FrancieBrady wrote: » There is no conflict/war for over 20 years now mark.
markodaly wrote: »
FrancieBrady wrote: » One of the tragedies of the conflict/war, essentially there was no trusted police force and communities sought to police themselves.
markodaly wrote: » You are hilarious. Members of a paramilitary organisation who kill a man outside a city centre pub: Threatened the bar staff. Seized the CCTV footage from the pub Intimidated people who were in the pub so much so that most of the people there said they were in the toilet at the time. Told people not to call an ambulance Organised a riot after the incident as to delay the police investigation Foresnecially cleaned the pub after the attack .. .. and then spread rumours and falsehoods about the McCartneys in the Short Strand area have no control over a community? Are you for real?
Tell me Francie, why did Gerry Adams preside over a kangaroo court when Martina Cahill was sexually assaulted.
Why did SF/PIRA at the time exile sexual abusers to the Republic instead of handing them over to the police?
Why were there hundreds, if not thousands of punishment beatings in these communities over the decades?
I never said SF controlled communities. Please quote me.
FrancieBrady wrote: » Yes, is that not evidence of 'attempted' control (witnesses did come forward and testified = fact) of a small amount of people in a 'city centre' bar? Seems like that to me anyhow. I see the story on the CCTV has changed...good to see it, even if you hadn't the balls to admit you sensationalised that story too. There was a cover up by criminals of a despicable crime...never denied by me.
EVIDENCE that SF are controlling communities.
markodaly wrote: » Did they also offer to shot the IRA scumbags that killed Robert McCarthey? Was that in the court transcripts?
Oh yea, there was no intimidation or control at all in this situation. Even though all 71 people who were in the pub at the time, claimed to be in the toilet when the attack happened, they threatened the bar staff, stopped anyone from calling an ambulance, took CCTV video tapes from the bar and when the PSNI arrived, gets some youngsters to start a riot... Par of the course in the small world of your average street crime and hustler :D:D
You seem hell-bent on trying to win this debate by mere semantics. Was the killing of Robert McCarthy your average assault by common thugs or was it much more sinister? Its a simple question France.
Clearly not enough people gave enough evidence as there was never a conviction. This is organised crime/Mafia/IRA tactic 101. That is why the special criminal court exists here in the south. And no one has been convicted of it. Yet here you are defending the official SF/IRA narrative, as always. SF can never do anything wrong in your world, ever!! Even in this case, they probably did the best they could... am I right?:rolleyes:
FrancieBrady wrote: » Brendan Devine told the court that he met 3 senior IRA men, one of them Brendan Bik McFarlane and they told him to tell the truth about what happened. Look it up Mark, it is in the court transcripts.
You probably won't because you want to maintain a line here of intimidation and control.
At the trial of one of the accused a 'CCTV' film was shown of him on the street after the attack. 'Taking all the CCTV tapes from the 'area' really??? Is this the same definition of an area as in 'controlling an area'?
People gave evidence when accused came to trial.
I don't and never have supported the IRA. I think the murder of McCartney and Quinn were obscene acts. But the criminals who carried them out are responsible for them.
Truthvader wrote: » Beginning to wonder to Francie and the lads actually believe their own nonsense. Do they really think that no-one can tell the difference between a real Sinn Fein/IRA permission to go to the Guards/ police (Aaronn Brady) and the usual "We would urge anyone with information to go to the police" while the intimidation is organised in the background and private visits to Sinn Fein/IRA leaders result in the usual "advice" to go to the police" followed up by the "observation" that there would of course be real anger in "the community" and so ..... you know yourself ; but we would of course "urge you to go to the police" The ridiculous funeral for Bobby Storey let everyone know where the reality is
blanch152 wrote: » I suppose you could say that anyone who supports the GFA is a unionist then, as they support the current wish of the people of Northern Ireland to remain part of the UK.
blanch152 wrote: » Once again, you have provided proof of a SF/IRA witness seeking permission so that they can tell the truth. On the question of control and intimidation, Q.E.D.
McMurphy wrote: » How many members of the orange order are from the Republic, I'm sure they describe themselves as unionists?
FrancieBrady wrote: » Brendan Devine told the court that he met 3 senior IRA men, one of them Brendan Bik McFarlane and they told him to tell the truth about what happened. Look it up Mark, it is in the court transcripts. .
markodaly wrote: » You mean the IRA offered to shot those responsible? :rolleyes::pac: I remember when that was reported. Even normal supporters of SF were aghast at such an 'offer' but it goes to show how these people think. SF/IRA. Not a normal party.
These IRA scumbags organised a riot after the murder, which gave them time to clean up after their murder and forensically clean the premise, including threatening the bar staff and taking all CCTV tapes from the area.
Common criminals generally do not have this power or hold over a community. Perhaps the Mafia and places of highly violent organised crime. To be honest Francie, your ardent support of IRA murders is puzzling. Why do you support men and people like this? You may think you are fighting the good fight but you are doing anything but. So, the IRA were nothing more than a group of common criminal scumbags? I can agree with that.
FrancieBrady wrote: » ' McCartney's friend also testified that he met with senior IRA members who told him to tell the truth about what happened. You may have missed that in your outrage.
Unless I am mistaken a city centre 'pub' is not an area or a community. So I am still waiting on evidence that SF are 'controlling' areas.
When the police launched the murder investigation they were met with a "wall of silence"; none of the estimated seventy or so witnesses to the altercation came forward with information.[5][6][7][8] In conversations with family members, seventy-one potential witnesses claimed to have been in the pub's toilets at the time of the attacks. As the toilet measures just four feet by three feet,[9] this led to the toilets being dubbed the TARDIS, after the time machine in the television series Doctor Who, which is much bigger on the inside than on the outside
I have already said that ex members of the IRA control those they associate with, like any criminal gang.
FrancieBrady wrote: » 'What about' some evidence that SF are 'controlling areas'? Which that isn't. That is criminals murdering somebody and telling people to stay quiet. Witnesses didn't come forward at first but did eventually and gave evidence against 3 men charged. McCartney's friend also testified that he met with senior IRA members who told him to tell the truth about what happened. You may have missed that in your outrage. Unless I am mistaken a city centre 'pub' is not an area or a community. So I am still waiting on evidence that SF are 'controlling' areas. I have already said that ex members of the IRA control those they associate with, like any criminal gang.
markodaly wrote: » Oh really? I think you need to remind yourself of what happened when Robert McCarthy was murdered outside a pub by some local IRA scumbags.https://www.irishexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/arid-10039680.html IRA heroes!! :rolleyes::rolleyes: I will await your 'whatabout' retort.
FrancieBrady wrote: » Whoever killed them is NOT evidence of SF controlling areas. It was a lazy journalistic trope when first used and is still one today.
On January 31, he was out for the night with a friend, Brendan Devine. They called into a city centre pub for a pint on their way to a birthday party. In the pub there happened to be some IRA members, including a local commander who had previously had a low level run-in with Devine. On the pretext of alleging he had insulted some women in their company, a group including the IRA commander picked on Devine and, when McCartney intervened, they were both attacked. They were taken outside and beaten with sewer rods and set upon with a knife. Devine had his throat slit and is still seriously ill in hospital. McCartney sustained a stab wound to the stomach and he died of his injuries the next day. After they had left the two injured men outside, the IRA group returned to the pub and engaged in some kind of forensic cleaning of the scene of the assault. They also ordered everyone in the pub not to make phone calls - not even for an ambulance - and threatened that if anyone told of what had happened, all would be severely punished. There were more than 70 people in the pub, many of whom would have been able to identify some of those involved. However, the Northern media say that, to date, no official statements have been made to the police by anyone in the pub on the night.
jh79 wrote: » How can someone from the Republic be an Unionist? If there is a border poll i'll be in a Republic either way.
jh79 wrote: » But the Republic remains as it is. Only "Union" is with the EU. How can i be a unionist when there is no union for me? My status doesn't change. At least partitionist makes sense.
FrancieBrady wrote: » People in the south who wish to see the Union of Northern Ireland and Britain maintained. Not that hard to understand.
Truthvader wrote: » 100% correct and that goal is to call out your slithering weaseling lies and justfications every time
FrancieBrady wrote: » And deflect. Conor Murphy has been open about what he did. The police obviously attach no evidential value to that, or they already know who he spoke with. Plain to see that you have only one goal here.
blanch152 wrote: » Why should it be left up to the police? They can't just go arrest someone and question them without evidence, and you know that. Paul Quinn's family have called on Conor Murphy to do the right thing and volunteer a statement. They are absolutely right. Conor Murphy is shirking his civic duty, he is a disgrace to politics. As the last line of that Magill article put it: "When Sinn Fein endorsed the PSNI in January of 2007 it was said the Provisionals had crossed a Rubicon. It has another Rubicon to cross: accountability for IRA criminality." If he has any decency in him, Conor Murphy could do that. I guess we will be waiting though.
blanch152 wrote: » You are a partitionist when it suits you.
FrancieBrady wrote: » Have you just ignored the question I asked you? Why have the police not arrested and charged Murphy if they believe he is withholding evidence of value, or is it you who has decided (for your own point scoring) it has value?
FrancieBrady wrote: » They are my government, I will criticise and praise as I see fit without any attempted censorship from you. What I have NOT done is engage in the sick fingerpointing at somewhere else in the same situation as us, i.e.- severe difficulty (Level 5 here...as high as the plan goes)> If you can find a post where I have pointed at somewhere else (that is ANYWHERE else) in order to score some cheap political points, do so. Ah, and there is the arrogant, 'we will not be told' sthick out again.
blanch152 wrote: » Did you read the quote from Conor Murphy in the article? "Conor Murphy, the local Sinn Fein MP, quickly articulated Sinn Fein's position. “There are wild and baseless allegations being made,” he said referring to the family's assertions and others in Cullyhanna that the IRA was involved. “However, I do not believe that there is any Republican involvement in this murder.” It is an excellent example of how the narrative shifts as the lies are found out. In that quote he is saying there is no Republican involvement, a decade later and it is the IRA were not involved. It is truly nauseating how they behave, the likes of Conor Murphy being no better than the people who administered the beating.
Truthvader wrote: » Why do you persist with this stupidity See yet another link below as to who was responsible - and don't bother us with your usual drivel about "actions" being unauthorised or unsanctioned or without the knowledge of the leadership as if Sinn Fein IRA and their leadership were some kind of honourable organisation led by prudent and reliable gentlemen whose word can be relied on rather than a corrupted gang of killers and thugs routinely lying as matter of course. Do you really think anyone pays the slightest attention to what the likes of Gerry Adam or Slab might say from time to time - or "P O'Neil" who doesn't even exist. Paul was murdered by local IRA scum as you yourself well knowhttps://magill.ie/archive/murder-impunity
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