the general needs of the public at large and if its in the interests of justice and the public to prosecute. In a case where the victim and suspect are, say both 16 and in a relationship, neither wants to make a complaint and then the parents are of the opinion that there should be no prosecution, why continue? Who does it help?

[Deleted User]

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

They should bring out a law that makes it illegal for people under 18 to share such images over smartphones and internet.It might make them think twice, because at the end of the day, all those images will end up somewhere dark online without them ever knowing.

Great idea. We could put it beside the laws that make it illegal for young people to smoke, drink, take drugs and have sex, because they've always worked swimmingly.

[Deleted User]

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Every subscription porn site would have that , 3 months later porn ends up on free sites and only fans will be the same, it’s just Karen from the gaa club down the road is on only fans and expects to be treated differently

That doesn't make it legal.

Padre_Pio

banie01 wrote: »

Sharing screen grabs from someone's onlyfans is very common.
The issue is that copyright infringement of people choosing to sell images of themselves is being conflated with revenge porn and child porn.

If the local yummy mummy selling tit-pics is seeking to portray herself as the victim of a sex crime.
Or of a violation on a par with revenge porn, child sexualisation or coercive control via threat of sharing intimate images?
Apologies if you think I'm a little uncouth, but she is **** outta luck.

Copyright infringement is not a sex crime and cannot even be equated as being in the same realm of criminality.
The loss in that instance is solely monetary and more suited to civil than criminal courts.

I completely agree with this.

People with OnlyFans accounts are, by and large, sex workers. They are commercialising their bodies for the paying public.
Fair enough, some of it might be soft-core or lingerie, but let be honest.

If you're putting out content for the paying public, it cannot be a sex crime, or a violation of your body for the non-paying public to see this.

kippy wrote: »

Serious question here but are underage girls selling pictures of themselves on OnlyFans? This is a disgrace if so.

Probably. No one is policing underage access to porn, so I'd say no one is policing underage creation of porn.

banie01

anewme wrote: »

The Discord Statement would lead you to believe that there is something behind it.

No, it really wouldn't.
It would lead you to believe that discord shut down a group that was in breach of its T&C's yes.

Given that copyright infringement is in breach of those, it still doesn't really indicate anything other than the possibility.

Further to that, it's far better to be proactive as a platform and ban potentially controversial or problematic groups than facilitate them.

The discord statement is standard for the industry, including confirming full co-operation and IP disclosure if requested.

If there is Revenge Porn, or Child images of course all involved should feel the full weight of the law.
Unfortunately, current law really only permits the Child images be prosecuted.

If it's onlyfans content?
That isn't a criminal matter as far as I'm concerned and honestly nor should it be.

kippy

Serious question here but are underage girls selling pictures of themselves on OnlyFans? This is a disgrace if so.

kippy

anewme wrote: »

The Justice Minister said she will bring proposals to Cabinet which will see the sharing of intimate images without consent become a criminal offence.

Helen McEntee TD said that the recent leak of tens of thousands of images of Irish women "caused so much upset".

In a thread shared on Twitter, she said: "I share that anger and I want people to know that I am determined to act and to introduce tough new laws to ensure that anyone who shares these kinds of images will face serious criminal sanctions."

She added: "This is not just about revenge porn - sharing such images will become a criminal offence, regardless of the motivation of the person who passes them on.

"It will also be irrelevant if consent is given for an intimate image to be taken - I will ensure they can never be shared, even if consent was given for the image to be taken."

It also references Tinder/Whatts App/Only fans, so it does not seen to be seen as a separate issue. I suppose watch this space.

It's a very seperate issue and once the DPP legal advice is obtained that will become very obvious

kippy

Padre_Pio wrote: »

True, but that's the same as saying that no one forces you to go to work every day.

You go to work to benefit yourself, personally, professionally, financially.
You use the internet and social media to benefit yourself in many ways. You should have an expectation of privacy.

Just because you don't have to do something, doesn't mean you shouldn't do something.

There should be no expectation of privacy on the internet. Literally none. It's the best starting point you can have.
Assume someone is watching and monitoring everything you do.

anewme

banie01 wrote: »

Really? You think that? Previous stories following nearly the exact same template have come and gone.
The UCD 200 as an example.

In this instance, the Gardaí have said that

And even more interesting considering the Victims alliance claim that a large number of social media profiles are identified in the alleged leak

So the Gardaí think charges are unlikely, and confirmed that as of yesterday they have received neither a complaint, or very interestingly if you parse out this piece of info...

The alleged leaked material has yet to actually be handed over to the Gardaí.
Why would you release a story to the press on the 18th? But still not have ended the evidence of the crime to the Gardaí by the 20th?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda-pessimistic-about-bringing-charges-over-revenge-porn-leaks-1.4415105
Quotes taken from this article, which again is reporting 2nd hand info provided by the Victims alliance with zero corroboration of the existence of the leak.
The more one looks for verification or any meat to this story?

The more it looks like Quorn mince.

The Discord Statement would lead you to believe that there is something behind it.

anewme

hynesie08 wrote: »

That's the closest thing to evidence I've seen, but it's still nothing detailed.

It seems to have only come out today, but it would certainly point towards there definitely being something behind it. They (Discord) would have not said it otherwise.

hynesie08

anewme wrote: »

It says here that Discord have today confirmed they have shut down a server and banned a large number of people.

So it would appear there is a leak?

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40086578.html

As soon as Discord became aware of this server we permanently deleted it, identified and banned the approximately 500 users involved, and will co-operate on this matter with Irish authorities subject to applicable law

That's the closest thing to evidence I've seen, but it's still nothing detailed.

banie01

anewme wrote: »

You cant just make blanket statements that there is a leak with no real follow up. The Gardai will surely have to come out and confirm or deny it.

Really? You think that? Previous stories following nearly the exact same template have come and gone.
The UCD 200 as an example.

In this instance, the Gardaí have said that

Gardaí investigating the online sharing of so-called “revenge porn” of hundreds of Irish women believe criminal charges are highly unlikely

And even more interesting considering the Victims alliance claim that a large number of social media profiles are identified in the alleged leak

As of Friday afternoon, gardaí had yet to receive an official complaint from a person who had their image uploaded.

So the Gardaí think charges are unlikely, and confirmed that as of yesterday they have received neither a complaint, or very interestingly if you parse out this piece of info...

She said she is in the process of handing all the images the group had gathered to gardaí.

The alleged leaked material has yet to actually be handed over to the Gardaí.
Why would you release a story to the press on the 18th? But still not have ended the evidence of the crime to the Gardaí by the 20th?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda-pessimistic-about-bringing-charges-over-revenge-porn-leaks-1.4415105
Quotes taken from this article, which again is reporting 2nd hand info provided by the Victims alliance with zero corroboration of the existence of the leak.
The more one looks for verification or any meat to this story?

The more it looks like Quorn mince.