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Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

[Deleted User]

Continued from here
https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057953711/251
All Ireland Senior XV related talk here.

MOD: Bear in mind this thread is starting during the World Cup window and the zero tolerance policy is in force. Trolling will be rewarded with an instant ban. For the duration of the tournament any mention of Zebo in this thread will not be permitted, it is just dragging current Ireland squad talk off topic.

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[Deleted User]

Hard to know what to make of this weekend. In 2018 I was confident that we would win, only for us to require a last minute act of unselfish and almost unprecedented coordination and determination to get us over the line.

I'm far less confident today to be honest.

France are better coached and have better leadership within the team. They've a lot of belief coming into this fixture.

Ireland no longer have access to that accurate, unflinching phase game that Joe gave us and I'm not sure we've found anything or anyone better to replace it with. I don't think we can beat this French team in an open game of rugby and without a dominant set piece and highly organised forward pack I'm not sure what we have to offer in comparison to their power and high tempo game.

This weekend could be a vintage France v Ireland game and that's bad news for Ireland.

I hope I'm wrong.

pickarooney

I just hope both teams throw caution to the wind and go all out for tries.

UAEguy2020

Deleted User wrote: »

Hard to know what to make of this weekend. In 2018 I was confident that we would win, only for us to require a last minute act of unselfish and almost unprecedented coordination and determination to get us over the line.

I'm far less confident today to be honest.

France are better coached and have better leadership within the team. They've a lot of belief coming into this fixture.

Ireland no longer have access to that accurate, unflinching phase game that Joe gave us and I'm not sure we've found anything or anyone better to replace it with. I don't think we can beat this French team in an open game of rugby and without a dominant set piece and highly organised forward pack I'm not sure what we have to offer in comparison to their power and high tempo game.

This weekend could be a vintage France v Ireland game and that's bad news for Ireland.

I hope I'm wrong.

Even under Joe we rarely if ever dominate France in the scrum, largly it will come down to how crisp the line out is.

The accurate phase game hasnt been very effective and usually isnt effective as they can defend that all day long ( havent scored a try in Paris since 2014!).

The conclusion ive come to is I think a Joe Schmidt coached Irish team is more likely to win this match but I think a Andy Farrell coached Irish team is more likely to score the BP.

[Deleted User]

pickarooney wrote: »

I just hope both teams throw caution to the wind and go all out for tries.

They have to. Should be a cracker but I'm leaning towards something like 35-20 to France

bilston

I have a feeling that with the lack of a crowd and both sides needing a BP win that the game will be high scoring and whoever comes out on top maybe grab a BP win almost as a matter of course!

[Deleted User]

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

salmocab

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

Toner and Mc Grath too I think missed a WC whilst on central contracts.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Deleted User wrote: »

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

There's a certain element of "you wanted us to pay for him, at least watch him train" but there are no guaranteed spots.

WhoamI2022

Deleted User wrote: »

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

Ferris is talking poo. Kearney was dropped to get time in the Pro14 previously when he had bad injury run. Toner and McGrath also dropped with central contract.

WhoamI2022

I was talking to friend in Paris. Seemingly the French President will be on TV tonight and may announce a 4 week lockdown. Similar to the current Irish one. It will start on Thursday. No suggestion yet it will mean cancellation of the rugby but......no confirmation it will not

ionadnapóca

Ireland team at 1pm today
French at 1030 tomorrow

I presume the only changes will be Henshaw and maybe Marmion 21.? With Earls/Farrell at 23.
Would prefer Farrell myself

Buer

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

Stephen Ferris is not a smart man.

thomond2006

JvG quoted today that Kilcoyne is a few weeks away from a return.

ionadnapóca

Speaking of not smart men....D'Orce comparing Hugo Keenan to Jeff Wilson in todays paper.
"....it hit me: he moves like Jeff Wilson" :pac:

Paul Smeenus

Buer wrote: »

Stephen Ferris is not a smart man.

He's really not, but he has 35 caps, and you don't need to be a nuclear physicist to know that your mates and fellas you play with are getting selected on the strength of their contracts.

I know there are exceptions; folk have outlined them there. There is no need to list a couple and think it adds anything to the discussion. But I'd say for the most part he is correct. Or certainly was, when he played. It's loosened since then, thankfully. So much the better. But this place has been consistently frustrated by the constant selection of guys like O'Mahony and Murray when they've been poo.

[Deleted User]

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

He's really not, but he has 35 caps, and you don't need to be a nuclear physicist to know that your mates and fellas you play with are getting selected on the strength of their contracts.

I know there are exceptions; folk have outlined them there. There is no need to list a couple and think it adds anything to the discussion. But I'd say for the most part he is correct. Or certainly was, when he played. It's loosened since then, thankfully. So much the better. But this place has been consistently frustrated by the constant selection of guys like O'Mahony and Murray when they've been poo.

Well the exceptions prove that there is no rule

D15er

Deleted User wrote: »

Stephen Ferris on the rugby pod said that anyone on a central contract will always get called up to the Ireland squad. Is this 100% true? Was Ron Kearney dropped whilst still on a central contract?

Was he talking about anyone in particular?

It's not that surprising. IRFU are very choosy about who gets a central contract, it's really only established international regulars who get one.

I don't think there's anyone on a central contract who doesn't deserve to be in the squad.

Buer

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

He's really not, but he has 35 caps, and you don't need to be a nuclear physicist to know that your mates and fellas you play with are getting selected on the strength of their contracts.

I know there are exceptions; folk have outlined them there. There is no need to list a couple and think it adds anything to the discussion. But I'd say for the most part he is correct. Or certainly was, when he played. It's loosened since then, thankfully. So much the better. But this place has been consistently frustrated by the constant selection of guys like O'Mahony and Murray when they've been poo.

I was poking fun a bit. It's not really a rule. There's innate conservatism in Irish rugby and I think that's more to blame than any central deal.

Even when Ferris was playing, there were guys in the Irish 23 who not only weren't on central deals, they weren't playing in Ireland!

salmocab

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

He's really not, but he has 35 caps, and you don't need to be a nuclear physicist to know that your mates and fellas you play with are getting selected on the strength of their contracts.

I know there are exceptions; folk have outlined them there. There is no need to list a couple and think it adds anything to the discussion. But I'd say for the most part he is correct. Or certainly was, when he played. It's loosened since then, thankfully. So much the better. But this place has been consistently frustrated by the constant selection of guys like O'Mahony and Murray when they've been poo.

Ah in fairness the people getting central contracts are in general getting picked for the same reason they got a central contract. They are some of the best players in the country. In fairness some have lost form but I’m not sure too many expect them to miss out on squads whatever about the starting XV. He’s correct that people on central contracts are going to get picked for Ireland squads just not for the reason he thinks.

Buer

Le Roux not cited and is free to face Ireland. Not too surprised. Looked like a cheap shot but, based on the angles and footage available, it was going to be tricky to really make a concrete call.

[Deleted User]

D15er wrote: »

Was he talking about anyone in particular?

It's not that surprising. IRFU are very choosy about who gets a central contract, it's really only established international regulars who get one.

I don't think there's anyone on a central contract who doesn't deserve to be in the squad.

It was directly in relation to Cooney getting a late call up and Murray guaranteed his spot despite his wavering form over the past two years. I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting Murray shouldn't even make the squad.

Paul Smeenus

salmocab wrote: »

Ah in fairness the people getting central contracts are in general getting picked for the same reason they got a central contract. They are some of the best players in the country. In fairness some have lost form but I’m not sure too many expect them to miss out on squads whatever about the starting XV. He’s correct that people on central contracts are going to get picked for Ireland squads just not for the reason he thinks.

I understand exactly what you mean. But maybe we should expect them to miss out when not playing well. Might lead to sharper improvements in form when players aren't delivering.

But then, I wouldn't have been criticising much about the set-up in 2018, so...

Clegg

https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1321427195877875713?s=19

Yeah_Right

Deleted User wrote: »

It was directly in relation to Cooney getting a late call up and Murray guaranteed his spot despite his wavering form over the past two years. I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting Murray shouldn't even make the squad.

I was. I wanted him dropped from the Munster 23 because he was stinking the place up so badly.

Last week was an improvement but I still don't think he should be starting. Or even in the match day 23.

awec

That bench is fairly weak.

thomond2006

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I was. I wanted him dropped from the Munster 23 because he was stinking the place up so badly.

Last week was an improvement but I still don't think he should be starting. Or even in the match day 23.

Dropped from the Munster 23 for Nick McCarthy? Yeah...no.

AbusesToilets

Farrell a bit of a curious option for a bench spot. He only plays in the center, right?

P.Walnuts

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Farrell a bit of a curious option for a bench spot. He only plays in the center, right?

If a Winger/FB gets injured we can rejig with Henshaw fairly easily, I imagine thats the reasoning.

Podge_irl

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

I understand exactly what you mean. But maybe we should expect them to miss out when not playing well. Might lead to sharper improvements in form when players aren't delivering.

But then, I wouldn't have been criticising much about the set-up in 2018, so...

The reason they are not missing out is not to do with any rule around central contracts though. Irish rugby has always and forever been fairly conservative selection wise.

Justaburner

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Farrell a bit of a curious option for a bench spot. He only plays in the center, right?

Would have thought Earls would be a better option. Covers centre, wings and FB. Odd (assuming hes not still injured).